Devotion To Our Lady Is Necessary For Salvation

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Jesus said:------it is finished—once-----and-----for all! Now he sits at the right hand of the father and waits till his enemies who do not believe, become his footstool. Believe in "God’s word and accept his gift of eternal salvation offered to all----- God precious son, who paid our debts the debts we could never have paid for the price was too high! NO, Jesus did not die in vain. Now Worship God— obey him, believe in him and follow his commandments! Just has it is appointed that-----all humans will die ----once— and after this the judgement.

So I still ask is devotion to Our Lady Is Necessary for Salvation–I say No! for if I say— yes---- than I am calling God is a liar!

And I know our Dear Blessed Mother would not be honoured by me for----- my disobedience, rejecting God’s word as truth! Her precious son, whom she as a mother---- witness sorrowfully-----Her son---- who suffered the worst agony of death ever seen and witness to— for my sins and all! So that we could freely obtain his Holy precious gift of eternal life that I and all could never, never earn! All we gave to do is believe in the fullness of faith repent, be batized and obey the laws and commandments. It is our choice, what more do we need---- Worship God—our creator!

God Bless
 
planter654 said:
Jesus said:------it is finished—once-----and-----for all! Now he sits at the right hand of the father and waits till his enemies who do not believe, become his footstool. Believe in "God’s word and accept his gift of eternal salvation offered to all----- God precious son, who paid our debts the debts we could never have paid for the price was too high! NO, Jesus did not die in vain. Now Worship God— obey him, believe in him and follow his commandments! Just has it is appointed that-----all humans will die ----once— and after this the judgement.

So I still ask is devotion to Our Lady Is Necessary for Salvation–I say No! for if I say— yes---- than I am calling God is a liar!

And I know our Dear Blessed Mother would not be honoured by me for----- my disobedience, rejecting God’s word as truth! Her precious son, whom she as a mother---- witness sorrowfully-----Her son---- who suffered the worst agony of death ever seen and witness to— for my sins and all! So that we could freely obtain his Holy precious gift of eternal life that I and all could never, never earn! All we gave to do is believe in the fullness of faith repent, be batized and obey the laws and commandments. It is our choice, what more do we need---- Worship God—our creator!

God Bless
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If you really love our Lord our God, then you will fulfill the ten commandments as Jesus have completely fulfilled it. The first commandment in terms with human relations is to honor your mother and your father. Honor our Father in heaven, but also honor our mother in heaven as well. Honor in Hebrew is “Kaboda” which means to bestow glory. We bestow glory, the kind of glory the Jesus bestows upon His mother. Jesus loved his mother so much…I wonder how one can say that that I love you but I don’t love your mother. Just you Jesus. That is just odd. And to me, kinda twisted.

You cannot have Jesus as your King and if you will not have Mary as your Queen.

Devotion is defined as “Feelings of ardent love”. If you really want to imitate Christ in your life. Then honor the ones he bestowed honor upon.

God is a family.
 
Devotion to our Lady is— "Nescessary for Salvation-----No! is my answer.

When we “Worship God” who created us all in Heaven—all share in that joy and honour even our Dear Mother. When “one little part of the body suffeers” the — the “whole body suffers” and shares in that suffering! Even our Dear Mother!

God is our creator and the creator of all things. In heaven I believe we are “whole one body” Holy Family of God! Our Holy Mother said YES! to God. Let us all say yes to God, thus much, much honuor and joy is given to our Mother. Our Holy Mother would never want to take away or lesson the Glory of her son! What mother would do that?

I am a mother---- when my usband the “Father” of our children is deeply loved, honoured, obeyed, respected, served by our children, I am filled with "LOVE joy, peace honoured also and share in this great love, joy and peace! When my husband suffers I suffer also! When my children suffer I suffer also! The father is the head over the family that is the way God created it! God is a God of order not confusion!

Each have a role in the unity of the family. God is a God of order! All pray and all love one another.Their is a Head! Jesus said: If you ask me anything in my name it shall be giving to you! If it is the will of the Father and if the Father thinks it is good not evil.

