Did Moses write Genesis?

[NotWorthy]

SpiritMeadow, are you calling me a Fundamentalist?

Why do you think that?

 

[NotWorthy]

Romans 10:5 - Moses writes about the righteousness that comes from (the) law, "The one who does these things will live by them."

2 Corinthians 3:15 - To this day, in fact, whenever Moses is read, a veil lies over their hearts,

John 1:45 - ***Philip found Nathanael and told him, “We have found the one about whom Moses wrote in the law, and also the prophets, Jesus, son of Joseph, from Nazareth.”

---

It seems clear to me that the inspired authors of the NT certainly felt that Moses wrote the Torah.

 

[edwest2]

The Bible was assembled by the guiding hand of the Holy Spirit of God. The Church today is guided by the Holy Spirit of God.

Since it’s Open Season on fundamentalists, let me say this. What part of the Bible do you want to throw out? And why?

In Church, after reading from the Gospel, what do you hear: “This is the word of the Lord.” Why is that? Not the word of man but the word of God. “It is written, that man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God.” Luke 4:4

God bless,
Ed

 

[Valke2]

Yeah, I was gonna say… didn’t it talk about Moses death??? How could he write about his own death

The death of Moses is not in Genesis.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Why, Vern, is this? God could certainly have had the author of these books write it so that it is attuned over countless generations.

God could have had Moses write on a computer and save it to CD. But He didn’t.

God could have had the author of Genesis explain Relativity, the Big Bang and nuclear physics. But He didn’t.

You can read the Bible from end to end, and see that the Inspired Writers wrote so people of their own times could understand.

Moses certainly had enough time to write this stuff. He certainly had the opportunity to learn to write all this stuff. The five books, especially Genesis and Leviticus are certainly written in a different style, because they were written for different purposes. Just as we see different styles in all the four gospels.

Of course, one reason is that it’s different authors, but another reason is because it’s to a different audience.

Nevertheless, the evidence is that there were different authors – and the audiences are different because the various books were written at different times.

I have listed several pieces of evidence for multiple authorship and late redaction – for example, multiple versions of some of the most well-known stories, the reference to the Canaanites living in the land, the description of Moses’ funeral, and the highly developed rituals and accoutrements (which are more suited to a city-dwelling people than a nomadic tribe.)

 

[buffalo]

God could have had Moses write on a computer and save it to CD. But He didn’t.

God could have had the author of Genesis explain Relativity, the Big Bang and nuclear physics. But He didn’t.

You can read the Bible from end to end, and see that the Inspired Writers wrote so people of their own times could understand.

Nevertheless, the evidence is that there were different authors – and the audiences are different because the various books were written at different times.

I have listed several pieces of evidence for multiple authorship and late redaction – for example, multiple versions of some of the most well-known stories, the reference to the Canaanites living in the land, the description of Moses’ funeral, and the highly developed rituals and accoutrements (which are more suited to a city-dwelling people than a nomadic tribe.)

Vern, are you going to read The Toledoths of Genesis?

 

[vern_humphrey]

The death of Moses is not in Genesis.

Well, duh!

Genesis ends with the death of Joseph – who brought the Israelites into Egypt.

The story of Moses – who led them out of Egypt – is in the next book, Exodus, and those that follow.

The third book, Leviticus, is concerned with ritual and the law.

The fourth book, Numbers, deals with the two census and the wanderings after leaving Mount Sinai.

The fifth book, Deuteronomy, is in the form of a sermon by Moses, which recapitulates the law and other matters in the first four books.

 

[NotWorthy]

I have listed several pieces of evidence for multiple authorship and late redaction – for example, multiple versions of some of the most well-known stories, the reference to the Canaanites living in the land, the description of Moses’ funeral, and the highly developed rituals and accoutrements (which are more suited to a city-dwelling people than a nomadic tribe.)

Tell me again of the Canaanites living in the land. The highly developed rituals and accoutrements are for the Levites and their timeless rituals. I don’t see your point in that argument. Are you referring to the fact that the accoutrements were not very portable?

 

[vern_humphrey]

Tell me again of the Canaanites living in the land. The highly developed rituals and accoutrements are for the Levites and their timeless rituals. I don’t see your point in that argument. Are you referring to the fact that the accoutrements were not very portable?

