Discuss: Married Sexuality

[Julianna]

I imagine it depends on a mans testosterone levels since that is also the sex hormone. A man with high levels of testosterone is going to have a harder time controlling his urge. As men age their testosterone levels decrease, and the aches and pains associated with intercourse increase…making the actual desire probably much less frequent.

If God gives a man (or woman) a high testosterone level then we assume it was for a reason. King David certainly seemed to one of those men, why else would he have so many concubines?

St Paul said that it is not preferable but it is acceptable to marry for concupiscence. I assume this is because self-control of this nature is virtually impossible for some people, therefore an accommodating wife is a huge blessing.

I am really trying to understand where you are coming from. A man having a hard time controlling his urge is not his wife’s problem, it’s his. So in your line of thinking, if a husband has a high testosterone level his wife must lie back and think of England everytime he has an urge, so he won’t cheat or do the M word?

Honey if he wants to cheat, he is going to…sex on demand from the wife is not going to stop that.

Have you talked your mother about this or a trusted female friend or even your ob/gyn? From your observations you must either be very young or very sheltered or both.

I’m just trying to understand so you don’t spend your life on your back everytime hubby wants some. It makes no sense whatsoever.

 

[violet81]

Julianna- I have been married 10 years.

I do NFP, so that knocks out about 2 weeks of mattress time…in case you are concerned.

 

[baylee]

I am really trying to understand where you are coming from. A man having a hard time controlling his urge is not his wife’s problem, it’s his. So in your line of thinking, if a husband has a high testosterone level his wife must lie back and think of England everytime he has an urge, so he won’t cheat or do the M word?

I think this post is what has been bothering me about this whole thread. It sounds to me that the OP has sex as often as possible more out of fear and a lack of trust. I do think that wives should be as open to having sex as often as possible (which I strive to do) but I also believe that the men should be able to control themselves as well. It’s a balance…which is how I see marriage in many areas, not just sex.

 

[cviolette]

I read a statistic saying that the majority of men in this country have intercourse 3x a week and do the M word 2x a week.

That would lead me to believe that 5x a week is what the average man needs to avoid sin.

I would have guessed higher on the M word.

 

[Julianna]

I would have guessed higher on the M word.

For sure.

 

[Julianna]

Julianna- I have been married 10 years.

I do NFP, so that knocks out about 2 weeks of mattress time…in case you are concerned.

Yep, sounds long enough for hubby to understand, you are not a light switch.

It’s been close to 30 for me. I still am not sure why you state statistics and seem more inclined to “please” a man whenever, without considering your own needs. Statistics ring hollow when it’s just the two of you.

 

[searching04]

Some people have said this should not be discussed and others have said they like it being discussed.

Whose opinion is more valid?

I think that the choice to discuss it is a choice we should be able to have without condescension and belittling.

I’m only catching up after a few days of not reading. I’m with violet81 here, especially as I have posted some major questions and opinions as well. This topic - married sex - and all its variances, questions, issues, concerns, misunderstandings, disagreements, etc, needs to be discussed. If it wasn’t an issue, and if Catholics didn’t have such an issue with it and church teachings, then it wouldn’t appear so often in the boards.

Some people are farther along in their faith with sex and church teachings; some of us struggle daily. Some take the teachings as they are because the church says so; some of us question the heck out of it. Hence the discussions.

 

[searching04]

there is so much wrong with your conclusion.

I’d say or guess that the “average man” in this or other surveys probably isn’t Catholic or isn’t following Catholic teachings (using birth control of whatever sort), because if a Catholic was having sex five times a week, I’d say they are quite open to having (more) kids!

I’d also say “yippee!” for anyone having sex five times a week. I’d be in heaven, maybe…

Point overall is still that frequency of relations is between the husband and wife, and if a wife is willing to freely engage in sex that often to be there for her husband (and vice versa for any lucky man whose wife is that interested), then so be it. Good for them!

Frequencey is not going to necessarily take aware from the unitive/procreative, nor is a routine, nor is it going to make sex something less than God intended. And it is not, nor should it be, dictated by the church.

 

[searching04]

Yep, sounds long enough for hubby to understand, you are not a light switch.