The father knows all things and all things come in God’s time. Wait upon the Lord. Worship God and quit causing our dear Mother so much sorrow! Do has he tells you!

All who “Worhip God” our “Father” gives our love of untiy and -------------devotion to all who Love the Father, God our Creator--------Jesus Christ, our Mother all our Holy Saints and those who came before us our ancestors who served and “Worship God” Our Mother knows we dearly Love her when we obey and Worship our Holy Father!

God Bless—just my personal relationship with Jesus Christ and My Holy Family!
 
It’s funny though,

I have a personal relationship with my personal car mechanic. But it doesn’t mean that he is a part of my family.

😉
 
don’t you people think it sounds like planter has a devotion to Mary, and is not arguing against having a devotion to her, but arguing against the false statement that we cannot be saved without a devotion to her?
I think planters writing style may be a little strange and perhaps misleading at first read, but sounds to me as though she has a devotion to the BVM.
but the O.P. title is “Devotion To Our Lady Is Necessary For Salvation” …this is not a teaching of the church, unless one considers belief in the proclaimed Marian dogmas or attending mass on those days in her honor having a devotion…that is why in a previous post I asked the O.P. or any of you defending the statement what your definition of devotion is in light of that O.P. title and claim…see post #158
 
nilofc said:
If you really love our Lord our God, then you will fulfill the ten commandments as Jesus have completely fulfilled it. The first commandment in terms with human relations is to honor your mother and your father. Honor our Father in heaven, but also honor our mother in heaven as well. Honor in Hebrew is “Kaboda” which means to bestow glory. We bestow glory, the kind of glory the Jesus bestows upon His mother. Jesus loved his mother so much…I wonder how one can say that that I love you but I don’t love your mother. Just you Jesus. That is just odd. And to me, kinda twisted.

You cannot have Jesus as your King and if you will not have Mary as your Queen.

Devotion is defined as “Feelings of ardent love”. If you really want to imitate Christ in your life. Then honor the ones he bestowed honor upon.

God is a family.
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You are putting your words and thoughts into my mouth.My heart and soul you do not know or have been giving that authority to judge for God is my judge. Your words—if you really love? ----shame on you!

I do fulfill the ten commandments-- Worship God and there is no other God before me! Honour your father and mother and I do honour my father and Mother! And who is saying

And I need you to tell me Jesus loved his mother so?

Shame, shame on you! I did not say I did not Love MY Mother so!
Thank god he is our judge in the end and not mortal humans who seem to think they know ones heart and soul. For God is all seeing and all knowing!

And I never said Mary was not Queen of heaven who is twisted? Or I love the King but not the Queen?

Be careful what rolls off your tongue for you will be accountable for every word spoken!

I do not Honour My blessed Mother you said? I did not say that! Do not twist the truth to serve “your thoughts” thinking mere mortal that you know my heart and soul! I don’t not worry what mere mortals think of me buy fear God and what God thinks of me!

I thank God that he is my judge and you will too! For God loves us all dearly! Worship God! When we do so is not our Holy Mother not honoured also, loved, full of joy and pleased?

Your first mistake was to wonder! Adding your own twisted thoughts, for God knows they are not my and your pure intentions of how you replied back to me!

Ardent Love is “not about feelings” it is about the action of ardent love in serving obeying and in doing so we Worship God and when we Worship God do we not also Honour our Mother who Loves God etc. does she not also receive that Love, honour, devotion with the whole body of Christ?

God Bless peace to you with love!
 
peso73 said:
don’t you people think it sounds like planter has a devotion to Mary, and is not arguing against having a devotion to her, but arguing against the false statement that we cannot be saved without a devotion to her?
I think planters writing style may be a little strange and perhaps misleading at first read, but sounds to me as though she has a devotion to the BVM.
but the O.P. title is “Devotion To Our Lady Is Necessary For Salvation” …this is not a teaching of the church, unless one considers belief in the proclaimed Marian dogmas or attending mass on those days in her honor having a devotion…that is why in a previous post I asked the O.P. or any of you defending the statement what your definition of devotion is in light of that O.P. title and claim…see post #158
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Thank you and you have captured my pure love for our Mother. Yes you are correct when saying planters writing style may be a little strange and perhaps misleading, but I am not trying to be misleading . Like Paul I guess I could say I am hard to understand my message for me it is very difficult to put into words and I am no educated writer! Sorry, but I just can’t explain what Jesus is teaching me, it is within me in the right order in faith but very hard to put into words the deeper spiritual message.

