DeVos booed speaking at historically black university

[stinkcat_14]

Indeed.

I’m kind of baffled by those who are claiming that these students simply have “bad manners” because they booed a woman who disrespected their institution. I want my children to have manners, surely. But if it’s a toss-up between standing up to a public mischaracterization of themselves by a government official and using good manners, I’ll take the former every time.

Other than what she said about HBCUs in general, which reasonable people can differ in the interpretation of her remarks, how has she disrespected their institution?

If she really did disrespect their institution, what kind of administrator would have invited her to speak in the first place?

 

[gracepoole]

Other than what she said about HBCUs in general, which reasonable people can differ in the interpretation of her remarks, how has she disrespected their institution?

If she really did disrespect their institution, what kind of administrator would have invited her to speak in the first place?

I don’t believe she needed to say anything more than what she said previously about HBCUs for these students to be offended. Reasonable people may differ in their interpretations of her remarks, but it’s clear that these students felt disrespected. As for why she was invited, I’ve no idea. But it was a monumentally bad choice.

 

[stinkcat_14]

I don’t believe she needed to say anything more than what she said previously about HBCUs for these students to be offended. Reasonable people may differ in their interpretations of her remarks, but it’s clear that these students felt disrespected. As for why she was invited, I’ve no idea. But it was a monumentally bad choice.

The first and foremost job of any college administrator is to make sure that their poor snowflakes are ever offended. God forbid they might be exposed to someone different from themselves.

 

[jesucated]

College student stereotypes perhaps. But the idea of accusing college students of being drunk as racist is absurd beyond belief.

To point out that spuriously saying a group of young black people are poorly brought up/educated, lack class, and are likely drunk draws on a framework of racist rhetoric in USAmerican history is not “absurd.” If we added in “lascivious” we’d have the basic recipe for Birth of a Nation.

I’m not saying that the poster necessarily was trying to do all of this, but in cases like this intent is irrelevant. One cannot reasonably claim excusable ignorance about these things in the modern world.

 

[gracepoole]

The first and foremost job of any college administrator is to make sure that their poor snowflakes are ever offended. God forbid they might be exposed to someone different from themselves.

You’ve accepted the “snowflake” narrative a bit too easily, my friend. I don’t know any snowflakes among my students. I do know plenty, however, who are the first in their families to attend college, vets using the GI bill, students working full-time while attending classes, parents raising children while getting an education…

These students aren’t “snowflakes” because they raised their voices against DeVos. They didn’t run off to find some play-doh and a juice box. They faced her and responded to her vocally.

 

[Questioner2]

Good for those students! Why did only half turn their backs?

What an outrage that this enemy of public education was chosen to speak. Especially at an HBCU.

How dare she show her face? These students have every right to express their indignation using every means of peaceful protest they can. I am encouraged by and proud of their actions.

The kids are all right!

 

[stinkcat_14]

To point out that spuriously saying a group of young black people are poorly brought up/educated, lack class, and are likely drunk draws on a framework of racist rhetoric in USAmerican history is not “absurd.” If we added in “lascivious” we’d have the basic recipe for Birth of a Nation.

I’m not saying that the poster necessarily was trying to do all of this, but in cases like this intent is irrelevant. One cannot reasonably claim excusable ignorance about these things in the modern world.

All of these adjectives apply very well to your typical college population. I have taught college students for decades and some are poorly brought up, some lack class and drinking is a serious problem. Just because some college students have a particular skin pigmentation does not make them different than the rest. To suggest that we ought not use certain adjectives based on skin pigmentation is absurd.

 

[Wedge_Antilles]

To point out that spuriously saying a group of young black people are poorly brought up/educated, lack class, and are likely drunk draws on a framework of racist rhetoric in USAmerican history is not “absurd.” If we added in “lascivious” we’d have the basic recipe for Birth of a Nation.

I’m not saying that the poster necessarily was trying to do all of this, but in cases like this intent is irrelevant. One cannot reasonably claim excusable ignorance about these things in the modern world.

They can when they don’t know anyone who ascribes “drunk” as a stereotype to african-americans. You must travel in different circles.

You can claim offense at every comment made about a minority all you want, but that doesn’t mean anyone has to indulge your indignation.

 

[jesucated]

You’ve accepted the “snowflake” narrative a bit too easily, my friend. I don’t know any snowflakes among my students. I do know plenty, however, who are the first in their families to attend college, vets using the GI bill, students working full-time while attending classes, parents raising children while getting an education…

These students aren’t “snowflakes” because they raised their voices against DeVos. They didn’t run off to find some play-doh and a juice box. They faced her and responded to her vocally.

+1

 

[stinkcat_14]

You’ve accepted the “snowflake” narrative a bit too easily, my friend. I don’t know any snowflakes among my students. I do know plenty, however, who are the first in their families to attend college, vets using the GI bill, students working full-time while attending classes, parents raising children while getting an education…

These students aren’t “snowflakes” because they raised their voices against DeVos. They didn’t run off to find some play-doh and a juice box. They faced her and responded to her vocally.

I think it depends on what type of school you teach at. When I have taught at elite institutions there are plenty of snowflakes who get offended over every perceived slight. They are by and large bright students and they are smart enough to realize that college administrators often try to appease offended students.

At less elite institutions, I have found the students I teach are less concerned about politics. They are a product of their culture though, they seem to think that getting an F is some sort of discrimination and many of them think that they ought to be treated differently than everyone else. I would put part of the blame on their parents for the upbringing and part of the blame on our dysfunctional public school system.

