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historyb
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I would not compromise my values, if that means the guest is insulted that can’t be helped. I’d rather insult someone than compromise my Christianity and give rise to the appearance of scandal
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elts1956
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Harden not our hearts.!!!
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elts1956
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sola_scriptura
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Been there done that
Actually I’ve visited Rome like three times in my life so far. It’s OK (Florence is way better though as is Tuscany generally speaking – although the Vatican, no joke it is definitely the most awesome work of art on earth). The outskirts of Rome (outside of the city proper – where all the historical stuff is) generally speaking, a sewer. Almost as bad as Milan (where there are transvestite hookers everywhere – it’s disgusting, I wished I was in my HUMVEE with a 50 cal).Germany, a very neat sewer (and Germans are freaks – since they already have brothels in every town they slip over the Czech border for little girls). The English – much more normal, but you need to know how to brawl (because that’s their favorite recreational activity). Ireland – never been (except for like a minute to refuel). All I can say about Europe is it’s better than Iraq.
The moral of the story — thank God I’m American!!!
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elts1956
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This was MY SARCASM and FRUSTRATION with some on this thread who, like the Pharisees, believe the law must be followed to the final dot, or else…is there anyone who thought this?
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sola_scriptura
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I still liked what the soldiers at Guantanamo did with the Quran better
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elts1956
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What did they do? Oh no, not really. Really?? Yuk!I still liked what the soldiers at Guantanamo did with the Quran better
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sola_scriptura
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hey … when you gotta go you gotta go? They got in trouble though (which I think was a sham). The politically correct crowd slamming the little guy —
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inJESUS
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the Pope wasn’t compromising his Christianity, he’d be compromising Christians if he insulted whatever was in his hands…Muslims’ resorting to violence and killing is pretty easy.
There is not one sane Muslim who gave the gesture more than it deserves…
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historyb
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I’m not, using my head.
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historyb
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PJ2 went to far and many things and tis was just one of them.
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elts1956
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Harden not our heads. Fell right into that one didn’t you? I love it.
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historyb
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Kinda hard not to, our skulls our hard already.Harden not our heads. Fell right into that one didn’t you? I love it.
What the Pope did was wrong plain and simple and I will never change my mind on that, just like his letting pagans worship in St. Francis of Assisi Church when he had that big conference.
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elts1956
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Okay Cotton, have it your way. What big conference is that? My head is not only hard, but unfortunately empty.Kinda hard not to, our skulls our hard already.
What the Pope did was wrong plain and simple and I will never change my mind on that, just like his letting pagans worship in St. Francis of Assisi Church when he had that big conference.
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historyb
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The one in Assisi with all the religions represented.Okay Cotton, have it your way. What big conference is that? My head is not only hard, but unfortunately empty.
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estesbob
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And what was wrong with that?
John Paul II was one of the greatest popes of all time. I guess after he is canonized you will have to accept that as being a devout Catholic you know the church cannot err in canonizing Saints
Why do I get the feeling that your main complaint about John Paul theGreat is that he did not declare Vatican II to be null and void.
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historyb
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He let pagans use the Church it was covered, and while you can spin it you can’t deny it.
That I have always disagreed with. I think he was a good pope, but not the greatest by far with all the many others in comparison. I do believe the Church can err
Wouldn’t care either way
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elts1956
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From the bit I have read, St. Francis of Assisi was probably one of the first known liberals of the Catholic faith in that his rule towards others was "
“Whoever arrives among you, friend or enemy, thief or brigand, welcome him with goodwill.”
“In October 1986, the United Nations International Year of Peace, Pope John Paul II brought together some 90 religious leaders of diverse faiths in recognition of the vital role of all the worldís religions in promoting a spirit of mutual understanding and tolerance as prerequisites to a peaceful world. They came together in Assisi, Italy, where centuries earlier, St. Francis of Assisi walked gently on the earth promoting values of love, the simple life, a respect for nature and all of God’s creation.”
iipt.org/Assi-WEBSITE/assisihome.html
I can find no substantiation that the Conference of 1986 was held OUTSIDE the Basilica. It is my understanding, it was not.
“Interfaith meetings held outside the basilica, meanwhile, have made Assisi an unofficial capital of interreligious dialogue. Two attended by John Paul II in 1986 and 2002 attracted a sea of religious leaders, ranging from imams and Buddhist monks to native American dancers and African animists”
catholicnews.com/jpii/stories/story04.htm
“Pope John Paul was convinced that prayer could bring believers together, an idea that inspired the 1986 World Day of Prayer for Peace in Assisi, Italy.”
“That unprecedented gathering at the pope’s invitation drew leaders of Jews, Buddhists, Shintoists, Muslims, Zoroastrians, Hindus, Unitarians, traditional African and Native American religions and many others. Together, under the roof of the Basilica of St. Francis, they all prayed, side by side, with Catholic, Orthodox and Protestant leaders for world peace.”
Apparently much unorthodox worship, especially by the African animists, shocked liberals and conservatives alike. Whether Pope John Paul and the friars at Assisi knew beforehand what was going to happen in these rituals, I do not know and don’t know if anyone else does, or not.
However, I think the striving for peaceful relations among the Religions of the World, was and is, a spectacular idea. How can nations of the World dialogue and have peace if religions are unable to do so?
Pope Benedict XVI has come down hard on the Franciscan Friars in Assisi and has removed therr autonomy and placed them under the direction of the local Bishop. I don’t know what path toward shared community and peace among religions will take now. A shame.
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