Denying a father to parent his child

[saintbtg]

I have a question. I don’t know all the details but I thought I would get some more “Catholic” advice before I talk to my friend. She is about to have a baby and she is unwed. The father is there and wants to be in the child’s life. He mother is trying to get her to not put the father’s name of any of the legal documents because she thinks if they break up then he would fight for custody. This seems so wrong to me! There has to be some Church teaching about this…right!!! I haven’t been able to find any. As far as I know, there is no danger to her or the baby if the father stays in her life. I know the grandmas don’t like each other and the father’s mom is very controlling and not Catholic, so I can understand needing to make sure the baby is raised in a good Catholic home. Still it seems very harsh to deny him the legal rights he has as this child’s father. Everyone seems to think it is such a great idea, to leave him out…am I alone in thinking it’s wrong?

 

[HouseArrest]

I have a question. I don’t know all the details but I thought I would get some more “Catholic” advice before I talk to my friend. She is about to have a baby and she is unwed. The father is there and wants to be in the child’s life. He mother is trying to get her to not put the father’s name of any of the legal documents because she thinks if they break up then he would fight for custody. This seems so wrong to me! There has to be some Church teaching about this…right!!! I haven’t been able to find any. As far as I know, there is no danger to her or the baby if the father stays in her life. I know the grandmas don’t like each other and the father’s mom is very controlling and not Catholic, so I can understand needing to make sure the baby is raised in a good Catholic home. Still it seems very harsh to deny him the legal rights he has as this child’s father. Everyone seems to think it is such a great idea, to leave him out…am I alone in thinking it’s wrong?

They should both consult lawyers. I don’t know if the law would deny him custody from not being on the birth certificate, but it’s not as though leaving him off erases his paternity.

 

[gh4]

Actually if he wants to get a lawyer, I’d bet a judge would order dna testing for the mother, father and the baby to determine if he is the father or not. I know that child services would do so if the mother wants child support. And just because his name is not on the birth certificate doesn’t mean that he’s not liable for child support either. And just because his name is not on the certificate doesn’t mean he cannot file for custody of the child at any time after the child is born.

 

[Eliza10]

Those reasons you mention, I agree, are all very wrong reasons to deny a father his rights to father. But then there are some fathers who are not psychologically able to father, who will use their “position” and “rights”, if granted, to control and manipulate the mother and the child. In a nearby suburb here, there was once father who asserted his rights to parent, and got partial custody even though the mother begged the court and gave good evidence he was abusive. Then he picked the girls up for his court-ordained visitation. He did not return on time and the mother as desperate but the police did nothing, wanting to protect father’s rights. The man had taken his elementary age girls camping, and shot them and killed them in their tent, before he shot himself.

Yes, a father should not be denied his rights but not everyone can/should be given fathering/mothering rights. Not every person who is given parenting rights who shouldn’t be given them will end up shooting their kids, but, there is other kinds of havoc bad parents abuse with if they are pathological. So if you don’t know the situation well you might best just pray that the right thing be done.

 

[1ke]

Yes, the Church has a teaching-- it is about not having sexual relations outside marriage.

This is one of the reasons why. In addition to offending God, it places an innocent baby in such a situation.

The right thing to do is for the couple to consider whether or not they can marry and raise their child together. If not, they should seriously consider adoption into a two parent family.

 

[Nimzovik]

Thank goodness the Father wants to be involved. How **great for the child. Daughters and sons need and crave their **biological **Father. That is how God created the family unit - yes?

Unfortunately, thanks to Modern Day Feminism, men are considered to a rather large extent as being disposable, **interchangeable **and replaceable. The poor man is going to have a very rough time of it! See here: youtube.com/watch?v=nZdil1Jy3l0 Men are generally disregarded when it comes to being able to exercise their rights to have access to their very own children.

It is due to these factors that the rapidly growing MRM’s are growing in the public consciousness as well as recognition of the their attendant grievances. When there is one day a** balanced equality,** perhaps the divorce rate will drop as well.

