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snarflemike
Guest
Just curious to hear any first-hand or even second-hand accounts.
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adamhovey1988
Guest
No idea. But, there are “atheists” here that are a lot friendlier to Christianity than they were, that I have seen.
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snarflemike
Guest
Definitely a good thing.
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Dan_Defender
Guest
My impression is NO, but maybe I haven’t been on CAF long enough. On the other hand, no atheist on CAF converted any Catholic faithful to atheism, even though they tried mightily. So the power of darkness did not prevail.
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Freddy
Guest
I’ve been here quite some time. And I have never been aware of any atheist intentionally trying to convert Catholics. If I had I would have pm’d them personally and told them them that they were guests on the forum and to back the truck up.
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CaptainPrudeman
Guest
Some do, but they are usually trolling and get banned one or two threads in. Such behavior, and the people that tend to do it, lend themselves to being abrasive and disrespectful.
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Freddy
Guest
I will admit to having seem some posts akin to: ‘If your God is so powerful then why can’t he cure cancer!??’Freddy:
Some do, but they are usually trolling and get banned one or two threads in. Such behavior, and the people that tend to do it, lend themselves to being abrasive and disrespectful.
I think it was a few years back that @atheistgirl said she would honestly and ferverently pray daily for a month to try to connect with God. To no avail it must be said. Can’t say she didn’t give it a shot…
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rosejmj
Guest
Yeah, I’m some ways CAF can push people away from Catholicism because of how extreme people are even when it goes against logic and science. Makes me lose some respect for it. I feel like people use religion as an excuse to be close minded sometimes. Well the Church says it’s wrong so I refuse to consider any other perspectives that could potentially make holes in my arguments and my beliefs
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lelinator
Guest
I’ll put myself firmly among those for whom CAF has served as more of a deterrent to Catholicism than an attractant. Not that I wasn’t anti-Catholic to begin with. But twelve years here has only served to reinforce my belief that Catholics aren’t really all that different from everyone else, and that it’s really their religion/Church that I don’t like. The abrasive and self-righteous attitude of some of its members I can easily forgive. I don’t expect people to be perfect. But it’s specifically the attitude and self-righteousness of the Catholic Church itself that I don’t like.
It’s as if the Catholic Church has taken the dictum “I am the way the truth and the life” and applied it to itself. Presuming itself to be on par with God. Now I realize that most Catholics probably wouldn’t characterize it that way, but in a skeptics eyes, that’s the way it looks to me.
I’ll give respect, honor, and even reverence to that which I think deserves it, but among those things, isn’t the Catholic Church. If you find this attitude disrespectful, I’m sorry, but it seems as if my lifetime ban only has a week to go, so I might as well put all the obligatory courtesies aside and be honest.
God…if there is one, may well deserve my reverence, but the Catholic Church…sorry, I don’t think so.
It’s as if the Catholic Church has taken the dictum “I am the way the truth and the life” and applied it to itself. Presuming itself to be on par with God. Now I realize that most Catholics probably wouldn’t characterize it that way, but in a skeptics eyes, that’s the way it looks to me.
I’ll give respect, honor, and even reverence to that which I think deserves it, but among those things, isn’t the Catholic Church. If you find this attitude disrespectful, I’m sorry, but it seems as if my lifetime ban only has a week to go, so I might as well put all the obligatory courtesies aside and be honest.
God…if there is one, may well deserve my reverence, but the Catholic Church…sorry, I don’t think so.
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FiveLinden
Guest
CAF has certainly achieved for this atheist what I wanted - I feel I know a lot more about belief and the reasons people believe.
And I think I have come to understand that some of us non-believers actually behave in a religious way in our thinking and in argument. I have been more and more reinforced in my feeling that religion is an evolved behaviour that conferred an advantage on our ancestors probably by creating strong groups with a sense of optimism in the face of huge difficulties and distress.
CAF has also taught me a lot about the US and the things those of us in the lands of the unfree and slightly nervous are amazed by. I realised that the willingness of people to believe and follow charismatic leaders shown in religion is also expressed in US politics and the discussions here showed me that for some the same thinking processes are at work.
