Demonic possession Q's

  • Thread starter Thread starter sorrowfulagony
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
S

sorrowfulagony

Guest
Why do we need to go to a Bishop? Why just a priest?

Second, if somebody dies while possessed, what will happen to them?
 
sorrowfulagony said:
Why do we need to go to a Bishop? Why just a priest?
Click to expand...
From what I gather, not every priest has the training to be an Exorcist and because an exorcism isn’t something the Church does willy nilly. There are factors that need to be taken into consideration: mental health of the person claiming posession, etc.
sorrowfulagony said:
Second, if somebody dies while possessed, what will happen to them?
Click to expand...
It depends on the state of the individuals soul. Not everyone who becomes possessed is evil or in a state of mortal sin.
 
Pfaffenhoffen said:
I do not believe in demoniac possessions.
Sorry…
Click to expand...
Well your disbelief would be incorrect if you profess to be a practicing Catholic. Cases of demonic possession are in the Bible where we see Christ expell demons and this power has been given to His Church to cast out demons in His name.
Catechism of the Catholic Church

[1673](javascript:openWindow(‘cr/1673.htm’)😉 When the Church asks publicly and authoritatively in the name of Jesus Christ that a person or object be protected against the power of the Evil One and withdrawn from his dominion, it is called exorcism. Jesus performed exorcisms and from him the Church has received the power and office of exorcizing.178 In a simple form, exorcism is performed at the celebration of Baptism. The solemn exorcism, called “a major exorcism,” can be performed only by a priest and with the permission of the bishop. The priest must proceed with prudence, strictly observing the rules established by the Church. Exorcism is directed at the expulsion of demons or to the liberation from demonic possession through the spiritual authority which Jesus entrusted to his Church. Illness, especially psychological illness, is a very different matter; treating this is the concern of medical science. Therefore, before an exorcism is performed, it is important to ascertain that one is dealing with the presence of the Evil One, and not an illness.179
Click to expand...
 
Pfaffenhoffen said:
I do not believe in demoniac possessions.
Sorry…
Click to expand...
The Bible does…


  1. *]At the Synagogue in Capernaum, Jesus exorcised an evil spirit [Mk 1:21-28] [Lu 4:31-37]
    *]Jesus exorcised the Canaanite woman’s daughter appears in Matthew 15:21-28 and Mark 7:24-30.
    *]Jesus exorcised the blind and mute man who appeared in Matthew 12:22-32, Luke 11:14-23 and Mark 3:20-30.
    *]Jesus exorcised a boy possessed by a demon in Matthew 17:14-21, Mark 9:14-29, Luke 9:37-49
    *]The miracle of Jesus exorcising at sunset appears in the Synoptic Gospels just after Healing the mother of Peter’s wife, namely in Matthew 8:16-17, Mark 1:32-34 and Luke 4:40-41. In this miracle Jesus heals people and drives out many demons who know he is Christ.
    *]The miracle of Jesus exorcising a mute appears in Matthew 9:32-34

    Jesus exorcising is all over the Bible.
 
Get a copy of “The Rite” by Matt Baglio. It’s a really great contemporary book on the subject of Exorcisms. I found it very thorough and readable.

I do believe possessions are real. While not common they are not as rare as we might think.
Stay with the Sacraments and follow the Lord as best you can!
 
Not all priest are trained in Exorcism, in fact most diocese try to have at least one Exorcist, but not all diocese are fortunate enough to have one.

I heard on Catholic radio recently that the USA has about 52 Exorcists, but most bishops will not reveal who those priests are to help with the privacy of those persons who need there services.
 
Pfaffenhoffen said:
I do not believe in demoniac possessions.
Sorry…
Click to expand...
Pfaff, I’m sorry to hear that. The church, the bible, and long standing holy tradition are unambiguous in this matter. The devil and his extraordinary activities including possession are as dogmatic and infallible as the real presence. It feels like a drop in the ocean in light of the above but I have personally witnessed possession and I give you my word it is as real as the sun the moon the world and the church. Christ said that those who came in his name would cast out demons and possession is a pan-human belief (Meaning that all long established cultures believe in it.)
 