The very notion that a woman even entertains the idea that on a whim she is empowered to deny a Father his child is both revealing of todays ‘cultural bias against men,’ and heinous.

As** proof** of the Bias of which I speak here is this:

**Demographic Characteristics **
Mothers accounted for the majority of custodial parents (82.6 percent) while 17.4 percent were fathers, proportions statistically unchanged from 1994.

Page two.

Quoted from the unbiased U.S. Census Bureau. See here: census.gov/prod/2009pubs/p60-237.pdf

 

[HouseArrest]

Those reasons you mention, I agree, are all very wrong reasons to deny a father his rights to father. But then there are some fathers who are not psychologically able to father, who will use their “position” and “rights”, if granted, to control and manipulate the mother and the child. In a nearby suburb here, there was once father who asserted his rights to parent, and got partial custody even though the mother begged the court and gave good evidence he was abusive. Then he picked the girls up for his court-ordained visitation. He did not return on time and the mother as desperate but the police did nothing, wanting to protect father’s rights. The man had taken his elementary age girls camping, and shot them and killed them in their tent, before he shot himself.

Yes, a father should not be denied his rights but not everyone can/should be given fathering/mothering rights. Not every person who is given parenting rights who shouldn’t be given them will end up shooting their kids, but, there is other kinds of havoc bad parents abuse with if they are pathological. So if you don’t know the situation well you might best just pray that the right thing be done.

There certainly are many women who need to be afraid of their children’s fathers. There are probably more fathers who need to be worried about their children’s mothers’ boyfriends.

The OP doesn’t say anything particularly troubling about the father in this situation. It sounds more like she is manipulating the child’s life from the start.

The father can’t really be convicted on other fathers’ crimes.

 

[JackieMom]

Yes, the Church has a teaching-- it is about not having sexual relations outside marriage.

This is one of the reasons why. In addition to offending God, it places an innocent baby in such a situation.

The right thing to do is for the couple to consider whether or not they can marry and raise their child together. If not, they should seriously consider adoption into a two parent family.

Exactly this.

 

[Bruised_Reed]

I’m glad you are seeking information about this. What I offer isn’t from the Catechism but from experience.

Even if the father’s name is not on the birth certificate he can still go for custody and visitation of his child. Even before paternity is proven he could be granted visitation.

I’ll paint a picture for the interfering grandmother: the father stays out of the child’s life for a period of time. It may be because everyone told him he would never get custody so why fight it, or he’s immature and flakes out, or doesn’t have enough money to hire a lawyer or whatever. But after 1, 2, 3 or more years he pursues custody and visitation and it’s granted. If she refuses, the mother would be in contempt of court (and having that hanging over her head is not fun). And now this child has to become acquainted with a stranger. Everyone’s high emotions, negative things said when people think the child can’t hear them will make the situation worse.

It would be wise for both to speak with a lawyer about their rights and responsibilities and put the child’s needs first.

 

[Nimzovik]

There certainly are many women who need to be afraid of their children’s fathers. There are probably more fathers who need to be worried about their children’s mothers’ boyfriends.

The OP doesn’t say anything particularly troubling about the father in this situation. It sounds more like she is manipulating the child’s life from the start.

The father can’t really be convicted on other fathers’ crimes.

Bolding Mine:

True enough.

**Very **interesting and eye opening it is however, that society has conditioned us to such a degree that our ‘first association response’ is that women and men need to be afraid of other Men!

Things like this are only recently coming to light: youtube.com/watch?v=nCpr3hr0K30, then there is the weapon as described in this link here falsedvireports.com/ in the arsenal of the woman involved should she go that all too often tread route.

 

[Chantal25]

DNA test will be his signature.

I pray for this situation and for the child highest love and highest good. I pray for love to prevail and everyone walk the right path together. Amen

 

[The_Bucket]

Is it wrong to suggest that he drag her onto the Maury Povich Show?

