Demonic possession Q's

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Credo_in_Deum said:
Well your disbelief would be incorrect if you profess to be a practicing Catholic. Cases of demonic possession are in the Bible where we see Christ expell demons and this power has been given to His Church to cast out demons in His name.
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It was different. They interpreted that way what we know it was a mental disease.
 
followingtheway said:
The Bible does…


  1. *]At the Synagogue in Capernaum, Jesus exorcised an evil spirit [Mk 1:21-28] [Lu 4:31-37]
    *]Jesus exorcised the Canaanite woman’s daughter appears in Matthew 15:21-28 and Mark 7:24-30.
    *]Jesus exorcised the blind and mute man who appeared in Matthew 12:22-32, Luke 11:14-23 and Mark 3:20-30.
    *]Jesus exorcised a boy possessed by a demon in Matthew 17:14-21, Mark 9:14-29, Luke 9:37-49
    *]The miracle of Jesus exorcising at sunset appears in the Synoptic Gospels just after Healing the mother of Peter’s wife, namely in Matthew 8:16-17, Mark 1:32-34 and Luke 4:40-41. In this miracle Jesus heals people and drives out many demons who know he is Christ.
    *]The miracle of Jesus exorcising a mute appears in Matthew 9:32-34

    Jesus exorcising is all over the Bible.
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  1. I know all of that.
    But it was their interpretation.
    The Bible says that the woman in menstruation must do this and that and we recognize that that a sign of old times.
    The Bible says many things that we now with science know that it is not true.
    No worry, what is important is Jesus Christ.
 
Inego_de_Loyola said:
Pfaff, I’m sorry to hear that. The church, the bible, and long standing holy tradition are unambiguous in this matter. The devil and his extraordinary activities including possession are as dogmatic and infallible as the real presence. It feels like a drop in the ocean in light of the above but I have personally witnessed possession and I give you my word it is as real as the sun the moon the world and the church. Christ said that those who came in his name would cast out demons and possession is a pan-human belief (Meaning that all long established cultures believe in it.)
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Sorry, I believe in guardian angels, who are stronger than the devil.
 
InspiritCarol said:
You don’t have to and frankly, I don’t blame you.

They are not what Hollywood would have you think they are.

Also; it is far better to focus on Christ than look at the waves around you.

I hope you never have to believe in them; but you are way out of line to come on these threads belittling those who suffer or have had to suffer in witnessing such.
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Sorry, I did not insult anybody. Period.
 
Bballer32 said:
Dude! Just ask any priest who is or was an exorcist and see what they say about your belief.

They happen, and they are freaky!! :eek:
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Non-Dude! I prefer to believe and pray to my guardian angel.
I think the devotion to the guardian angel is a bit lost.
Boy, they kick out any devil around.
Look for Fatima and the beautiful prayers that the Angel of Portugal taught us.
 
pablope said:
You should watch this documentary…it is the background to the movie…The Exorcist…youtube.com/watch?v=dDgoNlOn-hk

at least watch part 4, right around the 4 minute mark…pay special attention to what happens…youtube.com/watch?v=LZ-0lPNIBC4&feature=related
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Sorry, I do not believe.
That the devil goes inside a person ! What is he going to do there ?
I believe in a smart and clever devil that drives people through ways contrary to God, without showing his face.
I fear this devil that I cannot see. I fear and fear much.
I accept that people believe in possessions and I do not have anything against those beliefs, but as me, I do not believe.
Also, i may change opinion one day but, up to now, I see nothing…
 
Possession sure seems rare. I have never heard of any cases of possession except in the bible and in the movies.
 
Pfaffenhoffen said:
Non-Dude! I prefer to believe and pray to my guardian angel.
I think the devotion to the guardian angel is a bit lost.
Boy, they kick out any devil around.
Look for Fatima and the beautiful prayers that the Angel of Portugal taught us./QUOTE

The Gurdian angel is like your conscienc; the more you sin, the further away from them you get. They are always there that is for sure, but they can be abused when we sin making their impact on us weaker.