For everybody jumping on Pfaffenhoffen, you are incorrect to do so. I am not aware of any de fide dogma related to demoniacal possession. To suggest that a Catholic must believe in such things is nonsense (apart from those that occur in the Bible, which is another matter entirely).
 
stanczyk said:
For everybody jumping on Pfaffenhoffen, you are incorrect to do so. I am not aware of any de fide dogma related to demoniacal possession. To suggest that a Catholic must believe in such things is nonsense (apart from those that occur in the Bible, which is another matter entirely).
Click to expand...
Fifth Session of the Holy and Ecumenical Council of Trent:
That our Catholic faith, without which it is impossible to please God, may, errors being purged away, continue in its own perfect and spotless integrity, and that the Christian people may not be carried about with every wind of doctrine; whereas that old serpent, the perpetual enemy of mankind, amongst the very many evils with which the Church of God is in these our times troubled, has also stirred up not only new, but even old, dissensions touching original sin, and the remedy thereof; the sacred and holy, ecumenical and general Synod of Trent,–lawfully assembled in the Holy Ghost, the three same legates of the Apostolic See presiding therein,–wishing now to come to the reclaiming of the erring, and the confirming of the wavering,–following the testimonies of the sacred [Page 22] Scriptures, of the holy Fathers, of the most approved councils, and the judgment and consent of the Church itself, ordains, confesses, and declares these things touching the said original sin:
  1. If any one does not confess that the first man, Adam, when he had transgressed the commandment of God in Paradise, immediately lost the holiness and justice wherein he had been constituted; and that he incurred, through the offence of that prevarication, the wrath and indignation of God, and consequently death, with which God had previously threatened him, and,*** together with death, captivity under his power who thenceforth had the empire of death, that is to say, the devil,*** and that the entire Adam, through that offence of prevarication, was changed, in body and soul, for the worse; let him be anathema.
Click to expand...
Emphasis mine. This is a dogmatic (De Fide) statement that not only does the devil exist, but that by original sin man is placed under his dominion. I can dig up a multitude of like quotes if you really need me to.
 
Pfaffenhoffen said:
I do not believe in demoniac possessions.
Sorry…
Click to expand...
You don’t have to and frankly, I don’t blame you.

They are not what Hollywood would have you think they are.

Also; it is far better to focus on Christ than look at the waves around you.

I hope you never have to believe in them; but you are way out of line to come on these threads belittling those who suffer or have had to suffer in witnessing such.
 
Inego_de_Loyola said:
Emphasis mine. This is a dogmatic (De Fide) statement that not only does the devil exist, but that by original sin man is placed under his dominion. I can dig up a multitude of like quotes if you really need me to.
Click to expand...
This isn’t about whether or not the devil exists, and certainly nothing Pfaff said implies a disbelief in the devil. But demoniacal possession of human beings in the present day is simply not a de fide dogma.
 
Credo_in_Deum said:
It depends on the state of the individuals soul. Not everyone who becomes possessed is evil or in a state of mortal sin.
Click to expand...
This is incorrect.

The devil can harass (demonic obession) people who are even in the state of grace. He cannot, however, possess an innocent subject without some condescension of their will. Hence the Apostle tells us to resist the devil and he will, with certainty, fly from us.

The example of Job is the one I usually use to demonstrate the difference between demonic obsession (at its worst) as opposed to actual possession.
 
stanczyk said:
This isn’t about whether or not the devil exists, and certainly nothing Pfaff said implies a disbelief in the devil. But demoniacal possession of human beings in the present day is simply not a de fide dogma.
Click to expand...
Catechism of the Catholic Church said:
1673 When the Church asks publicly and authoritatively in the name of Jesus Christ that a person or object be protected against the power of the Evil One and withdrawn from his dominion, it is called exorcism. Jesus performed exorcisms and from him the Church has received the power and office of exorcizing.178 In a simple form, exorcism is performed at the celebration of Baptism. The solemn exorcism, called “a major exorcism,” can be performed only by a priest and with the permission of the bishop. The priest must proceed with prudence, strictly observing the rules established by the Church. Exorcism is directed at the expulsion of demons or to the liberation from demonic possession through the spiritual authority which Jesus entrusted to his Church. Illness, especially psychological illness, is a very different matter; treating this is the concern of medical science. Therefore, before an exorcism is performed, it is important to ascertain that one is dealing with the presence of the Evil One, and not an illness.179
Click to expand...