It’s been close to 30 for me. I still am not sure why you state statistics and seem more inclined to “please” a man whenever, without considering your own needs. Statistics ring hollow when it’s just the two of you.

Why are you so concerned about how often violet81 and her husband engage in relations, or why she does so, and that he apparently learns or has to learn a lesson?

 

[twoangels]

Julianna- I have been married 10 years.

I do NFP, so that knocks out about 2 weeks of mattress time…in case you are concerned.

Didn’t this whole discussion start up in another thread where you were questioning or arguing whether NFP was morally legimate. I thought that you had been saying that because of the marriage debt, NFP couldn’t be morally legimate. Maybe that was someone else.

In regards to your comments about how frequently mastubation occurs in men, my understanding is that while very prolonged periods of abstainence can lead a man to masturbation, if its going on in shorter periods, its almost a seperate urge all together.

Its like modesty. Certainly women, especially young women, should not be dressing provacatively. This can definitely lead a man into sin. But, there is a point where a man still does have to practice his own self control. Certainly a woman can dress modestly without dressing in the most conservative Muslim women’s outfits where only her eyes are visable. Everything has to be within reason and ultimately the frequency and periods of abstainence will be something individual to the couple and for them to come to an agreement on.

 

[violet81]

Didn’t this whole discussion start up in another thread where you were questioning or arguing whether NFP was morally legimate. I thought that you had been saying that because of the marriage debt, NFP couldn’t be morally legimate. Maybe that was someone else.

I am practicing NFP because my husband wants to, not because I want to. In the past it was the other way around…I wanted to and he did not want to. My husband is not a Catholic and though he accepts NFP he is very frustrated by the abstinence period and usually tries to convince me to do “other stuff”… and I have to stand my ground.

I wasn’t arguing that it wasn’t morally legitimate, I was arguing that it is often detrimental to a marriage and easily used with a contraceptive mentality. I KNOW my husband uses it with a contraceptive mentality, but what am I going to do about it? I can’t force him to have another baby.

 

[baylee]

Why are you so concerned about how often violet81 and her husband engage in relations, or why she does so, and that he apparently learns or has to learn a lesson?

Wasn’t it violet81 who started this thread discussing how often she and her husband engage in relations…not to mention the numerous posts that seem to push the idea that their frequency is what’s best for married couples?

 

[C_S_P_B]

Wasn’t it violet81 who started this thread discussing how often she and her husband engage in relations…not to mention the numerous posts that seem to push the idea that their frequency is what’s best for married couples?

That is kind of a snarky comment. Although it may seem innocent, what is conveyed seems like you are shaming her.

Maybe women that like sex and frequently engage in the marital union with their husbands are threatening. Such “favors” are often used by wives as means to control husbands, and giving up such powerful control is a scary thing, it might even lead to general happiness and husbands appreciating their wives more!

 

[violet81]

Wasn’t it violet81 who started this thread discussing how often she and her husband engage in relations…not to mention the numerous posts that seem to push the idea that their frequency is what’s best for married couples?

I started this thread so the NFP thread wouldn’t get off topic.

It is my understanding that this is the RIGHT thing to do, to prevent problems in marriage. Clearly others disagree…but some people have responded with a tone that is downright condescending.

 

[baylee]

That is kind of a snarky comment. Although it may seem innocent, what is conveyed seems like you are shaming her.

Maybe women that like sex and frequently engage in the marital union with their husbands are threatening. Such “favors” are often used by wives as means to control husbands, and giving up such powerful control is a scary thing, it might even lead to general happiness and husbands appreciating their wives more!

My issue was with searching04 giving Julianna a call out for caring what the OP’s sex life is like. If a person is going to push their sex life online then she is going to get responses that she may or may not like…especially when she seems to be pushing that her way is the “right” way (which, btw, is condescending to those who don’t do it the “right” way). To slap someone on the wrist for questioning the OP is ridiculous. The OP put herself out there. I’m not shaming her but I’m not going to coddle her either.

 

[violet81]

I just wanted to get something off my chest:

I AM FULLY AWARE THIS DISCUSSION IS NOT EVERYONE’S CUP OF TEA

I did not start the thread in any kind of way to brag about my sex drive (that idea is laughable to me), to guilt women or men who disagree, or indulge an obsession for sex talk. Nor did I post it so that people could pat me on the head and tell me I don’t have to work so hard.