Now, I’m being serious here. Go ask a priest about exorcism and demonic possession. It is all real!!
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Pfaffenhoffen said:
Sorry, I do not believe.
That the devil goes inside a person ! What is he going to do there ?
I believe in a smart and clever devil that drives people through ways contrary to God, without showing his face.
I fear this devil that I cannot see. I fear and fear much.
I accept that people believe in possessions and I do not have anything against those beliefs, but as me, I do not believe.
Also, i may change opinion one day but, up to now, I see nothing…
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One more thing…

I think that this fear you speak of is what is causing you to not believe. You cannot, I repeat, CANNOT show the devil your fear, that is when he takes control or leads you the wrong way. Give this fear to the Lord! He uses it for Good!!

And you might as well believe it otherwise you really can’t call your self a TRUE Catholic. Being Catholic means believing in everything that is taught in the Church, which is Jesus Christ on Earth!
 
Pfaffenhoffen said:
Sorry, I did not insult anybody. Period.
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Ridicule and belittling *is *insult. Period.

To not believe is your own choice. What does it gain you to come on here and belittle those who do?

You do not know your bible well enough, it would seem. There is clear demarcation and delineation between those who are healed of sickness and those who are delivered from possession.
Example:
Matthew 4:23-25
Jesus went throughout Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, preaching the good news of the kingdom, and healing every disease and sickness among the people.
News about him spread all over Syria, and people brought to him all who were ill with various diseases, those suffering severe pain, the demon-possessed, those having seizures, and the paralyzed, and he healed them. Large crowds from Galilee, the Decapolis, Jerusalem, Judea and the region across the Jordan followed him.
Mark 1:33-34
The whole town gathered at the door, and Jesus healed many who had various diseases. He **also drove out many demons, **Matt. 10:5-8

These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: "Do not go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans. Go rather to the lost sheep of Israel. As you go, preach this message: ‘The kingdom of heaven is near.’ Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse those who have leprosy, drive out demons. Freely you have received, freely give.
Mark 16:15-18 & 20
He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the good news to all creation. Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues; they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all; they will place their hands on sick people, and they will get well.” … Then the disciples went out and preached everywhere, and the Lord worked with them and confirmed his word by the signs that accompanied it.

Additionally, it says of Judas : (John 13:27) As soon as Judas took the bread, Satan *entered into *him. “What you are about to do, do quickly,” Jesus told him,.
Or
(Luke 22:3) Then Satan *entered *Judas, called Iscariot, one of the Twelve.

This is not some form of pneumonia.

There is a great big world out there full of myriad inexplicables. These do not depend on your belief in order to be real. BUT, by belittling them to those who are going through such VERY REAL horrors, you (yes, you personally) are responsible for keeping some from seeking out the help they so desperately need. BTW Priests do not hesitate to work in conjunction with trained psychiatrists in these matters when necessary.

If your guardian angel is telling you to not believe in things taught in the bible and the catechism, you need to get yourself to a priest asap.

Pray for discernment.
 
InspiritCarol said:
Ridicule and belittling *is *insult. Period.
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Pfaff did not belittle or ridicule anybody in this thread. He simply expressed his disbelief in demoniac possession. Possession by demons is not a de fide dogma.

There is nothing that requires Catholics to believe in demon possession in the present day any more than Catholics are required to believe in private revelation.

As Pfaff rightly pointed out, the “demonic possessions” of the Bible are understood by historians today to be an ancient interpretation of what we today consider to be mental illness.
 
stanczyk said:
Pfaff did not belittle or ridicule anybody in this thread. He simply expressed his disbelief in demoniac possession. Possession by demons is not a de fide dogma.

There is nothing that requires Catholics to believe in demon possession in the present day any more than Catholics are required to believe in private revelation.
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Okay, let me break this out for you:

What is the purpose of coming on a thread like this to proclaim your opinion that such things do not happen? It was not *remotely *the question posed.
  1. It makes you feel better telling others that they are either psychologically unbalanced or delusional.
  2. It makes others embarrassed to even broach the subject.
If that does not fit your definition of belittling; please do tell me what will.

Let me tell you, my family and I suffered for years unaided by the church for this very reason.

You should be grateful that you have not been confronted by this kind of horror.

I NEVER said he had to believe it, I simply said: back off your high horse belittling YES *belittling *others who suffer from this.

