DH is not Catholic & engages in porn

[Kelfa28]

You need to start showing your husband some sexual excitement so that he doesn’t need to go on those web sites… What he’s doing on there is obviously no good… But it’s indicative that maybe you like most wives are ignoring his primary physical needs. I would suggest trying to devote 10-20 minutes twice a week to HIS PLEASURE. It will make the other 168 hours of the week go that much better for him. Bottom line, if he’s satisfied by you, he won’t have to go elsewhere…

Unfortunately women don’t (and probably cant) understand this about men but just take my word for it… God loving or not, we have physical urges that are just as strong as needing to eat or breathe. Doesn’t matter how religious you are, you still need to eat. Take my word for it, your man will highly appreciate the new “attentive” you, and you’ll reap many rewards that make the small cost (20-40 minutes per week) well worth it!

Wow…really?

You’ve got to be kidding me with some of these trolls.

 

[Dee_S]

You need to start showing your husband some sexual excitement so that he doesn’t need to go on those web sites… What he’s doing on there is obviously no good… But it’s indicative that maybe you like most wives are ignoring his primary physical needs. I would suggest trying to devote 10-20 minutes twice a week to HIS PLEASURE. It will make the other 168 hours of the week go that much better for him. Bottom line, if he’s satisfied by you, he won’t have to go elsewhere…
IMO your advice is offensive not only to the poster but to all wives, unless perhaps you are just ignorant of the physiology and psychology that underly porn addiction. Get off your bottom line and check out some facts before adding yr very unpleasant:twocents: Here are some quotes from a world authority Dr Judith Reisman:
Any confusing image or experience is processed as ‘novelty’ and the
brain’s response to novelty is attention! All pornography is experienced as
provocative ‘novelty’ initially. Note the need to change the novelty stimulus
(the ‘centerfold’) and her surroundings and trappings regularly. Once the
brain adjusts to one provocative stimuli the pornographer will substitute
another and another and another.

ORGANICALLY QUANTIFIABLE PORNOGRAPHIC .ADDICTION.
It takes 3/10ths of a second for a pornographic picture or
symbol to flood the organ known as the .brain. with sensory
experiences that trigger a network of memories that have been
misdiagnosed as ‘sexual’ or as ‘lust’ or even, as in Pygmalion,
‘love’. These pornographic stimuli will commonly, if
unconsciously, replay prior pornographic and associated sexual
or sadosexual experiences.

  Dr. Patrick Carnes, writing in *Out of the Shadows, *explained sex addiction as "a pathological relationship with a mood-altering experience."71 By definition, all pornography viewing *is sexual conduct*, behavior that engenders a "mood-altering experience." 

  For, this always confusing .mood altering experience,. by its nature, generates states of lust, undergirded by anxiety which always produces levels of fear, anger and shame. Such is the quality of the mood altering response to provoking sex stimuli, labeled by the individual as sexual arousal. This means the hypothalamus is at .red alert,. activated to .flight or flight.
[drjudithreisman.com/archives/brain.pdf](http://www.drjudithreisman.com/archives/brain.pdf)

Unfortunately women don’t (and probably cant) understand this about men but just take my word for it… God loving or not, we have physical urges that are just as strong as needing to eat or breathe. Doesn’t matter how religious you are, you still need to eat. Take my word for it, your man will highly appreciate the new “attentive” you, and you’ll reap many rewards that make the small cost (20-40 minutes per week) well worth it!
And I suppose in your opinion, women don’t have to eat either? It is also a medical fact that men who do porn eventually become IMPOTENT (now check that out if you think I’m wrong). It is the wives of porn addicts who suffer neglect and lack of attention, and that are deprived of their CONJUGAL RIGHTS (which BTW works both ways)

 

[Dee_S]

Thanks for jumping the shark to troll status there bro. It’s certainly appreciated.

I suppose there is no accounting for taste? To appreciate this type of rude and uncharitable commentary is ugly…
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/78/Trollface.svg/200px-Trollface.svg.png
which, I suppose all ‘trollers’ and their sycophants are! (kind of feel sorry for their wives)

 

[The_Bucket]

Dee, I do hope you realize that I was being sarcastic. If not, I will be sure to apply the [sarcasm][/sarcasm] tags. I have no time or tolerance for trolling on a Catholic forum. If you want to do that, take it to the wastelands of 4chan, Something Awful or others of their ilk.