Thank you very much, God has forgiven us our sins please belief that, accept that for it is The word of God! Jesus did not die in vain. We are dead to me as far has flesh goes, but use the deadness of our flesh to do good!

Love God Bless you peace. I Worship God and trust in God and my dear Mother knows I love her dearly!
 
I give praise, glory, in thanksgiving and in Worship God for give us such a beautiful Mother to Love. Yes Blessed Mary our Mother is Queen of Heaven.

Devotion To Our Lady is “Necessary” for Salvation------no that is my personal beliefs.

Little St. Theresa personal relationship with our Dear Mother said:

But little St. Theresa said. We know very well that the Blessed Virgin is Queen of heaven and earth, but she is more “Mother” than Oueen! And we should not say, on account of her prerogatives, that she supasses all the saints in glory just as the sun at its rising makes the stars disappear from sight.--------- My God!

My God! How strange that would be!----- A Mother who makes her children’s glory vanish!------- I myself (Theresa) think just the contrary. I belive she’ll increase the splendor of the elect very much.

It’s good to speak about her prerogatives, but we should not stop at this, and if, in a sermon, we are obliged from beginning to end to exclaim and say: Ah Ah!, we would grow tired! Who knows whether some soul would not reachthe point of feeling a certain estrangement from a creature so superior and would not say: If things are such, it’s better to go and shine as well as one is able in some little corner!

What the Blessed Virgin has more than we have is the -------------------------privilege of not being able to sin, she was exempt from the stain of original sin:--------- but on the other hand, she wasn’t as fortunate as wer are, since -----she----didn’t have a Blessed Virgin to LOVE! ------------------And this is one more sweetness for us and one less sweetness for her!

Also Saint Theresa said: I"d first make people understand how little is known by us about her ( Mary) life. I am sure that her real life, not her imagined life, I am sure was very simple!

They show her to us as unapproachable, but they should present her as imitable, bringing “out her virtues”, saying that she lived by “faith just like ourselves”, giving proofs of this from the Gospel, where we read: -----and they did not understand the words which He (Simeon) spoke to them

And that other no less mysterious statement:—" His father and mother marveled at what was said about him. ( Jesus)" This admiration presupposes a certain surprise, don’t you think so?

We shouldn’t say unlikely things or things we don’t know anything about! For example, that when she was very little, at the age of three, the Blessed Virgin went up to the Temple to offer herself to God, burning with sentiments of love and extraordinary fervor.-----------While perhaps she went there very simply out of —obedience to her parents.

Again, why say, with reference to the aged Simeon’s prophetic words, that the Blessed Virgin had the Passion of Jesus constantly before her mind from that moment onward? And a sword will pierce through you soul also, the old man said.-----It wasn’t for the present, you see, it was a general prediction for the future.

Little St. Theresa. How I would have loved to be a priest inorder to preach about the Blessed Virgin! One sermon would be sufficient to say everything I think about this subject.

God said she would be called “Blessed among all woman”

I love our Mother dearly!

God Bless
 
nilofc said:
It’s funny though,

I have a personal relationship with my personal car mechanic. But it doesn’t mean that he is a part of my family.

😉
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What I do know that God will not be mocked!

I don’t know your point is, or your personal thought in what you are saying. But I know my mechanic is my family so are my neighbours and others through out the nations whom I love for it is a commandment of God. Love thy neighbours as thy self. Love thy enemies and pray for them.
God Bless givng with love to you—peace for God loves us all dearly,for God is the creator of all things seen and not seen.
 
planter654 said:
Scott Hahan saying that Blessed Virgin Mary is the ark of the covenant. When saying salvation only through the devotion of Mary whom I love dearly, but this is what I believe in the word of God!

