Did God create us (with these physical bodies) for a specific purpose?

[setarcos]

From what I gather, the soul wants to be reunited with God, from which it came, but it cannot because it’s contained within the body.

Please explain why Saint Paul says: “Miserable one that I am! Who will deliver me from this mortal body?” (Rom. 7:24)

Like with Saint Paul, I ask the same question of myself.

There are many who love this miserable and corrupt physical life to the degree they care nothing about God’s Heavenly Kingdom! Tell me please, where would you rather be?

St. Paul I believe is talking about the miserable state of the mortal body which it has fallen to. The new body shall be clothed in immortality and not subject to decay, pain, or death.
There shall be a new heaven AND a new earth scripture says. What would be the purpose of a new earth if it were devoid of inhabitants? The original earth was made to be mans home.

 

[Robert_Sock]

I think you are inappropriately separating the soul from the person. The person is a unity of body and soul.

Yes, the CCC does say that they are a whole, and in a sense, I fully agree, however, do we Catholics not believe that when we die just the soul goes to Heaven, Purgatory or Hell? It’s only at the Second Coming that our soul will become united with a glorified body. Do you agree?

 

[Robert_Sock]

St. Paul I believe is talking about the miserable state of the mortal body which it has fallen to. The new body shall be clothed in immortality and not subject to decay, pain, or death.
There shall be a new heaven AND a new earth scripture says. What would be the purpose of a new earth if it were devoid of inhabitants? The original earth was made to be mans home.

The inner life of man is greatly hindered in this life by the needs of the body. Thus, the Prophet devoutly prays that he may be set free from them, saying, “Lord, deliver me from my necessities!” Woe to those who refuse to recognize their own wretchedness, and doubly woe to those who love this miserable and corruptible life! For some cling so closely to it, that although by working or begging they can hardly win the bare necessities, they would yet be willing to live here for ever if it were possible, caring nothing for the Kingdom of God.
–The Imitation of Christ
Here’s what I’m going by. Yes, we believe that there will be a new Heaven and a new Earth, but in the meantime, I assume that the soul will be in Heaven without a body. Am I missing something?

366 The Church teaches that every spiritual soul is created immediately by God - it is not “produced” by the parents - and also that it is immortal: it does not perish when it separates from the body at death, and it will be reunited with the body at the final Resurrection.

 

[davidv]

Yes, the CCC does say that they are a whole, and in a sense, I fully agree, however, do we Catholics not believe that when we die just the soul goes to Heaven, Purgatory or Hell? It’s only at the Second Coming that our soul will become united with a glorified body. Do you agree?

Yes, I agree with this. This does not imply that only the soul longs for heaven. It is the person, body and soul, that longs for heaven.

 

[reggieM]

Note that I never meant to discuss evolution, but merely referred to it to make a point. I just did a search on banned topics and evolution did not come up.

It’s not banned any more. If discussions get heated on it (they haven’t been as bad) then they’ll be shut down by the moderators but other than that we can debate it.

 

[GEddie]

It’s not banned any more. If discussions get heated on it (they haven’t been as bad) then they’ll be shut down by the moderators but other than that we can debate it.

Good to know. When was that announced? I missed it.

 

[reggieM]

Good to know. When was that announced? I missed it.

I was not active here when the ban was lifted. I was quite active when it was in place and every time I tried to argue against evolution the thread was closed with a warning. Additionally, there were stickies on just about every forum-group stating that Evolution debates were banned. When I came back (just this year), all of those warnings were gone and I’ve freely debated evolution (with threads even with evolution in the title) several times with no problem at all. So some time in the past 5 years if that helps.

I have my own personal opinion on why the ban was lifted but it doesn’t matter of course - it’s just that it’s an open topic now.

 

[Eric_Hyom]

Did God create us (with these physical bodies) for a specific purpose?

Before creation began, was it God’s plan that he would love each and everyone of us as he loves himself? Can God have any greater purpose to create children in his own image?

Possibly Adam and Eve were created more in the image of God than we are. They seemed to have both glorified and physical bodies, but the glorified body could only be maintained by eating from the tree of life. We know the tree of life was only available to them whilst they obeyed God.

 

[setarcos]

The inner life of man is greatly hindered in this life by the needs of the body. Thus, the Prophet devoutly prays that he may be set free from them, saying, “Lord, deliver me from my necessities!” Woe to those who refuse to recognize their own wretchedness, and doubly woe to those who love this miserable and corruptible life! For some cling so closely to it, that although by working or begging they can hardly win the bare necessities, they would yet be willing to live here for ever if it were possible, caring nothing for the Kingdom of God.
–The Imitation of Christ
Here’s what I’m going by. Yes, we believe that there will be a new Heaven and a new Earth, but in the meantime, I assume that the soul will be in Heaven without a body. Am I missing something?