 

[Dee_S]

Dee, I do hope you realize that I was being sarcastic. If not, I will be sure to apply the [sarcasm][/sarcasm] tags. I have no time or tolerance for trolling on a Catholic forum. If you want to do that, take it to the wastelands of 4chan, Something Awful or others of their ilk.

Sorry, I didn’t realise that, seeing at his lack of sensitivity. Poor lady, she’s already hurting so much…add a guilt trip to that…ouch!

BTW i had to google ‘trolls’ as did not know about them either. Oh my, I must be living in another world. Anyhow just want to wish all here a very happy feast of the Assumption of Mary - may she comfort all who are sad and afflicted.

Queen Assumed into Heaven, pray for us

A great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun and the moon under her feet and on her head a crown of twelve stars Apoc. 12. 1

 

[alphawoman]

You need to start showing your husband some sexual excitement so that he doesn’t need to go on those web sites… What he’s doing on there is obviously no good… But it’s indicative that maybe you like most wives are ignoring his primary physical needs. I would suggest trying to devote 10-20 minutes twice a week to HIS PLEASURE. It will make the other 168 hours of the week go that much better for him. Bottom line, if he’s satisfied by you, he won’t have to go elsewhere…

Unfortunately women don’t (and probably cant) understand this about men but just take my word for it… God loving or not, we have physical urges that are just as strong as needing to eat or breathe. Doesn’t matter how religious you are, you still need to eat. Take my word for it, your man will highly appreciate the new “attentive” you, and you’ll reap many rewards that make the small cost (20-40 minutes per week) well worth it!

This advice is wrong. Do not listen to it!

Your job as a wife is not to sexually mollify your husband as he pursues morally corrupting, adulterous behavior. Your husband is actively seeing out “relations” with other women.

Please seek help and take this issue seriously. Look up Patrick Carnes–he specializes in sexual addiction treatment, particularly for addictions with an online component. A visit to your priest is in order for guidance on how to proceed. Sexaholics anonymous (SA) may be of help to you, as well as its sister organization offering support for spouses of sexual addicts. Finally, if you can get your husband in to see a psychiatrist for evaluation, there may be some other issues tied up with his pornography use.

I’m so sorry you’re going through this horrible situation. I’m right there with you- I discovered two months after my baby son’s birth that my husband had been using porn compulsively since being a teenager–years before we met. He “fessed up” when I caught him red-handed, only to relapse 6 weeks later and try to conceal it. I took my son to stay with relatives for a month. He is now seeing a psychiatrist and is on the short list to be treated by a multi-disciplinary sex addiction mental health team. Our first big breakthrough occurred when he admitted he was addicted.

Porn addictions are insidious and permeate many aspects of a person’s personality and morality. Do not under any circumstance underestimate the power of your adversary, who is Satan and the Devil. Pray the rosary daily for your husband with a special intercession from St. Monca. You and your child are “indirect” targets through your husband–Satan will tempt you with despair, but you can overcome this tragedy through fidelity to God and frequent receipt of the sacraments. Baptize your child. Your husband has lost the moral authority to dictate the spiritual upbringing of your child. Do not bd afraid of an extended separation–it helped in my case

I will be praying for you and the poor misguided poster who suggested you should jet put out.

God bless!

Alpha.

 

[alphawoman]

Dee- great reference to Patrick Carnes! Thanks for jumping in with that info.

 

[alphawoman]

Dee- great reference to Patrick Carnes! Thanks for jumping in with that info.

 

[alphawoman]

You need to start showing your husband some sexual excitement so that he doesn’t need to go on those web sites… What he’s doing on there is obviously no good… But it’s indicative that maybe you like most wives are ignoring his primary physical needs. I would suggest trying to devote 10-20 minutes twice a week to HIS PLEASURE. It will make the other 168 hours of the week go that much better for him. Bottom line, if he’s satisfied by you, he won’t have to go elsewhere…

Unfortunately women don’t (and probably cant) understand this about men but just take my word for it… God loving or not, we have physical urges that are just as strong as needing to eat or breathe. Doesn’t matter how religious you are, you still need to eat. Take my word for it, your man will highly appreciate the new “attentive” you, and you’ll reap many rewards that make the small cost (20-40 minutes per week) well worth it!