 

[MarisaJean]

From personal experience to be honest she needs to do what she WANTS and not what her mother wants. My daughter’s father is on the birth certificate but in that state by signing the certificate doesn’t mean anything but claiming paternity of that child. In the fine print it clearly states the mother has full legal custody until a judge orders otherwise. He can go and file court papers for joint custody at any time weather he signed or didn’t sign the birth certificate. And one more thing, since they are not married the baby will automatically have the mothers last name and she will be the sole parent on the birth certificate at first. They will be sent a letter and at that time if she wants to add him or change / modify the baby’s name at all that is the time. I personally think both parents should be listen on the birth certificate, married or not because it is their child together despite any other situation going on and nothing will ever change that. Best of luck!

 

[JackieMom]

From personal experience to be honest she needs to do what she WANTS and not what her mother wants. My daughter’s father is on the birth certificate but in that state by signing the certificate doesn’t mean anything but claiming paternity of that child. In the fine print it clearly states the mother has full legal custody until a judge orders otherwise. He can go and file court papers for joint custody at any time weather he signed or didn’t sign the birth certificate. And one more thing, since they are not married the baby will automatically have the mothers last name and she will be the sole parent on the birth certificate at first. They will be sent a letter and at that time if she wants to add him or change / modify the baby’s name at all that is the time. I personally think both parents should be listen on the birth certificate, married or not because it is their child together despite any other situation going on and nothing will ever change that. Best of luck!

This must be a state by state thing. Here, the mother and father can be listed whether or not they are married and the baby can be given any last name the parent/s wish, including one that they have made up.

If the male part of the equation is not present at the birth the mother may elect to leave him off and indicate that the father is “unknown.” The father, wishing to have contact with the child, would then need to go petition the court for visitation or partial custody.

 

[Nimzovik]

First, thank you for coming here and God bless you for being such a good and caring friend! Clearly this situation has you concerned for the child and concern for doing the right thing in the eyes of God. You are a wonderful friend that is concerned about doing the moral thing, your pregnant friend can only benefit from having you in her life, please stay close to her.

As for your question please set those worries aside. To deny a father his rights is not as easy or simple as leaving his name off of a birth certificate, beleive me. A paternity test will determine fatherhood and the baby’s father can pursue visitation.

Right now your friend is pregnant, her hormones and emotions are probably all over the map, she is probably worried about her upcoming labor and delivery. Also on her mind is her future, she has a lot going on. In the midst of this she is under pressure from her mother to be dishonest and this poor unborn baby seems to be the pawn in a family feud. Show your friend love, love and more love. I think she needs that now more than anything, especially advice. The father can pursue visitation legally. Even if his name does wind up on the birth certificate he will probably need a lawyer anyway from the sounds of this family. God bless you.

The above is very wise.

IF there is any hope of strengthening the union of the father with the mother methinks this would be ideal. Children respond** best** to a caring biological Father. (Please understand that there are many grand adoptive Fathers as well.)

 

[severus68]

Yes, the Church has a teaching-- it is about not having sexual relations outside marriage.

This is one of the reasons why. In addition to offending God, it places an innocent baby in such a situation.

The right thing to do is for the couple to consider whether or not they can marry and raise their child together. If not, they should seriously consider adoption into a two parent family.

There could be a similar situation when married parents are divorcing.

 

[severus68]

Those reasons you mention, I agree, are all very wrong reasons to deny a father his rights to father. But then there are some fathers who are not psychologically able to father, who will use their “position” and “rights”, if granted, to control and manipulate the mother and the child. In a nearby suburb here, there was once father who asserted his rights to parent, and got partial custody even though the mother begged the court and gave good evidence he was abusive. Then he picked the girls up for his court-ordained visitation. He did not return on time and the mother as desperate but the police did nothing, wanting to protect father’s rights. The man had taken his elementary age girls camping, and shot them and killed them in their tent, before he shot himself.

Yes, a father should not be denied his rights but not everyone can/should be given fathering/mothering rights. Not every person who is given parenting rights who shouldn’t be given them will end up shooting their kids, but, there is other kinds of havoc bad parents abuse with if they are pathological. So if you don’t know the situation well you might best just pray that the right thing be done.