Emphasis mine.

It is beyond doubt Fides Catholica, which shares the title of the highest degree of theological certainty with Fides Divina and De Fide Definita. We see it is clearly preached in the bible making it Fides Divina and that teaching is explicated in the ordinary magisterial teaching of the church in the Catechism making it Fides Catholica. That means that all Catholics must hold it as true or hold their silence on the matter.
 
Okay, I was asking mainly why it’s reserved for the priest…
 
1AugustSon7 said:
This is incorrect.

The devil can harass (demonic obession) people who are even in the state of grace. He cannot, however, possess an innocent subject without some condescension of their will. Hence the Apostle tells us to resist the devil and he will, with certainty, fly from us.

The example of Job is the one I usually use to demonstrate the difference between demonic obsession (at its worst) as opposed to actual possession.
Click to expand...
Edit: Interestingly enough I did find this; it was taken from the book “An Exorcist Tells His Story” by Fr.Gabriele Amorth, the chief exorcist of the Diocese of Rome:
"The lives of many saints include examples of this affliction. Among modern saints, I can cite two who have been beatified by Pope John Paul II: Father Giovanni Calabria and Sister Mary of Jesus Crucified (who was the first Arab to be beatified). In both cases, and without any human fault, they were subjected to periods of true satanic possession. During those periods, the two saints did and said things totally incompatible with their holiness without the least fault, because it was the devil who acted through their bodies" (p. 57).
Click to expand...
 
sorrowfulagony said:
Okay, I was asking mainly why it’s reserved for the priest…
Click to expand...
Actually, it is the Bishop’s, but is delegated to a priest trained in exorcism…and requires the bishop’s permission before an exorcism is performed.

To do an exorcism, it requires fasting, prayers, strength, prayer life…and because a priest is ordained, they have special charisms…that a layman do not posses…and to battle the devil…it could affect one’s life to.

Somebody mentioned the book The Rite…I suggest you read it…here is the prologue…stgemmagalgani.com/2009/05/exorcisms-intercession-of-st-gemma.html

In the prologue of a new book called “The Rite-The Making of an Exorcist” (2009- Random House/Doubleday Inc), journalist Matt Baglio describes an exorcism of a 35 year old woman named ‘Anna’ in Italy in 2005.

“The exorcism had been going on for the better part of an hour, and the strain was beginning to show on everyone. Should he continue?
Suddenly, the woman’s head turned, her eyes fixating on a spot near the far wall. ‘No!’ the demon said in a deep, guttural voice coming from deep within her-

“The one in black is here, the jinx!’
The exorcist felt a momentary ray of hope, knowing from past exorcisms that this was the demon’s code to describe Saint Gemma Galgani.
‘And, the little white one from Albania!’ the demon roared.
‘Mother Teresa of Calcutta?’ The exorcist asked.
The demon let fly a string of blasphemies in a rage, then his voice took on a mocking, childlike tone ‘Oh, look at them. Look at them! They are hugging and greeting each other!”
Then, back to a deep guttural rasp ‘Disgusting! Disgusting!’
To the woman lying on the table, the two figures appeared as if in a dream. Saint Gemma was dressed in her traditional black, and looked pretty much as she did in her twenties. Oddly, Mother Teresa also looked very young -perhaps only twenty five.”

A few minutes later, the late Pope John Paul II appeared, whom the demon mockingly called “Totus Tuus”, and then finally while “the woman felt awash in an incredible feeling of love, the figure of the Virgin Mary appeared before her, wrapped in a gold and white veil that covered half of her face. Watching in amazement as the figure approached, the woman was even more surprised to see that Mary was gazing at her tearfully.”

The appearence of the Blessed Mother seemed to make the demon more angry, but at the same time made him weaker, almost powerless. Momentarily coming back to her senses Anna said- “A tear from Mary is all it took,” before lapsing back into a trance.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top