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BornAgain2010

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the Bible says you shouldnt judge, right…
so then, whats the difference between judgement versus opinion? (applied to both persons AND circumstances)

also what do you do with the clergy if you cant get along with some of them?

and what is the practicality of justification? or is it merely a well-hidden excuse for something?

Answer and discuss…
 
  1. The bible says that Jesus says we should stop judging. We are to offer fraternal correction, however.
  2. ❤️:gopray2:
  3. :confused:
 
One is allowed and should judge actions of another. What we are not to stand in judgment of is another’s soul. If I have a friend who keeps stealing things, I know that action is wrong and should judge that action as wrong. However, I cannot judge my friend’s soul saying he is going to hell because that would be the judgement that only God can give.
 
  1. The bible says that Jesus says we should stop judging. We are to offer fraternal correction, however.
  2. ❤️:gopray2:
  3. :confused:
the clergymen I was talking about is a Deacon. Ive known him for sometime. He’s crazy nit-picky though. But other than that we get along fine. I still respect the guy, and I always do whatever he needs help with. We’ve never had arguments or even heated words between each other. Im too scared to say anything to him :o

Hes just so nit-picky and every once in a blue moon he’ll make a comment that’ll get to me. Im like 99% sure its my own issue. Hes a great Deacon though. He does alot for our Parish. Its just my ignorance that gets in the way. 😦

I just hope and pray that God helps me to get over my own issues about stuff like that.

I like your third answer though. its like, “yeah, ya got me. I…dont know.” me too, thats my take on the issue of justification. 😛
 
One is allowed and should judge actions of another. What we are not to stand in judgment of is another’s soul. If I have a friend who keeps stealing things, I know that action is wrong and should judge that action as wrong. However, I cannot judge my friend’s soul saying he is going to hell because that would be the judgement that only God can give.
Correct. 👍
 
the clergymen I was talking about is a Deacon. Ive known him for sometime. He’s crazy nit-picky though. But other than that we get along fine. I still respect the guy, and I always do whatever he needs help with. We’ve never had arguments or even heated words between each other. Im too scared to say anything to him :o

Hes just so nit-picky and every once in a blue moon he’ll make a comment that’ll get to me. Im like 99% sure its my own issue. Hes a great Deacon though. He does alot for our Parish. Its just my ignorance that gets in the way. 😦

I just hope and pray that God helps me to get over my own issues about stuff like that.

I like your third answer though. its like, “yeah, ya got me. I…dont know.” me too, thats my take on the issue of justification. 😛
The catechism has a bit to say on justification:

I. JUSTIFICATION

1987 The grace of the Holy Spirit has the power to justify us, that is, to cleanse us from our sins and to communicate to us “the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ” and through Baptism:

But if we have died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him. For we know that Christ being raised from the dead will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him. The death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God. So you also must consider yourselves as dead to sin and alive to God in Christ Jesus.

**1988 **Through the power of the Holy Spirit we take part in Christ’s Passion by dying to sin, and in his Resurrection by being born to a new life; we are members of his Body which is the Church, branches grafted onto the vine which is himself:

[God] gave himself to us through his Spirit. By the participation of the Spirit, we become communicants in the divine nature. . . . For this reason, those in whom the Spirit dwells are divinized.

1989 The first work of the grace of the Holy Spirit is conversion, effecting justification in accordance with Jesus’ proclamation at the beginning of the Gospel: "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand."38 Moved by grace, man turns toward God and away from sin, thus accepting forgiveness and righteousness from on high. "Justification is not only the remission of sins, but also the sanctification and renewal of the interior man.

1990 Justification detaches man from sin which contradicts the love of God, and purifies his heart of sin. Justification follows upon God’s merciful initiative of offering forgiveness. It reconciles man with God. It frees from the enslavement to sin, and it heals.

1991 Justification is at the same time the acceptance of God’s righteousness through faith in Jesus Christ. Righteousness (or “justice”) here means the rectitude of divine love. With justification, faith, hope, and charity are poured into our hearts, and obedience to the divine will is granted us.

1992 Justification has been merited for us by the Passion of Christ who offered himself on the cross as a living victim, holy and pleasing to God, and whose blood has become the instrument of atonement for the sins of all men. Justification is conferred in Baptism, the sacrament of faith. It conforms us to the righteousness of God, who makes us inwardly just by the power of his mercy. Its purpose is the glory of God and of Christ, and the gift of eternal life:

But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from law, although the law and the prophets bear witness to it, the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: since all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, they are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus, whom God put forward as an expiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God’s righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins; it was to prove at the present time that he himself is righteous and that he justifies him who has faith in Jesus.

1993 Justification establishes cooperation between God’s grace and man’s freedom. On man’s part it is expressed by the assent of faith to the Word of God, which invites him to conversion, and in the cooperation of charity with the prompting of the Holy Spirit who precedes and preserves his assent:

When God touches man’s heart through the illumination of the Holy Spirit, man himself is not inactive while receiving that inspiration, since he could reject it; and yet, without God’s grace, he cannot by his own free will move himself toward justice in God’s sight.