As Pfaff rightly pointed out, the “demonic possessions” of the Bible are understood by historians today to be an ancient interpretation of what we today consider to be mental illness.
Have you read these “historian’s” analyses? I have, many. If you use your own brain and spirit instead of parroting others’ with an agenda you will see that this scenario does not hold water. You MUST qualify this severely to be remotely accurate. You must say *secular *historians who filter out intent and context.

Please read what I (and others) wrote before you belittle as well.

You may not have to believe it; but it’s clear from the Bible, Jesus believes it, the Apostles and Disciples believe it and; from the Catechism, the Church believes it as well. If you insist on denying something so attested to because secular historians (whose papers I doubt you even read) hold some opinion, and you’ve never seen it (that you’re aware of); I expect you may want to examine your focus in the world.

Sorry to sound harsh. I know of no gentle way of correcting this kind of arrogance.
-Carol
 
stanczyk said:
Pfaff did not belittle or ridicule anybody in this thread. He simply expressed his disbelief in demoniac possession. Possession by demons is not a de fide dogma.

**There is nothing that requires Catholics to believe in demon possession in the present day any more than Catholics are required to believe in private revelation.
**
As Pfaff rightly pointed out, the “demonic possessions” of the Bible are understood by historians today to be an ancient interpretation of what we today consider to be mental illness.
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Bibles, ecumenical councils, statements from the Catechism, papal teachings, and the unanimous examples of the saints all declare the truth of the devil and demonic possession. If you read the gospels it is a laughable notion that the people in question were merely mentally ill. They knew who Christ was and bewailed his coming; Jesus did not say be healed but, “be silent and come out of him.” How could Christ cast a thousand cases of paranoid schizophrenia into a herd of swine? What of the sons of sceva in acts 19? They were seven men; surely no amount of agoraphobia could give one man the strength to strip and beat seven. Christ knew what he was talking about when he said in Matthew 12,“43 And when an unclean spirit is gone out of a man he walketh through dry places seeking rest, and findeth none. Then he saith: I will return into my house from whence I came out. And coming he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished.Then he goeth, and taketh with him seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is made worse than the first. So shall it be also to this wicked generation.”

There can be no doubt in the mind of those faithful to God and his Church that the devil can, and whenever permitted will, possess the bodies of his victims.
 
Inego_de_Loyola said:
Bibles, ecumenical councils, statements from the Catechism, papal teachings, and the unanimous examples of the saints all declare the truth of the devil and demonic possession. If you read the gospels it is a laughable notion that the people in question were merely mentally ill. They knew who Christ was and bewailed his coming; Jesus did not say be healed but, “be silent and come out of him.” How could Christ cast a thousand cases of paranoid schizophrenia into a herd of swine? What of the sons of sceva in acts 19? They were seven men; surely no amount of agoraphobia could give one man the strength to strip and beat seven. Christ knew what he was talking about when he said in Matthew 12,“43 And when an unclean spirit is gone out of a man he walketh through dry places seeking rest, and findeth none. Then he saith: I will return into my house from whence I came out. And coming he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished.Then he goeth, and taketh with him seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is made worse than the first. So shall it be also to this wicked generation.”

There can be no doubt in the mind of those faithful to God and his Church that the devil can, and whenever permitted will, possess the bodies of his victims.
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Though I am sure you do not mean to imply that I haven’t read the Gospel, I should let you know that you are (no doubt unintentionally) coming off as extremely rude.

Though you may find it laughable, most historians today are unanimous in the opinion that ancient references to demonic possession refer to mental illness. This is not a reflection of my personal opinion, merely the mainstream academic view of the subject. No debate is necessary, as this is well settled.

Furthermore, there is no de fide dogma requiring Catholics to believe in demonic possession. Q. E. D.
 
sorrowfulagony said:
if somebody dies while possessed, what will happen to them?
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I am guessing the spirit will enter the next living body to host it. (Which is probably why on the trained ought to preform exorcisms).

The story of Jesus driving our Legion into the pigs, who went into the water and drowned, always interested me, because wouldn’t the demons have inhabited the fish?
 
I had an exorcism once. It wasn’t intended. It was Advent 2010 and I got the evening weekday mass time wrong. There were a couple small details that I don’t need to bore you all with, but the point is, it happened very fast, was slightly confusing, and all I knew what to say was, “thank you” after.
 
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