I think I may have influenced some to understand that ‘scruples’ are a manifestation of a psychological disorder and cannot be dealt with in a ‘spiritual’ way. It may be that spiritual counselling has the same positive impact as other talking therapy but that aside I’m still disturbed to see people with obsessions and rituals as part of their disorder being told to follow various rituals and practices to ‘help’ their condition. I hope some have followed my advice and gone to see their doctor.
Overall it seems to me that the CAF mission has been to strengthen belief among Catholics and eliminate heterodox thinking among them and to defend the Church from the criticism by, and threat from, US-style Bible-based protestantism. We unbelievers are not in anyway central to that.
My prize for the best response to me goes to the CAF member who said I was wrong in saying that religious images should be removed from public land because if they were, then what would be left was nothing, and that is an image of what I believe in! I conceded defeat.
And I think I have come to understand that some of us non-believers actually behave in a religious way in our thinking and in argument. I have been more and more reinforced in my feeling that religion is an evolved behaviour that conferred an advantage on our ancestors probably by creating strong groups with a sense of optimism in the face of huge difficulties and distress.
CAF has also taught me a lot about the US and the things those of us in the lands of the unfree and slightly nervous are amazed by. I realised that the willingness of people to believe and follow charismatic leaders shown in religion is also expressed in US politics and the discussions here showed me that for some the same thinking processes are at work.
I think I may have influenced some to understand that ‘scruples’ are a manifestation of a psychological disorder and cannot be dealt with in a ‘spiritual’ way. It may be that spiritual counselling has the same positive impact as other talking therapy but that aside I’m still disturbed to see people with obsessions and rituals as part of their disorder being told to follow various rituals and practices to ‘help’ their condition. I hope some have followed my advice and gone to see their doctor.
Overall it seems to me that the CAF mission has been to strengthen belief among Catholics and eliminate heterodox thinking among them and to defend the Church from the criticism by, and threat from, US-style Bible-based protestantism. We unbelievers are not in anyway central to that.
My prize for the best response to me goes to the CAF member who said I was wrong in saying that religious images should be removed from public land because if they were, then what would be left was nothing, and that is an image of what I believe in! I conceded defeat.
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Pattylt
Guest
We did have one atheist poster in that category and I did PM him. He was pretty quickly banned anyway but this wasn’t his first or last account. He was on his own mission to trap Catholics and failed miserably. As far as I can tell, he did give up…to probably everyone’s relief! 
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Pattylt
Guest
I came to CAF to understand what Catholics and their church believe and why. Mostly, I’ve gotten answers to those questions. I have been amazed at the number of people that have said “the church says I must believe xyz so I do”. I still can’t figure out how someone can be made to believe something if they don’t already believe it. I can understand consenting to what the church says but consent and actual belief are not the same.
I know what I believe and had no interest in discussing it unless I was asked. When asked, I defended my position but I hope I never came across as expecting someone to change their mind. I did have a lovely PM discussion with a catholic that was out the door mentally and we discussed the best way to handle making it known to his family and friends.
I’ve often found that believers may not realize what a painful and life altering event becoming an atheist can be for many ex believers…and the accusations that can accompany this. I’ve also been amused at how “this specific book or this specific prayer” will bring them back to the fold…like they haven’t already tried and done everything possible! People truly want to help others. Usually, it’s too late for that.
I’m not sure any open forum could bring an atheist into belief. Too many threads have shown the ugliness of religion as well as the beauty. Certain posters and their “style” have been a bigger push away than an open armed welcoming. It is a big Church and wants to have room for all…except if they think X…then, they aren’t a true Catholic. To be fair, there are also posters that realize you need to get them in the door first and give them time and space to reform their convictions. If they had to check off all the right boxes first, you’d never have a convert. The wise among you are aware of this.
Overall, no I didn’t change any of my beliefs. I still don’t believe there is a God. But, I’ve made friends and discovered a load of traditions and explanations about Catholicism and I’ll be forever grateful for that!