1994 Justification is the most excellent work of God’s love made manifest in Christ Jesus and granted by the Holy Spirit. It is the opinion of St. Augustine that “the justification of the wicked is a greater work than the creation of heaven and earth,” because “heaven and earth will pass away but the salvation and justification of the elect . . . will not pass away.” He holds also that the justification of sinners surpasses the creation of the angels in justice, in that it bears witness to a greater mercy.

1995 The Holy Spirit is the master of the interior life. By giving birth to the “inner man,” justification entails the sanctification of his whole being:

Just as you once yielded your members to impurity and to greater and greater iniquity, so now yield your members to righteousness for sanctification. . . . But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the return you get is sanctification and its end, eternal life.
 
the Bible says you shouldnt judge, right…
Our Lord Jesus Christ told us that we will be judged in the same manner and severity that we judge others.

Mt 7:1 Judge not, that you may not be judged,
Mt 7:2 For with what judgment you judge, you shall be judged: and with what measure you mete, it shall be measured to you again.

These two verses should be taken as a whole and not split. Quite frankly, human nature will judge, regardlessly. But Our Lord Jesus Christ told us to expect the same type of judgement that we ourselves use. If we judge harshly then we will be dealt with harshly and if we judge kindly, then kindness will be return.
 
Our Lord Jesus Christ told us that we will be judged in the same manner and severity that we judge others.

Mt 7:1 Judge not, that you may not be judged,
Mt 7:2 For with what judgment you judge, you shall be judged: and with what measure you mete, it shall be measured to you again.

These two verses should be taken as a whole and not split. Quite frankly, human nature will judge, regardlessly. But Our Lord Jesus Christ told us to expect the same type of judgement that we ourselves use. If we judge harshly then we will be dealt with harshly and if we judge kindly, then kindness will be return.
Judgment: bad. :mad: Fraternal correction: good. 👍 From the catechism:

1829 The fruits of charity are joy, peace, and mercy; charity demands beneficence and fraternal correction; it is benevolence; it fosters reciprocity and remains disinterested and generous; it is friendship and communion: Love is itself the fulfillment of all our works. There is the goal; that is why we run: we run toward it, and once we reach it, in it we shall find rest.

We must know what to correct and when to correct it, that’s all.
 
Judgment: bad. :mad: Fraternal correction: good. 👍 From the catechism:

1829 The fruits of charity are joy, peace, and mercy; charity demands beneficence and fraternal correction; it is benevolence; it fosters reciprocity and remains disinterested and generous; it is friendship and communion: Love is itself the fulfillment of all our works. There is the goal; that is why we run: we run toward it, and once we reach it, in it we shall find rest.

We must know what to correct and when to correct it, that’s all.
in your signature what exactly is he refering to? :confused:
 
Judgment: bad. :mad: Fraternal correction: good. 👍 From the catechism:

1829
The fruits of charity are joy, peace, and mercy; charity demands beneficence and fraternal correction; it is benevolence; it fosters reciprocity and remains disinterested and generous; it is friendship and communion: Love is itself the fulfillment of all our works. There is the goal; that is why we run: we run toward it, and once we reach it, in it we shall find rest.

We must know what to correct and when to correct it, that’s all.
I think that you are wrong. The catechism says that fraternal correction is good but it does not say that judgment is bad. On the contrary, I would say that proper judgement is good and necessary and it is one of the components of the Cardinal Virtue of Justice. You cannot be just without proper judgement.
 
I think that you are wrong. The catechism says that fraternal correction is good but it does not say that judgment is bad. On the contrary, I would say that proper judgement is good and necessary and it is one of the components of the Cardinal Virtue of Justice. You cannot be just without proper judgement.
We cannot offer correction without having made at least some level of personal judgment, but we are reminded of our Lord’s words regarding judgment, so as to temper our desire to judge.
 
We cannot offer correction without having made at least some level of personal judgment, but we are reminded of our Lord’s words regarding judgment, so as to temper our desire to judge.
I completely agree with you on this statement. Thanks for the clarification of your thoughts.
 
Judgment: bad. :mad: Fraternal correction: good. 👍 From the catechism:

1829 The fruits of charity are joy, peace, and mercy; charity demands beneficence and fraternal correction; it is benevolence; it fosters reciprocity and remains disinterested and generous; it is friendship and communion: Love is itself the fulfillment of all our works. There is the goal; that is why we run: we run toward it, and once we reach it, in it we shall find rest.

We must know what to correct and when to correct it, that’s all.
That was quite slick of you but still it doesn’t have any bearing on the subject. Do you realize that you just tried to use the catechism to contradict Holy Scripture? Naughty, Naughty :tsktsk:
 
That was quite slick of you but still it doesn’t have any bearing on the subject. Do you realize that you just tried to use the catechism to contradict Holy Scripture? Naughty, Naughty :tsktsk:
I will readily admit that I did not completely understand the main point that the OP was hinting at, thus my initial responses were somewhat cryptic in nature. However, you seem to impute some ulterior motive to my quoting of the catechism.

Please tell us what the OP was asking and why you seem to think that I had an occult motive. I remain, perplexedly yours,

po18guy
 
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