This advice is wrong. Do not listen to it!

Your job as a wife is not to sexually mollify your husband as he pursues morally corrupting, adulterous behavior. Your husband is actively seeing out “relations” with other women.

Please seek help and take this issue seriously. Look up Patrick Carnes–he specializes in sexual addiction treatment, particularly for addictions with an online component. A visit to your priest is in order for guidance on how to proceed. Sexaholics anonymous (SA) may be of help to you, as well as its sister organization offering support for spouses of sexual addicts. Finally, if you can get your husband in to see a psychiatrist for evaluation, there may be some other issues tied up with his pornography use.

I’m so sorry you’re going through this horrible situation. I’m right there with you- I discovered two months after my baby son’s birth that my husband had been using porn compulsively since being a teenager–years before we met. He “fessed up” when I caught him red-handed, only to relapse 6 weeks later and try to conceal it. I took my son to stay with relatives for a month. He is now seeing a psychiatrist and is on the short list to be treated by a multi-disciplinary sex addiction mental health team. Our first big breakthrough occurred when he admitted he was addicted.

Porn addictions are insidious and permeate many aspects of a person’s personality and morality. Do not under any circumstance underestimate the power of your adversary, who is Satan and the Devil. Pray the rosary daily for your husband with a special intercession from St. Monca. You and your child are “indirect” targets through your husband–Satan will tempt you with despair, but you can overcome this tragedy through fidelity to God and frequent receipt of the sacraments. Baptize your child. Your husband has lost the moral authority to dictate the spiritual upbringing of your child. Do not bd afraid of an extended separation–it helped in my case

I will be praying for you and the poor misguided poster who suggested you should jet put out.

God bless!

Alpha.

 

[Dee_S]

My apologies The Bucket, had not seen your earlier post.
Your friendly and convenient …
http://145.58.80.34/~krux/forums//vbnews/photos/phppFQLuA.jpghttp://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/78/Trollface.svg/200px-Trollface.svg.png
high-powered flamethrower… for use against inanity and trolling.

(hope no-one here minds, but your ‘signature’ is worth a special feature - troll-busting?)

​

 

[Dee_S]

This advice is wrong. Do not listen to it!

Your job as a wife is not to sexually mollify your husband as he pursues morally corrupting, adulterous behavior. Your husband is actively seeing out “relations” with other women.

Please seek help and take this issue seriously. Look up Patrick Carnes–he specializes in sexual addiction treatment, particularly for addictions with an online component. A visit to your priest is in order for guidance on how to proceed. Sexaholics anonymous (SA) may be of help to you, as well as its sister organization offering support for spouses of sexual addicts. Finally, if you can get your husband in to see a psychiatrist for evaluation, there may be some other issues tied up with his pornography use.

I’m so sorry you’re going through this horrible situation. I’m right there with you- I discovered two months after my baby son’s birth that my husband had been using porn compulsively since being a teenager–years before we met. He “fessed up” when I caught him red-handed, only to relapse 6 weeks later and try to conceal it. I took my son to stay with relatives for a month. He is now seeing a psychiatrist and is on the short list to be treated by a multi-disciplinary sex addiction mental health team. Our first big breakthrough occurred when he admitted he was addicted.

Porn addictions are insidious and permeate many aspects of a person’s personality and morality. Do not under any circumstance underestimate the power of your adversary, who is Satan and the Devil. Pray the rosary daily for your husband with a special intercession from St. Monca. You and your child are “indirect” targets through your husband–Satan will tempt you with despair, but you can overcome this tragedy through fidelity to God and frequent receipt of the sacraments. Baptize your child. Your husband has lost the moral authority to dictate the spiritual upbringing of your child. Do not bd afraid of an extended separation–it helped in my case

I will be praying for you and the poor misguided poster who suggested you should jet put out.

God bless!

Alpha.

So very well put Alpha, some very clear thinking there. Prayer, especially the rosary is the answer.
I think it was St Francis de Sales that said, “one act of the will is worth a thousand penances” and it is said of St Joseph that he lived only to do the Will of God. The hardest part about problems like this which touch our lives so intimately, is to accept and carry the cross we are given. Pray first for the grace to bear the pain of infidelity and the strength to be of some good to the person you love.