366 The Church teaches that every spiritual soul is created immediately by God - it is not “produced” by the parents - and also that it is immortal: it does not perish when it separates from the body at death, and it will be reunited with the body at the final Resurrection.

I would only add that the needs of the body have become a burden because of their corruption and precarious availability. If the needs of the body are always and perfectly provided by God they would cease to be burdensome. Also the souls immortality is contingent upon God. Scripture says we should be afraid of the one who can not only destroy the body but the soul as well. My only contention is that if we are to remain human we must retain some semblance of a human body. Salvation is offered to humans. Adam and Eve were created human. As soon as we stop being human then salvation becomes meaningless. It would be like an ecologist striving to save an endangered frog and then manipulating the frogs genetics in order to achieve this end. What would be the point of trying to save the frog if in the end it is no longer the same species? The frog that the original salvation was for would be gone anyway.

 

[ANV]

From what I gather, the soul wants to be reunited with God, from which it came, but it cannot because it’s contained within the body.

Please explain why Saint Paul says: “Miserable one that I am! Who will deliver me from this mortal body?” (Rom. 7:24)

Like with Saint Paul, I ask the same question of myself.

There are many who love this miserable and corrupt physical life to the degree they care nothing about God’s Heavenly Kingdom! Tell me please, where would you rather be?

“The body, which gives you during life a form,
Is but your vase: be not deceived, my soul!
Cheap is the bowl for storing honey in,
But precious for the contents of the bowl.”
~ Al-Ma’arri

 

[GEddie]

“The body, which gives you during life a form,
Is but your vase: be not deceived, my soul!
Cheap is the bowl for storing honey in,
But precious for the contents of the bowl.”
~ Al-Ma’arri

Quoting someone most folks have never heard of isn’t an argument!

Besides, the human body isn’t like a vase at all (which, when it breaks, the flowers it held are thrown away), or like a honey jar (which, when the product it held is eaten up and is no more, is simply thrown out); it enables “the soul” (which on its own is NOT a human being) to see, smell, move and otherwise live life!

ICXC NIKA

 

[phil19034]

For example, to build and complete the world we are in now? If not, why did God create us with physical bodies instead of glorified bodies right from the start?

Did Adam and Eve have physical or glorified bodies before the fall?

Were Adam and Eve able to conceive children prior to the fall? Will we be able to conceive children when we are given glorified bodies?

“The LORD God made for the man and his wife garments of skin, with which he clothed them.” --Genesis 3:21

Does the above passage suggest that they then became physical beings?

Adam and Eve had physical bodies before the fall.

God created us as physical beings so we could live in the physical universe.

Think of it like this:

1. God is outside of space-time
2. God is in heaven
3. If God is outside of space-time, then it’s reasonable to assume that heaven is outside of space-time too.
4. God created the universe that is inside space-time.
5. Our universe is inside space-time
6. Therefore, if God didn’t create us with physical bodies, it would be safe to assume that our universe would be pretty empty.

 

[ANV]

Quoting someone most folks have never heard of isn’t an argument!

Besides, the human body isn’t like a vase at all (which, when it breaks, the flowers it held are thrown away), or like a honey jar (which, when the product it held is eaten up and is no more, is simply thrown out); it enables “the soul” (which on its own is NOT a human being) to see, smell, move and otherwise live life!

ICXC NIKA

My post was to Robert, if you never heard of him that doesn’t mean anything, many people are “unworthy” but popular and many others are “worthy” but unpopular, besides he was very popular in his area and era, if he was western, he would have been quite very known.

But regardless the writer, it is about the argument itself that you should consider.

 

[GEddie]

My post was to Robert, if you never heard of him that doesn’t mean anything, many people are “unworthy” but popular and many others are “worthy” but unpopular, besides he was very popular in his area and era, if he was western, he would have been quite very known.

But regardless the writer, it is about the argument itself that you should consider.

OK, but poetry is still not an argument.

And I addressed how our bodies are in no way like a vase or a honey pot (although some can, like honey pots, become repositories for large amounts of caloric storage, lol).

Flowers lose nothing by not being in a vase, in fact would be better off alive and on their plants; likewise honey doesn’t care if it is in a jar or in the beehive it came from. But a soul without body is deprived of everything that makes life life.

Argument, not poetry!

ICXC NIKA