Let’s start with a simple fact – Moses never reached the Promised Land. He died before the Israelites crossed over the Jordan.

So why did Moses feel it necessary to remind his readers that the Canaanites were then living in the land – as if it were something in the far distant past? That would be appropriate if the redaction occurred hundreds of years after Moses’ death – but not while he was still alive!!

The highly-developed rituals and accoutrements are suitable for a sedentary priesthood, not for nomads – which the Israelites were in Moses’ lifetime.

 

[SpiritMeadow]

SpiritMeadow, are you calling me a Fundamentalist?

Why do you think that?

sure wasn’t…I wasn’t speaking of anyone in particular.

 

[SpiritMeadow]

The Bible was assembled by the guiding hand of the Holy Spirit of God. The Church today is guided by the Holy Spirit of God.

Since it’s Open Season on fundamentalists, let me say this. What part of the Bible do you want to throw out? And why?

In Church, after reading from the Gospel, what do you hear: “This is the word of the Lord.” Why is that? Not the word of man but the word of God. “It is written, that man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God.” Luke 4:4

God bless,
Ed

Why do you think anyone wants to throw out anything? That would be Luther who wanted to do that. To suggest that all is not self-evident on its face in the bible is not to argue to remove any of it. When you read the bible as science, you have lost its true meaning in the first place.

The gospel reading concludes that way because its the location of what proports to be the ony recorded sayings of Jesus. I see no need to read anything more into it. We certainly aren’t directed to do anything further. My translation of Luke 4:4 is "But Jesus says, Human beings live not on bread alone. NJB. In any case, that verse doesnt speak to any bible or scripture at all.

The question remains, why do you cling to outmoded and thoroughly disproven ideas by torturing scripture to fit into some predetermined personal belief system? The church doesnt require it, so you need to do it why? When you can answer that, you will get it.

 

[NotWorthy]

Let’s start with a simple fact – Moses never reached the Promised Land. He died before the Israelites crossed over the Jordan.

OK, so you’ve just proven that Moses didn’t write the end of Exodus. I’m cool with that. It’s commonly accepted that Isaiah didn’t write the end of Isaiah or that John didn’t write the end of John.

So why did Moses feel it necessary to remind his readers that the Canaanites were then living in the land – as if it were something in the far distant past? That would be appropriate if the redaction occurred hundreds of years after Moses’ death – but not while he was still alive!!

The Torah is rather large. What verses are you referring to?

The highly-developed rituals and accoutrements are suitable for a sedentary priesthood, not for nomads – which the Israelites were in Moses’ lifetime.

So, are you saying that God didn’t demand these rituals while they were in the wilderness. He waited til they settled in Canaan?

 

[vern_humphrey]

OK, so you’ve just proven that Moses didn’t write the end of Exodus. I’m cool with that. It’s commonly accepted that Isaiah didn’t write the end of Isaiah or that John didn’t write the end of John.

The pericope is question is in** Genesis**.

6 Abram passed through the land as far as the sacred place at Shechem, by the terebinth of Moreh. (The Canaanites were then in the land.)

(Genesis 12:6)

The Torah is rather large. What verses are you referring to?

See above.

Note however, that the Jewish tradition was the Moses wrote the Torah – all five books, not just Genesis.

So, are you saying that God didn’t demand these rituals while they were in the wilderness. He waited til they settled in Canaan?

Correct – read Leviticus 4:22 and following. It refers to princes – which didn’t exist in Moses’ time. Kings and princes came much later in Jewish history.

 

[marymol]

Not having read many of the posts , unsure if the main argument against Moses having written the five books is the fact that his death is mentioned in the last part of Deuteronomy ( and so he could not have written it ! )

But Chap 31, in Deuteronomy, we are told that Moses has given his authority over to Joshua and we have to assume that things from then on were in the hands of Josuha .