To just throw in some info to get marriage problems into perspective:

The Church only allows temporary separation for certain serious reasons in a marriage and this only until the problem has been resolved. i.e. all separations are considered ‘temporary’.

The only exception to this (indissolubility of marriage) is for adultery. One can separate and is **never **obliged to return to the marriage.

This may come as a surprise to some, but it is the teaching of the Church. It has to do with (fidelity) exclusive rights to the body, which is in the contract.

The use of porn is adulterous - the words of Our Lord make that pretty clear.

 

[Gorgias]

The only exception to this (indissolubility of marriage) is for adultery. One can separate and is **never **obliged to return to the marriage.

This may come as a surprise to some, but it is the teaching of the Church. It has to do with (fidelity) exclusive rights to the body, which is in the contract.

Your comment strikes me as saying that adultery is an automatic “game over” condition, and that’s how the Church sees it. Perhaps that isn’t what you meant to say, but if it is, then you’re not quite accurate.

The opportunity to sever the bond does exist for the innocent spouse, but it isn’t the default course of action. In fact, canon law says just the opposite:

Can. 1152 §1 It is earnestly recommended that a spouse, motivated by christian charity and solicitous for the good of the family, should not refuse to pardon an adulterous partner and should not sunder the conjugal life.

Can. 1155 The innocent spouse may laudably readmit the other spouse to the conjugal life

So, if all you’re saying is that adultery may be sufficient to warrant an annulment, then you’re right; but if you’re saying that it’s the necessary or even preferred course of action… :nope:

 

[bmaj]

This advice is wrong. Do not listen to it!

Your job as a wife is not to sexually mollify your husband as he pursues morally corrupting, adulterous behavior. Your husband is actively seeing out “relations” with other women.

Please seek help and take this issue seriously. Look up Patrick Carnes–he specializes in sexual addiction treatment, particularly for addictions with an online component. A visit to your priest is in order for guidance on how to proceed. Sexaholics anonymous (SA) may be of help to you, as well as its sister organization offering support for spouses of sexual addicts. Finally, if you can get your husband in to see a psychiatrist for evaluation, there may be some other issues tied up with his pornography use.

I’m so sorry you’re going through this horrible situation. I’m right there with you- I discovered two months after my baby son’s birth that my husband had been using porn compulsively since being a teenager–years before we met. He “fessed up” when I caught him red-handed, only to relapse 6 weeks later and try to conceal it. I took my son to stay with relatives for a month. He is now seeing a psychiatrist and is on the short list to be treated by a multi-disciplinary sex addiction mental health team. Our first big breakthrough occurred when he admitted he was addicted.

Porn addictions are insidious and permeate many aspects of a person’s personality and morality. Do not under any circumstance underestimate the power of your adversary, who is Satan and the Devil. Pray the rosary daily for your husband with a special intercession from St. Monca. You and your child are “indirect” targets through your husband–Satan will tempt you with despair, but you can overcome this tragedy through fidelity to God and frequent receipt of the sacraments. Baptize your child. Your husband has lost the moral authority to dictate the spiritual upbringing of your child. Do not bd afraid of an extended separation–it helped in my case

I will be praying for you and the poor misguided poster who suggested you should jet put out.

God bless!

Alpha.

Well put, Alpha. Prayers for every wife going through this horrible intrusion of satan into their marriages.

 

[alphawoman]

Thanks Dee, bmaj.

Gorgias, I believe Dee was suggesting that adultery is a sufficient condition for annulment or permanent separation, but doesn’t necessitate one. Dee’s not inciting annulments, but rather demonstrating the gravity of pornography use and adultery in the Church’s eyes.

Dee, please correct me if I’m misinterpreting you.

 

[alphawoman]

OP, these are Catholic resources, so your husband might not be immediately receptive to them. I wanted to share them because these, combined with a daily rosary, helped me overcome 6 years of fornication and contraception use. Suffice it to say, I had one food in hell and the other on a banana peel

The first is an inexpensive PDF format snook that walks you through daily prayers, contemplations, and resolutions. It’s a one day at a time approach–effectively, spiritual cognitive behavioural therapy. While it focuses on porn and masturbation, I used it successfully for more broad sins against purity. Frankly, I’d bet the approach would work in battling any vice.

home.earthlink.net/~cleanofheart/

This is an outstanding website that I revisit all the time. Again, the focus is on combating sins associated with porn, but it really can have a positive spillover into every area of your life after reading it. You’ll find yourself spotting near occasions of sin and praying for help. I like to think of it as a hotline to God, who always picks up the phone and gives you exactly what you need!