She is called the “Ark of the Convenant” BY THE CHURCH. It’s called foreshadowing. Things in the Old Testament foreshadowed the coming of Christ. The CHURCH is the authentic interpreter of scripture. How about you address this issue instread of continuously posting scripture quotes that you do not have the the jurisdiction to privately interpret? I really think we need to start here. We are not a Church that believes in privately interpreting scripture.
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planter654 said:
Devotion to our Lady is— "Nescessary for Salvation-----No! is my answer.

I think most of us here are saying not necessary but stupid to try without it. A very small minority can be saved without here because she’s a very important tool to learn to know Our Lord. We cannot serve and love Our Lord without knowing him and Mary is a very important key to understanding Him.
When we “Worship God” who created us all in Heaven—all share in that joy and honour even our Dear Mother. When “one little part of the body suffeers” the — the “whole body suffers” and shares in that suffering! Even our Dear Mother!
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peso73 said:
don’t you people think it sounds like planter has a devotion to Mary, and is not arguing against having a devotion to her, but arguing against the false statement that we cannot be saved without a devotion to her?

The problem I have here is that, for some, Mary will be the only way they come to know her son. For instance, Fulton Sheen wrote a chapter called Mary and the Moslems. It’s quite fascinating to see the way God uses Mary to convert the Moslems. For many Moslems, the only way they will ever come to Our Lord is for them to foster a devotion to Our Lady. Not all but many. From Fulton Sheen:catholicculture.org/library/view.cfm?recnum=4000
I think planters writing style may be a little strange and perhaps misleading at first read, but sounds to me as though she has a devotion to the BVM.
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bear06 said:
If God chooses to bring someone to His Son through a devotion to Mary than it’s quite necessary for that person so the title isn’t altogether wrong. To try and thwart people from being devoted to Mary is a very, very bad idea. To have a problem with calling her the Ark of the Convenenat or the Tabernacle is also wrong because these are names the Church gives to her. It is the Church’s interpretation of scripture and it can’t be rejected.
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The ancient Christians used these terms of Mary. St. Ephrem is one of them. But I think there is a problem when you begin to say that unless you have a devotion to Mary you are gauranteed to go to hell. No, Christ is our lord and He is the only one who is necessary for salvation. Christ told us what we ask Him He will give us and what we ask the Father in His name He will give us. He did not say we must go through Mary. The vast majority of the miracles performed in the gospels are performed when the sick or demonic approach Christ directly. For example the leper who approached Christ in Matt.8 came to Him and said ‘if you will, you can make me clean.’ Christ did not say, ‘go ask my mother and if she says its ok then I will do it.’ He healed the man. The same with the centurion and every other miracle.

Yes, Mary’s aid is very powerful but it is not necessary.
 
I don’t know if anyone has yet put the Cardinal’s recent formulation on this issue.