The first book in Gen. is probably a difficult book for many to accept in light of most of the prevailing scinctific know ledge ; yet that same science , now seem to come up with all sort of evidence to support that exact order of creation , as given in Gen. - including how light could be there before the sun and stars and so on …

Just as some of the jews, struggling with issues of acceptance of our Lord’s authority , thought He was born in Galilee , (and Messiah was to be from Judah - as He was !) , there might be more to the accepted ( ? jewish) tradition of Moses as the author, than the seeming human impossibilites .

Guess that as long as we concede the primary authorship to The Spirit of Truth and who ever was His tool , we are not erring !

Peace !

 

[cmunoz]

Question: “Who were the authors of the books of the Bible?”

Answer: Ultimately, above the human authors, the Bible was written by God. 2 Timothy 3:16 tells us that the Bible was “breathed out” by God. God superintended the human authors of the Bible so that while using their own writing styles and personalities, they still recorded exactly what God wanted to be said. The Bible was not dictated from God, but it was perfectly guided and entirely inspired by Him.

Humanly speaking, the Bible was written by approximately 40 men of diverse backgrounds over the course of 1500 years. Isaiah was a prophet, Ezra was a priest, Matthew was a tax-collector, John was a fisherman, Paul was a tentmaker, Moses was a shepherd. Despite being penned by different authors over 15 centuries, the Bible does not contradict itself and does not contain any errors. The authors all present different perspectives, but they all proclaim the same one true God, and the same one way of salvation—Jesus Christ (John 14:6; Acts 4:12). Few of the books of the Bible specifically name their author. Here are the books of the Bible along with the name of who is most assumed by Biblical scholars to be the author, along with the approximate date of authorship:

Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy = Moses - 1400 B.C.
Joshua = Joshua - 1350 B.C.
Judges, Ruth, 1 Samuel, 2 Samuel = Samuel / Nathan / Gad - 1000 - 900 B.C.
1 Kings, 2 Kings = Jeremiah - 600 B.C.
1 Chronicles, 2 Chronicles, Ezra, Nehemiah = Ezra - 450 B.C.
Esther = Mordecai - 400 B.C.
Job = Moses - 1400 B.C.
Psalms = several different authors, mostly David - 1000 - 400 B.C.
Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, Song of Solomon = Solomon - 900 B.C.
Isaiah = Isaiah - 700 B.C.
Jeremiah, Lamentations = Jeremiah - 600 B.C.
Ezekiel = Ezekiel - 550 B.C.
Daniel = Daniel - 550 B.C.
Hosea = Hosea - 750 B.C.
Joel = Joel - 850 B.C.
Amos = Amos - 750 B.C.
Obadiah = Obadiah - 600 B.C.
Jonah = Jonah - 700 B.C.
Micah = Micah - 700 B.C.
Nahum = Nahum - 650 B.C.
Habakkuk = Habakkuk - 600 B.C.
Zephaniah = Zephaniah - 650 B.C.
Haggai = Haggai - 520 B.C.
Zechariah = Zechariah - 500 B.C.
Malachi = Malachi - 430 B.C.
Matthew = Matthew - A.D. 55
Mark = John Mark - A.D. 50
Luke = Luke - A.D. 60
John = John - A.D. 90
Acts = Luke - A.D. 65
Romans, 1 Corinthians, 2 Corinthians, Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, 1 Thessalonians, 2 Thessalonians, 1 Timothy, 2 Timothy, Titus, Philemon = Paul - A.D. 50-70
Hebrews = unknown, best guesses are Paul, Luke, Barnabas, or Apollos - 65 A.D.
James = James - A.D. 45
1 Peter, 2 Peter = Peter - A.D. 60
1 John, 2 John, 3 John = John - A.D. 90
Jude = Jude - A.D. 60
Revelation = John - A.D. 90

 

[cmunoz]

Question: “Who were the authors of the books of the Bible?”

Answer: Ultimately, above the human authors, the Bible was written by God. 2 Timothy 3:16 tells us that the Bible was “breathed out” by God. God superintended the human authors of the Bible so that while using their own writing styles and personalities, they still recorded exactly what God wanted to be said. The Bible was not dictated from God, but it was perfectly guided and entirely inspired by Him.