 

[jesucated]

They can when they don’t know anyone who ascribes “drunk” as a stereotype to african-americans. You must travel in different circles.

You can claim offense at every comment made about a minority all you want, but that doesn’t mean anyone has to indulge your indignation.

It’s not a matter of circles I move in. It’s a matter of taking the time to study history. If you limit your knowledge of the world to what you derive from the circles your move-in, then you are doomed to ignorance.

 

[gracepoole]

I think it depends on what type of school you teach at. When I have taught at elite institutions there are plenty of snowflakes who get offended over every perceived slight. They are by and large bright students and they are smart enough to realize that college administrators often try to appease offended students.

At less elite institutions, I have found the students I teach are less concerned about politics. They are a product of their culture though, they seem to think that getting an F is some sort of discrimination and many of them think that they ought to be treated differently than everyone else. I would put part of the blame on their parents for the upbringing and part of the blame on our dysfunctional public school system.

I’ve taught at four institutions, including universities and community colleges. And honestly none of what you described here accurately describes the majority of students at any of them. A few outliers? Sure. But most definitely not the majority. I think it’s dangerous to make sweeping generalizations about college students.

I would rather teach students who speak up when offended than those who see what they believe is an injustice and do nothing so they aren’t accused of being snowflakes.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Good for those students! Why did only half turn their backs?

What an outrage that this enemy of public education was chosen to speak. Especially at an HBCU.

How dare she show her face? These students have every right to express their indignation using every means of peaceful protest they can. I am encouraged by and proud of their actions.

The kids are all right!

Assuming she really is an “enemy” of public education, one needs to remember this was a private school. And she “dared to show her face” because she was invited by the school.

And (apparently) half the students did not turn their backs, and good for them. Hopefully the others will learn without too much trouble, that being ill-mannered gets one nowhere in life.

 

[jesucated]

All of these adjectives apply very well to your typical college population. I have taught college students for decades and some are poorly brought up, some lack class and drinking is a serious problem. Just because some college students have a particular skin pigmentation does not make them different than the rest. To suggest that we ought not use certain adjectives based on skin pigmentation is absurd.

With respect, I think you’re missing the point.

One can certainly use any of these adjectives to describe individual students regardless of race or ethnicity. However, when someone says that an group of students (and in this case black students at an HBCU making a stand on a race related issue) who are doing something that person disapproves of is likely doing so for reasons that have long been associated with negative racial stereotypes, this is a different issue altogether.

The poster offered no evidence for the claims. Rather, the poster lumped together a group of black students and then used long-standing racist tropes to describe/explain their actions.

 

[gracepoole]

Assuming she really is an “enemy” of public education, one needs to remember this was a private school. And she “dared to show her face” because she was invited by the school.

And (apparently) half the students did not turn their backs, and good for them. Hopefully the others will learn without too much trouble, that being ill-mannered gets one nowhere in life.

Yeah, being ill-mannered certainly did nothing for Rosa Parks.

 

[stinkcat_14]

Yeah, being ill-mannered certainly did nothing for Rosa Parks.

Somehow the oppression of listening to Betsy seems to be minor compared to what Rosa Parks was fighting against. Of course, they learn to fight massive battles against minor issues from their professors. Professors do little else than fight over minor trivial issues.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Somehow the oppression of listening to Betsy seems to be minor compared to what Rosa Parks was fighting against. Of course, they learn to fight massive battles against minor issues from their professors. Professors do little else than fight over minor trivial issues.

Possibly I’m wrong, but to my understanding, Rosa Parks was perfectly well-mannered in her refusal to go to the back of the bus. She did nothing rude to anyone.

I’ll add that the students who booed and turned their backs were also rude and disrespectful to the school administrators who invited Ms. DeVos to speak. What an embarrassment for them it had to be.

 

[stinkcat_14]

Possibly I’m wrong, but to my understanding, Rosa Parks was perfectly well-mannered in her refusal to go to the back of the bus. She did nothing rude to anyone.

I’ll add that the students who booed and turned their backs were also rude and disrespectful to the school administrators who invited Ms. DeVos to speak. What an embarrassment for them it had to be.

You may well be right, I have never read anything that suggested Rosa Parks was rude in anyway. I was just pointing out the silliness of comparing these students to Rosa Parks. These students really are not fighting against oppression in any way.

 

[gracepoole]

Possibly I’m wrong, but to my understanding, Rosa Parks was perfectly well-mannered in her refusal to go to the back of the bus. She did nothing rude to anyone.

I’ll add that the students who booed and turned their backs were also rude and disrespectful to the school administrators who invited Ms. DeVos to speak. What an embarrassment for them it had to be.

You think the whites on the bus thought Rosa Parks was being “perfectly well-mannered?” (Look up Claudette Colvin, who did the same as Parks before Parks and was charged with disorderly conduct, BTW.)

These students expressed themselves in a non-violent way. I’d characterize “rude and disrespectful” as encompassing a whole host of responses well beyond booing and turning one’s back.

 

[jesucated]

I’ve taught at four institutions, including universities and community colleges. And honestly none of what you described here accurately describes the majority of students at any of them. A few outliers? Sure. But most definitely not the majority. I think it’s dangerous to make sweeping generalizations about college students.

I would rather teach students who speak up when offended than those who see what they believe is an injustice and do nothing so they aren’t accused of being snowflakes.

+1

I’ve taught at four institutions as well and agree with everything you say here.