I did start the thread because similar issues were being brought up in multiple other threads. My answer to most of those threads was what was written here, so it seemed most efficient to just start a new thread on the topic.

This is the way I see it… God has a different plan for different families according to their personalities and needs. I have no doubt that some families out there might benefit by prioritizing sex as a unitive ritual…even if it isn’t everyday… If the reader is one of those families then God might use this thread to plant a seed.

If this thread pisses you off then it means either 1. you have some deeply rooted anti-sex attitudes, 2. you really believe my opinion is incorrect 3. God just isn’t calling you to this kind of arrangement.

I was quite open to hearing arguments that used Church resources, studies, or statistics. I think that actually belittling me or making accusations about my intent was unnecessary.

 

[C_S_P_B]

My issue was with searching04 giving Julianna a call out for caring what the OP’s sex life is like. If a person is going to push their sex life online then she is going to get responses that she may or may not like…especially when she seems to be pushing that her way is the “right” way (which, btw, is condescending to those who don’t do it the “right” way). To slap someone on the wrist for questioning the OP is ridiculous. The OP put herself out there. I’m not shaming her but I’m not going to coddle her either.

Are we still in highschool? I expect more mature behavior from women and I will call out any woman showing such childish behavior. If you expect to be treated like a lady, then act like one. I wish more men would make this clear.

 

[baylee]

I started this thread so the NFP thread wouldn’t get off topic.

It is my understanding that this is the RIGHT thing to do, to prevent problems in marriage. Clearly others disagree…but some people have responded with a tone that is downright condescending.

A number of posters have shown you that your thinking is NOT Church teaching…so how can it be “right”? It might work for your marriage, but that doesn’t mean it is right for all. I think it is your inability to re-evaluate the latter that has caused some posters to get annoyed with you…and come off condescending.

I have nothing against your posts and what you do in your marriage is your business, but I honestly am concerned for you. I think that things may seem great for you, but I seriously worry that your routine is based on fear and lack of trust. Maybe it’s not conscious, but I think you are afraid you will lose your husband if you don’t make yourself available to him every day…and I don’t think you trust his ability to control himself if you don’t make yourself available to him every day. You aren’t giving him an opportunity to grow in his faith and spirituality. It reminds me of a parent that is scared that something will happen to their child and doesn’t trust their child to make good choices, so they watch their every move and give them little freedom to grow up.

I hope I don’t sound mean violet. I really wonder whether this is what’s best for you, your husband and your marriage in the long run.

 

[baylee]

Are we still in highschool? I expect more mature behavior from women and I will call out any woman showing such childish behavior. If you expect to be treated like a lady, then act like one. I wish more men would make this clear.

Exactly what was *immature *CSPB? Because if you’re going to call a woman childish, I’d like to know what you call childish. I didn’t think she was being “childish”.

 

[C_S_P_B]

A number of posters have shown you that your thinking is NOT Church teaching…so how can it be “right”? It might work for your marriage, but that doesn’t mean it is right for all. I think it is your inability to re-evaluate the latter that has caused some posters to get annoyed with you…and come off condescending.

I have nothing against your posts and what you do in your marriage is your business, but I honestly am concerned for you. I think that things may seem great for you, but I seriously worry that your routine is based on fear and lack of trust. Maybe it’s not conscious, but I think you are afraid you will lose your husband if you don’t make yourself available to him every day…and I don’t think you trust his ability to control himself if you don’t make yourself available to him every day. You aren’t giving him an opportunity to grow in his faith and spirituality. It reminds me of a parent that is scared that something will happen to their child and doesn’t trust their child to make good choices, so they watch their every move and give them little freedom to grow up.

I hope I don’t sound mean violet. I really wonder whether this is what’s best for you, your husband and your marriage in the long run.

It seems very immature and catty to write this post. This is merely uses of manipulative shaming language in a projective manner. Also very uninformed, since violet81 has not advocated anything contrary to Catholic teaching.

I seem to remember something from Scott Hahn’s converstion story. When he was converting and his wife was not yet decided, then each resolved to daily (or frequent marital union) in order to preserve their marriage under the stressful situation.