Humanly speaking, the Bible was written by approximately 40 men of diverse backgrounds over the course of 1500 years. Isaiah was a prophet, Ezra was a priest, Matthew was a tax-collector, John was a fisherman, Paul was a tentmaker, Moses was a shepherd. Despite being penned by different authors over 15 centuries, the Bible does not contradict itself and does not contain any errors. The authors all present different perspectives, but they all proclaim the same one true God, and the same one way of salvation—Jesus Christ (John 14:6; Acts 4:12). Few of the books of the Bible specifically name their author. Here are the books of the Bible along with the name of who is most assumed by Biblical scholars to be the author, along with the approximate date of authorship:

Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy = Moses - 1400 B.C.
Joshua = Joshua - 1350 B.C.
Judges, Ruth, 1 Samuel, 2 Samuel = Samuel / Nathan / Gad - 1000 - 900 B.C.
1 Kings, 2 Kings = Jeremiah - 600 B.C.
1 Chronicles, 2 Chronicles, Ezra, Nehemiah = Ezra - 450 B.C.
Esther = Mordecai - 400 B.C.
Job = Moses - 1400 B.C.
Psalms = several different authors, mostly David - 1000 - 400 B.C.
Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, Song of Solomon = Solomon - 900 B.C.
Isaiah = Isaiah - 700 B.C.
Jeremiah, Lamentations = Jeremiah - 600 B.C.
Ezekiel = Ezekiel - 550 B.C.
Daniel = Daniel - 550 B.C.
Hosea = Hosea - 750 B.C.
Joel = Joel - 850 B.C.
Amos = Amos - 750 B.C.
Obadiah = Obadiah - 600 B.C.
Jonah = Jonah - 700 B.C.
Micah = Micah - 700 B.C.
Nahum = Nahum - 650 B.C.
Habakkuk = Habakkuk - 600 B.C.
Zephaniah = Zephaniah - 650 B.C.
Haggai = Haggai - 520 B.C.
Zechariah = Zechariah - 500 B.C.
Malachi = Malachi - 430 B.C.
Matthew = Matthew - A.D. 55
Mark = John Mark - A.D. 50
Luke = Luke - A.D. 60
John = John - A.D. 90
Acts = Luke - A.D. 65
Romans, 1 Corinthians, 2 Corinthians, Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, 1 Thessalonians, 2 Thessalonians, 1 Timothy, 2 Timothy, Titus, Philemon = Paul - A.D. 50-70
Hebrews = unknown, best guesses are Paul, Luke, Barnabas, or Apollos - 65 A.D.
James = James - A.D. 45
1 Peter, 2 Peter = Peter - A.D. 60
1 John, 2 John, 3 John = John - A.D. 90
Jude = Jude - A.D. 60
Revelation = John - A.D. 90

www.gotquestions.org

 

[NotWorthy]

(Genesis 12:6)

6 Abram passed through the land as far as the sacred place at Shechem, by the terebinth of Moreh. (The Canaanites were then in the land.

 

[NotWorthy]

Vern, what did Jesus mean when he said, “…* For if you had believed Moses, you would have believed me, because he wrote about me*”?

 

[vern_humphrey]

I noticed that the sentence in question is in parenthesis. Would that indicate that it was added later on? I notice that several times in the NT. For instance, when John 5:3 is included in the text (and not the footnotes), it seems to always be placed in parenthesis.

Punctuation, including parentheses, did not exist in ancient times. All the punctuation you see in the Bible was added in modern times.

And indeed, this parenthetical phrase was not in the original – it was added later, when the oral stories were written down. And that came hundreds of years after Moses – as the addition indicates.

The only other mention I see of “princes” in the OT is in 2nd Chronicles 21:4 - If you notice, in our idea of “kingdoms”, the princes would be the brothers and sons of Jehoram. Hence, this phrase, “all his brothers and also some of the princes of Israel” would seem redundant. Do the Jews have a different meaning for “prince”, such as someone who is rather powerful?

The usage is the same as in English. Princes and Kings emerged among the Israelites long after the time of Moses.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Vern, what did Jesus mean when he said, “…* For if you had believed Moses, you would have believed me, because he wrote about me*”?

He said it following Jewist tradition of the day – would you have Him say, “For if you had believed Whoever It Was Who Wrote The Torah, you would have believed me, because he wrote about me?”