I know what I believe and had no interest in discussing it unless I was asked. When asked, I defended my position but I hope I never came across as expecting someone to change their mind. I did have a lovely PM discussion with a catholic that was out the door mentally and we discussed the best way to handle making it known to his family and friends.
I’ve often found that believers may not realize what a painful and life altering event becoming an atheist can be for many ex believers…and the accusations that can accompany this. I’ve also been amused at how “this specific book or this specific prayer” will bring them back to the fold…like they haven’t already tried and done everything possible! People truly want to help others. Usually, it’s too late for that.
I’m not sure any open forum could bring an atheist into belief. Too many threads have shown the ugliness of religion as well as the beauty. Certain posters and their “style” have been a bigger push away than an open armed welcoming. It is a big Church and wants to have room for all…except if they think X…then, they aren’t a true Catholic. To be fair, there are also posters that realize you need to get them in the door first and give them time and space to reform their convictions. If they had to check off all the right boxes first, you’d never have a convert. The wise among you are aware of this.
Overall, no I didn’t change any of my beliefs. I still don’t believe there is a God. But, I’ve made friends and discovered a load of traditions and explanations about Catholicism and I’ll be forever grateful for that!
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snarflemike
Guest
You’ve been here 12 years? May I ask in all sincerity, without any malice or hidden agenda, what you got out of your 12 years here?
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Feanor2
Guest
As a Catholic I can see this
CAF especially the news sub-forums have not served the faith well
I’m glad to see it go
CAF especially the news sub-forums have not served the faith well
I’m glad to see it go
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Feanor2
Guest
I just wish agnostics and atheists would know that Catholics at your local parish aren’t going to be anything like you see on CAF.
IMO atheists and agnostics have made some of the most meaningful and worthwhile posts around here. The Catholics can learn something from them.
IMO atheists and agnostics have made some of the most meaningful and worthwhile posts around here. The Catholics can learn something from them.
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Feanor2
Guest
I think that your average parishioner practices the faith as one facet of their life. They have other things going on. CAF attracts those who really make a “hobby” out of their Catholicism and Internet forums also , in general, attract the more strident
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lelinator
Guest
Man, that’s a tough question, and one that I’ve thought about a lot over the years. I think that the most important thing that I’ve gotten out of CAF…is patience. Maybe it’s just the fact that I’m older now, or maybe being banned so many times has taught me to think before I type. (Although that doesn’t always change what I type) But yeah, I think that I’m more patient now.
And tolerance. Hopefully I’m a bit more tolerant now as well. I try to be.
And I’ve learned a LOT, about Catholicism, and philosophy, and metaphysics, and especially about people. People are fascinating. You just have to try to get past how aggravating some of them can be sometimes, and that’s where that patience comes in. People aren’t perfect. None of us are. It’s just that some of those imperfections are easier to see, and easier to excuse. Ugly, ignorant, childish…those are fairly easy imperfections to forgive, but aggravating, and obstinate, and self-righteous…those are hard. If CAF has made me any better at accepting and forgiving those, then I’ve gained a lot.
So maybe people are looking at this the wrong way. Thinking that if CAF didn’t change anybody’s mind about Catholicism, then what good was it? But maybe it wasn’t about changing anyone’s mind from this philosophy to that philosophy. Maybe, if CAF was even a little bit successful, then we all gained the same things that I did. We’re a little more patient. We’re a little more tolerant. And we’re a whole lot wiser.
And you know what, I’d call that a success.
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snarflemike
Guest
Then I would say, in all sincerity, that CAF has a been an occasion of grace for you, and that is always a good thing.
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HerCrazierHalf
Guest
I suspect CAF has fostered some understanding of both sides but little to no conversions.
As a nonbeliever I’ve learned that most of the issues no belief poses from the Catholic pov aren’t major issues to nonbelievers. And there lays the divide
As a nonbeliever I’ve learned that most of the issues no belief poses from the Catholic pov aren’t major issues to nonbelievers. And there lays the divide
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Dan123
Guest
I feel like it’s similar to a debate. The people discussing issues are unlikely to change, but for each of them there’s 100 people reading, observing, hearing both sides. They may be influenced.
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