Discussing homosexuality

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Lara said:
Most probably not safe. It’s not safe from within, with all sorts of people undermining it from within. And not safe from without. Read some articles about how statues are desecrated, how women activists parade naked in churches to make political points. Anyhow, your argument is a straw man argument. The level of harassment or violence gays are facing right now in 2018 in North America is highly overrated. The original person asking for safety in his post was likely referring mainly to the feeling that nobody would oppose him.
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Sorry friend, but you stated that there are no safe spaces being refuted with suggested examples is now what “strawman” means. Also, I don’t know if you know about the “gay panic defence” which is a legal defence in all states in the US bar two for killing someone when you find out they’re gay. In the US it is an on the books defence to kill someone when you find out they’re gay because it spooked you.

Physical safety is a real thing. Safety from harassment is equally real and valid. Remember; it is illegal for those statues in churches to be vandalised, it is also illegal for those protesters to enter your safe space (though they can protest outside). Your safe spaces are protected.
 
@Lara I subscribe to both your and @angel12 posts, both are simultaneously true.
 
Tis_Bearself said:
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Lara:
Gays themselves are notoriously violent with one another.
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Good grief…:roll_eyes:
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Dearest attorney@law bear, it is a notorious fact (often cited) within criminology.
 
adgloriam said:
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Alex337:
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adgloriam:
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Alex337:
So… your church is a safe space? Or is it violent? I’m confused.
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You’re not Catholic, but do feel free to go into a church and check for yourself.
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My meeting hall is very safe 🙂 Back when I was Catholic our cathedral was very safe.
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I find your posts mostly constituted by provocative questions -aiming to pick an argument- among other methods of polemic that don’t constitute fair play in a discussion. To start with, the outright unwillingness to see and grant due reason to the interlocutor.

Reproducing sophism drawing into false discussions.
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Actually they’re aimed at discussion. If someone makes a sweeping generalisation like “there are no safe spaces” then I like to find out if they actually believe it. I’m sorry if you didn’t see it that way.
 
Lara said:
When you read my line about religious people being stuffed into closets, did you feel even one pang of pain, knowing we have to hide our beliefs our whole life.
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Unless you live in China or some Muslim countries, you have NOT had to “hide your beliefs your whole life.”
And even if you do live there, that’s no excuse for mockery.
 
I have been entirely consistent. There are no safe spaces and we shouldn’t seek them. A 91-year-old Virginian lady in her home died this week because a helicopter crashed on her house.

Thank you adgloriam for recognizing the flaws in Alex’s argumentation.

I am curious how you believe two contradictory opinions can both be correct, though.
 
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Lara said:
I have been entirely consistent. There are no safe spaces and we shouldn’t seek them. A 91 year old lady in her home died this week because a helicopter crashed on her house.

Thank you adgloriam for recognizing the flaws in Alex’s argumentation.

I am curious how you believe two contradictory opinions can both be correct, though.
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Now friend, we create safe spaces but no one ever claimed they were helicopter-proof. 🙂 It’s about being safe from those who would abuse and harass, I thought this was clear?

If you don’t feel safe from those who would abuse and harass in your church then you should consult your priest.

What two contradictory views do you think I hold? I’d be happy to clarify.
 
Our views are contradictory and yet adgloriam had stated he believed in both.
 
Lara said:
It’s not safe in this forum, for instance. I thought it would be when I joined, but there are many non-Catholic beliefs floating around here.
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CAF is a place for discussion where many different viewpoints are likely to be encountered and yet you believe that you must be shielded here from any viewpoints with which you disagree?
Lara said:
It’s not empathy you want me to feel but payback. Only one group can be out of the closet, because the two viewpoints are at war. Take, for example, how children are being taught at school. If you are an LGBT supporter, you will think it’s fine to teach them homosexual relationships are okay, that there are diverse home configurations and they’re almost all okay. If you are a religious person, you will think it’s fine to teach them homosexual relations are sinful and oppose God. Only one can be right with God.
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We live in a pluralistic society in the US where all of us are likely to encounter many different ideas and beliefs, some with which we agree and some which we oppose or dislike. It’s possible for all these beliefs to exist and be discussed and debated at the same time in an open marketplace of ideas. You don’t have a right to exist in a society where you only encounter views with which you agree and all others must be suppressed.
 
I haven’t got a problem with people exchanging ideas. But I do have a problem with free speech being quashed, and with some points of view being shut down immediately.

The interesting thing is your last post shows you are coming around to my original point of view, that there is no “safe” place.
 
Lara said:
I haven’t got a problem with people exchanging ideas. But I do have a problem with free speech being quashed, and with some points of view being shut down immediately.

The interesting thing is your last post shows you are coming around to my original point of view, that there is no “safe” place.
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Not at all. There are plenty of safe spaces 🙂 Your church is one unless you go out on absurd limbs and fear helicopters. Which is, I admit, a somewhat funny fear.
 
Lara said:
The interesting thing is your last post shows you are coming around to my original point of view, that there is no “safe” place.
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If you mean that there are no places which are 100% safe, you’re right. I might get struck by lightning on a rainy day or run over at a crosswalk by a drunk driver. I guess I could stay home all the time to reduce the risk, but, as you mentioned, a helicopter might crash through my roof and kill me. But we can still do things to reduce the risk. If I wear a seat belt, I reduce the risk of being killed in an accident. If I choose to have sex with someone, I reduce the risk of being infected with an STD if I use a condom. If I don’t walk in relatively deserted areas at night, I reduce the risk of being mugged. And if I were the kind of person who got distressed by public nudity, I could reduce the risk of ever encountering such a thing if I avoided going to beaches frequented by nudists and by avoiding going to gay pride parades.
 
LifeSite News is not exactly a reliable source.

But to the extent the CDC is, this article is not showing that gays are necessarily violent with each other. It is showing that they are often victims of violence - some of which (such as when they were children, which is mentioned in the article) may very well be coming from people who are not gay.
 
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