Distinct Characteristics of Latria

[stpurl]

I hope this isn’t taken as dismissive or critical, but there is an awful lot of ‘them’ in your posts. “They” might think this, “They” might think that.

To paraphrase Tonto, “who THEY, kimosabe?”

It strikes me as a waste of time in every sense for a person to go around and worry that ‘they’ might be doing something wrong according to ‘him’ (or her) and to then extrapolate from that, that ‘we’ should be out being the theocracy police because, you know, ‘they’.

IOW, this smacks of inventing a crisis that affects ‘them’ and trying to make it into something that ‘we’ have to ‘fix’. . .when as a matter of fact, we don’t know of ourselves of any ‘they’ who are suffering from ‘this’ and don’t need to do anything at all to fix something that isn’t broken for ‘them’ in the first place.

 

[Neil_Anthony]

It strikes me as a waste of time in every sense for a person to go around and worry that ‘they’ might be doing something wrong according to ‘him’ (or her) and to then extrapolate from that, that ‘we’ should be out being the theocracy police because, you know, ‘they’.

Ok, then don’t do it. Maybe you just aren’t the right person to help me out.

 

[JimG]

There can of course, be the observe problem, wherein someone gives to God something which is less than his due as our Creator, merely granting Him honor but not true worship. The only truly adequate worship I know is the sacrifice of the Mass which was instituted by our Redeemer.

 

[stpurl]

Perhaps, but what exactly are you looking for help in?

If you think there is a problem for they, does that mean there really is, or are you perhaps wrong?

If you personally have someone you’re concerned about, you have received concise and accurate definitions and understanding. With those, you can approach the individual and let THEM (not you) determine what, if anything, they should do ‘about it’.

If you don’t, if you’re just engaging in general ‘whataboutism’, you might enjoy getting responses and carrying on endless, ‘ok but what if, what then, what about”. . .it would be a good thing to say so. I mean, sooner or later this thread will close down as you have already had the answers to the original question. No problem for me. But it isn’t a question of me not being ‘the person to help you’. Don’t make it all about you and try to either guilt or dismiss somebody because they say something that isn’t what you wanted to hear.

It’s just that I know people who are scrupulously inclined and they would find these discussions difficult as it would make them feel that perhaps they were somehow guilty of something (which they emphatically are not). I tend to think that it’s far better to be going around finding positive things and not worried about some supposed people who are accidentally worshipping saints, etc.

 

[Neil_Anthony]

If you don’t, if you’re just engaging in general ‘whataboutism’, you might enjoy getting responses and carrying on endless, ‘ok but what if, what then, what about”. . .it would be a good thing to say so

Why would you think this was about a specific problem? Did you not notice this is the philosophy section? And yes I got the answers I was looking for. I’m not sure why you keep telling me what to do?

 

[stpurl]

I’m not your Mom nor am I telling you ‘what to do”. Anyway I have some radical knitting to do so I’ll be off then.

 

[Vico]

…

It seems that the distinction you are describing keeps coming back to whether the person giving the honour believes that the entity being honoured is God. If he doesn’t believe that the entity is God, then its not worship, by definition. Would you say that is a fair summary?

Worship has two meanings: adoration (latria) and veneration (hyperdulia and dulia, which is subordinate worship). Besides the subjective intention, each of these has different associated forms, so there is also an objective difference such as to the divine only is given: sacrifice or offering.

Some believe in multiple gods and may make sacrifices to them, with our without a symbol or dwelling (like an idol), and that will be idolatry because it is not made to the one true God.

 

[Neil_Anthony]

an objective difference such as to the divine only is given: sacrifice or offering.

Thanks! That’s true we would never offer up something to Mary or a saint, would we? But when those Christian martyrs died for not worshipping Caesear, it was because they refused to offer incense to him. Makes sense.

 

[Vico]

Vico:

an objective difference such as to the divine only is given: sacrifice or offering.

Thanks! That’s true we would never offer up something to Mary or a saint, would we? But when those Christian martyrs died for not worshipping Caesear, it was because they refused to offer incense to him. Makes sense.

In the case of Saint Victor of Marseilles he was beheaded (+ 290 A.D. ) for not offering incense to Jupiter.

 

[Neil_Anthony]

In the case of Saint Victor of Marseilles he was beheaded (+ 290 A.D. ) for not offering incense to Jupiter.

Also another case:
" The account of Polycarp’s martyrdom has the saint making this appeal to the Roman magistrate who had offered to spare the elderly saint if he would just place a pinch of incense in a brazier burning before a statue of Caesar. Polycarp replied, “Eighty and six years have I served Christ, and he never did me any injury: how then can I blaspheme my King and my Savior?”"