You’re in my prayers.

pornnomore.com/

 

[Dee_S]

Your comment strikes me as saying that adultery is an automatic “game over” condition, and that’s how the Church sees it. Perhaps that isn’t what you meant to say, but if it is, then you’re not quite accurate.
I was pointing out the considerable and lawful difference between all other marriage problems and adultery.

Being that only temporary separation (with the permission of the Church and usually for a fixed period of time)is ever possible for specific serious problems, and this is always with a view to reconciling when the problem no longer exists or i being satifactorily dealt with. whereas…

In the case of adultery this norm does not apply and you can legitimately live separately without any obligation ever to return to the marriage. (This does not in any way entitle or open the way for an annulment, nor did I allude to that in my post).

The opportunity to sever the bond does exist for the innocent spouse
The bond/contract is already ‘severed’ by the adulterous party. It’s just that the innocent party is not forced by the law of the Church to renew this and live with them again. The law of the Church permits a permanent separation only, meaning they can live apart, but neither of them can re-marry.

Granted, the Church encourages forgiveness, and all that canon law says is that if the innocent spouse is able to readmit the guilty party back into the union then it would be a good thing to do.

The point here is, that some people just cannot do that, for reasons we don’t have to go into here - and the Church does not oblige them to readmit the guilty spouse.

In no way does the Church imply or impose a ‘guilt trip’ on the innocent party.

So, if all you’re saying is that adultery may be sufficient to warrant an annulment, then you’re right; but if you’re saying that it’s the necessary or even preferred course of action… :nope:
Sorry, but I did not say anything like that at all. An annulment is a declaration by the Church that no Christian marriage took place, and it nullifies the ‘marriage’. It is not a ‘catholic divorce’ nor does adultery entitle anyone to seek this. The purposes of an annulment are to judge certain and limited grounds that may show/prove that the intention at the time of marriage was not in conformity with the properties of Christian marriage.
e.g. One of the grounds (that has always been an accepted proof of nullity) is if the spouse was known/proven to be having ‘affairs’ before and after the marriage took place. This points to them not having the intention that the Church requires in honoring the exclusive nature of the contract.

 

[Dee_S]

Thanks Dee, bmaj.

Gorgias, I believe Dee was suggesting that adultery is a sufficient condition for annulment or permanent separation, but doesn’t necessitate one. Dee’s not inciting annulments, but rather demonstrating the gravity of pornography use and adultery in the Church’s eyes.

Dee, please correct me if I’m misinterpreting you.

Thanks alphawoman for asking and contributing that comment above regarding the gravity of adultery. I have replied to Gorgias and am sorry if anyone took my words to imply anything to do with annulment, I did not even think it was implied in what I said

As we all know, Catholic marriage is indissoluble and one can only separate for a fixed time from a troublesome spouse (with the permission of the Church) until the situation hopefully rectifies. In difficult cases, extensions are granted or something like a semi-permanent situation evolves if the offending spouse refuses to co-operate or are a danger to the other etc etc.

My point is that a spouse using porn is guilty of adultery of the heart as Jesus Himself said “If a man looks at a woman with lust, he is guilty of adultery.”. As far as I know, the Church so far only allows permanent separation on the grounds of third party (with another person) adultery, but these days of internet chat rooms, webcam etc. a reasonable case could be made for permanent separation.

I tend to rate those who ‘jump ship’ when they discover this gross infidelity as responding to a true instinct that knows without understanding or knowledge that the ‘bond’ is broken, in heaven and on earth.

 

[The_Bucket]

My point is that a spouse using porn is guilty of adultery of the heart as Jesus Himself said “If a man looks at a woman with lust, he is guilty of adultery.”. As far as I know, the Church so far only allows permanent separation on the grounds of third party (with another person) adultery, but these days of internet chat rooms, webcam etc. a reasonable case could be made for permanent separation.