Here it is for anyone interested:
Most Holy Father, our united hope and desire for the solemn papal definition of the doctrine of the Church regarding Mary Most Holy as the Spiritual Mother of all humanity, the Co-redemptrix with Jesus the Redeemer, Mediatrix of all graces with Jesus the one Mediator, and Advocate with Jesus Christ on behalf of the human race.
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In a time of significant confusion amidst the many diverse ecclesial bodies of Christianity, and as well among non-Christian peoples concerning this Marian doctrine, we believe the time opportune for a solemn definition of clarification regarding the constant teaching of the Church concerning the Mother of the Redeemer and her unique cooperation (cf. Lumen Gentium, n. 61) in the work of Redemption, as well as her subsequent roles in the distribution of grace and intercession for the human family.
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It is of great importance, Holy Father, that peoples of other religious traditions receive the clarification on the highest level of authentic doctrinal certainty that we can provide, that the Catholic Church essentially distinguishes between the sole role of Jesus Christ, divine and human Redeemer of the world, and the unique though secondary and dependent human participation of the Mother of Christ in the great work of Redemption.
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Therefore, Your Holiness, with filial obedience and respect, we wish to present you with this votum of our solidarity of hope for the papal definition of the Immaculate Virgin Mother of God as the spiritual Mother of all peoples in her three maternal roles as Co-redemptrix,** Mediatrix of all graces and Advocate, **as the ultimate expression of doctrinal clarity at the service of our Christian and non-Christian brothers and sisters who are not in communion with Rome, and as well as for the greater understanding and appreciation of this revealed doctrine concerning the Mother of the Redeemer by the People of God at the outset of this third millennium of Christianity.
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We thereby submit this votum accompanied by one possible formulation of the Marian doctrine which we, please God, pray may be solemnly defined by your Holiness:
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Jesus Christ, the Redeemer of man, gave to humanity from the Cross his mother Mary to be the spiritual Mother of all peoples, the Co-redemptrix, who under and with her Son cooperated in the Redemption of all people; the Mediatrix of all graces, who as Mother brings us the gifts of eternal life; and the Advocate, who presents our prayers to her Son.
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jimmy said:
The ancient Christians used these terms of Mary. St. Ephrem is one of them. But I think there is a problem when you begin to say that unless you have a devotion to Mary you are gauranteed to go to hell. No, Christ is our lord and He is the only one who is necessary for salvation. Christ told us what we ask Him He will give us and what we ask the Father in His name He will give us. He did not say we must go through Mary. The vast majority of the miracles performed in the gospels are performed when the sick or demonic approach Christ directly. For example the leper who approached Christ in Matt.8 came to Him and said ‘if you will, you can make me clean.’ Christ did not say, ‘go ask my mother and if she says its ok then I will do it.’ He healed the man. The same with the centurion and every other miracle.

Yes, Mary’s aid is very powerful but it is not necessary.
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I’m confused. What do miracles have to do with salvation? Are miracles necessary? Are people saved by miracles? (for the sake of the conversation let’s leave out the miracles of the sacraments.)
 
GerardP said:
What’s with the Mary bashers on this thread making the false accusation that people are equating her with Christ or worshipping her?

Those are typical, ignorant, uneducated bits of anti-Catholic propaganda spread by non-Catholics. I think we have some here pretending to be Catholics.
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I love how ultratraditionalists twist things and say things like, ‘what is with all the Mary bashers’. No one has bashed Mary. You are the one who has turned her into a god. You are the one who has introduced a second source of our salvation. As Hebrews says, we have an advocate in heaven, Jesus Christ. It does not say Mary is our advocate, it says Jesus Christ. Christ is the way, the truth and the life, not Mary. Mary was not involved in every exhortation for Christ to perform a miracle, in fact the only miracle which Christ performed which Mary was involved in was the wedding at Cana. So don’t tell me that Mary is necessary for salvation. The healing of the lepers and the demoniacs and the woman with the hemmorage. The raising of the dead girl and Lazarus were not interceded by Mary. Christ tells us that what we ask Him He will give us. What we ask of the Father in His name He will give us. He doesn’t say, ask Mary and she will give it to you.
 
GerardP said:
I’m confused. What do miracles have to do with salvation? Are miracles necessary? Are people saved by miracles? (for the sake of the conversation let’s leave out the miracles of the sacraments.)
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It has to do with our relationship to Christ. It reveals the fact that Mary is not necessary. Just like there is physical healing there is spiritual healing and we do not need to approach Mary before approaching Christ. We can approach Christ Himself. We have an advocate in heaven and that is Christ. He has entered the Holy of Holies and continually intercedes for us.
 
jimmy said:
The ancient Christians used these terms of Mary. St. Ephrem is one of them. But I think there is a problem when you begin to say that unless you have a devotion to Mary you are gauranteed to go to hell.

Well, I don’t have a problem because I’ve never said that. God usually supplies for extraordinary situations. That said, to know what the Church teaches and to reject it because “we know better” is a completely different matter
No, Christ is our lord and He is the only one who is necessary for salvation. Christ told us what we ask Him He will give us and what we ask the Father in His name He will give us. He did not say we must go through Mary. The vast majority of the miracles performed in the gospels are performed when the sick or demonic approach Christ directly. For example the leper who approached Christ in Matt.8 came to Him and said ‘if you will, you can make me clean.’ Christ did not say, ‘go ask my mother and if she says its ok then I will do it.’ He healed the man. The same with the centurion and every other miracle.
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