Agreed.

 

[severus68]

Thank goodness the Father wants to be involved. How **great for the child. Daughters and sons need and crave their **biological **Father. That is how God created the family unit - yes?

Unfortunately, thanks to Modern Day Feminism, men are considered to a rather large extent as being disposable, **interchangeable **and replaceable. The poor man is going to have a very rough time of it! See here: youtube.com/watch?v=nZdil1Jy3l0 Men are generally disregarded when it comes to being able to exercise their rights to have access to their very own children.

It is due to these factors that the rapidly growing MRM’s are growing in the public consciousness as well as recognition of the their attendant grievances. When there is one day a** balanced** equality, perhaps the divorce rate will drop as well.

The very notion that a woman even entertains the idea that on a whim she is empowered to deny a Father his child is both revealing of todays ‘cultural bias against men,’ and heinous.

As** proof** of the Bias of which I speak here is this:

**Demographic Characteristics **
Mothers accounted for the majority of custodial parents (82.6 percent) while 17.4 percent were fathers, proportions statistically unchanged from 1994.

Page two.

Quoted from the unbiased U.S. Census Bureau. See here: census.gov/prod/2009pubs/p60-237.pdf

Equality would be great. Look around the world, in the US. There is still much inequality still but basically in respect of omen. Your insistence on courts being biased does not make it true.

Modern Day feminism? Asking and “fighting” for equal opportunity, rights and just plain equality is just plain good.

 

[Nimzovik]

Equality would be great. Look around the world, in the US. There is still much inequality still but basically in respect of omen. Your insistence on courts being biased does not make it true.

Modern Day feminism? Asking and “fighting” for equal opportunity, rights and just plain equality is just plain good.

Bolding mine:

My insistence on the fact of bias against men in terms of child custody Think again. The prejudice of courts against men is universal. Aside from the** U.S.Census Bureau statistic **quoted above, there is this:

childcustody.factexpert.com/1370-custody-gender-bias.php and this:

electromagnetism.demon.co.uk/08094.htm and this:

wisconsinfathers.org/genderbias.htm and this:

michbar.org/journal/pdf/pdf4article329.pdf and this:

step-family-matters.20m.com/gbias.htm and this:

saveservices.org/2012/07/vawa-gender-bias-hurts-fathers-and-children/ and this:

youtube.com/watch?v=bquuAb3_iyY and this:

youtube.com/watch?v=3Tonvjv-fJQ and this:

youtube.com/watch?v=ZVCrisGXWFk

Yes **indeed **there is a culture of anti male bias against men on the part of the court system. Why do you think the News Media uses the term 'Dead Beat Dads’ instead of 'Dead Beat Parent?'

Thankyou for this oppurtunity to elevate the Social consciousness of Male issues.

 

[severus68]

Bolding mine:

My insistence on the fact of bias against men in terms of child custody Think again. The prejudice of courts against men is universal. Aside from the** U.S.Census Bureau statistic **quoted above, there is this:

childcustody.factexpert.com/1370-custody-gender-bias.php and this:

electromagnetism.demon.co.uk/08094.htm and this:

wisconsinfathers.org/genderbias.htm and this:

michbar.org/journal/pdf/pdf4article329.pdf and this:

step-family-matters.20m.com/gbias.htm and this:

saveservices.org/2012/07/vawa-gender-bias-hurts-fathers-and-children/ and this:

youtube.com/watch?v=bquuAb3_iyY and this:

youtube.com/watch?v=3Tonvjv-fJQ and this:

youtube.com/watch?v=ZVCrisGXWFk

Yes **indeed **there is a culture of anti male bias against men on the part of the court system. Why do you think the News Media uses the term 'Dead Beat Dads’ instead of ‘Dead Beat Parent?’

Thankyou for this oppurtunity to elevate the Social consciousness of Male issues.

Perhaps you can explain to us how those are authoritative. I looked at 3 and did not find so.

Which court system? Yes, court systems are not perfect but that does not mean they are biased.