I tend to rate those who ‘jump ship’ when they discover this gross infidelity as responding to a true instinct that knows without understanding or knowledge that the ‘bond’ is broken, in heaven and on earth.

Jesus was demonstrating the gravity of the sin of lust and how we should not be legalistic about whether we are following God’s Law or not. After all, plenty of men could say they had broken no part of Mosaic Law if they were just LOOKING at a woman!

Truthfully Dee men look at other women with some degree of lust in their hearts a lot. I mean, a lot. We’re basically switched in the “on” position all the time when it comes to readiness for sex. It takes a lot of willpower and practice to let an attractive woman walk by without dawdling on the thought.

I don’t mean active fantasies that linger for a long time, but I mean at least a thought or two about how something was well-built. Even that is sinful, though I daresay it’s likely venial. It’s very tough to truly let the near occasion of sin pass by the way Christ taught. This is not an excuse, it is an explanation that lust is basically the easiest road for Satan to travel to get into the minds and hearts of men.

Pornography is insidious and addictive and extremely sinful. And it corrupts the ability for a man to be in any way connected with his spouse, his family and God. It is pervasive in our culture and likely extends to a large portion of Catholic men, married or not. But the addiction to that sin not unfixable. Sometimes it requires drastic action on the part of the wife to force the hand of the husband, of whom drastic action is always required to root it out, but it can indeed be done. I’ve seen it happen.

 

[Dee_S]

Jesus was demonstrating the gravity of the sin of lust and how we should not be legalistic about whether we are following God’s Law or not. After all, plenty of men could say they had broken no part of Mosaic Law if they were just LOOKING at a woman!

Truthfully Dee men look at other women with some degree of lust in their hearts a lot. I mean, a lot. We’re basically switched in the “on” position all the time when it comes to readiness for sex. It takes a lot of willpower and practice to let an attractive woman walk by without dawdling on the thought.

I don’t mean active fantasies that linger for a long time, but I mean at least a thought or two about how something was well-built. Even that is sinful, though I daresay it’s likely venial. It’s very tough to truly let the near occasion of sin pass by the way Christ taught. This is not an excuse, it is an explanation that lust is basically the easiest road for Satan to travel to get into the minds and hearts of men.

Pornography is insidious and addictive and extremely sinful. And it corrupts the ability for a man to be in any way connected with his spouse, his family and God. It is pervasive in our culture and likely extends to a large portion of Catholic men, married or not. But the addiction to that sin not unfixable. Sometimes it requires drastic action on the part of the wife to force the hand of the husband, of whom drastic action is always required to root it out, but it can indeed be done. I’ve seen it happen.

Ok. Your points are well presented and make sense especially given the nature of the male to be attracted to the beauty and attractions of the female. And, given Original
Sin, the weakness of fallen human nature can easily degenerate this appreciation into lust.

Spiritual reading of the saints and Doctor’s of the Church on Modesty of the Eyes (thinking here of the advice of St Alphonsus de Liguori, a great moral theologian) is necessary for men in particular, as being the entry point to the soul, they must learn the discipline necessary not to “gaze upon another’s beauty”. Prayer and action always go together. Living in the world and seeing without seeing is possible. The early Christians lived in a corrupt pagan world where all around them they had but to look to see immoral sights, much more so than in our day, when mostly one has to own a computer, switch it on, find the site etc etc. much more deliberate sin here obviously.

And yes, a marriage can be saved if both parties want it to. Yes drastic measures sometimes must be taken to eliminate and end what is a true mind altering addiction, not merely an attraction or curiousity.

Many saints advise saying 3 Hail Mary’s every day in honor of the Immaculate Conception of Our Lady in order to get the grace of chastity. Believe me, it is simple, but it is so often successful that she who is conceived without Original Sin helps us poor sinners and makes easy the way back home.

 

[The_Bucket]

Please note that while I don’t think pornography and self-abuse is as grave a betrayal as actual adultery with a third party, that doesn’t mean it’s any less of a mortal sin provided the usual criteria for a mortal sin are fulfilled. The thing is that many people, even Catholics, are not aware that pornography is indeed grave matter. I think everyone knows that cheating with another person is gravely wrong. All the more reason, sadly, that pornography is so pervasive. It’s incredibly deceptive to men and it breeds deception IN men.