Do Catholics on this site accurately represent Catholicism

[graceandglory]

Personally, if the Catholics had respect for other religious convictions recognizing they are not going to convert to Catholicism due to anything said here — those interested will go to the nearest parish and prepare for RCIA without any bias here, possibly from the good things
Catholics do.
.

But courtiswa, that is not even true! People DO convert to Catholicism because of what is said and taught in these forums. Many, many people have converted from what they learned on the internet. I was one. People come to these forums to learn and to get questions answered. I know I did.

In 20 yrs of being an evangelical protestant, I never once met a Catholic who knew their faith, until right before I converted. So it was easy to just believe what people said about Catholics, without testing whether what they said was true or not. When I finally did start having questions about Authority, Church, and Sacraments, I went to the internet to get answers.

People do travel in their own circles. Finally when my little cocooned evangelical home school world collided with someone in a cocooned Catholic home school world, I saw a real Catholic family who knew and loved their faith for the first time.

 

[Kirk_O]

Personally, if the Catholics had respect for other religious convictions recognizing they are not going to convert to Catholicism due to anything said here — those interested will go to the nearest parish and prepare for RCIA without any bias here, possibly from the good things
Catholics do.

The arrogance that everyone else is going to hell if they do not convert does not convince me to consider converting. I am grounded where I am.

Respect others religion even if it is not Catholicism, Catholics would be wise in following that counsel.

You need to open you eyes. The Church does not believe any of this. Now these are lies about the Church, spread by people tiring to recruit Catholics. I was one of those, lost Catholics, at one time. I praise the Lord, for He kept me from falling to far away. He actually used that experience to bring me closer to Him and His Church.

 

[po18guy]

The arrogance that everyone else is going to hell if they do not convert does not convince me to consider converting. I am grounded where I am…

Not so fast! Where or when has any Catholic ever told you, where or when has the Church ever taught that you are condemned for not converting? If you are Christian by Baptism, then you are in communion with the Catholic Church - albeit an imperfect communion. We do not condemn brothers and sisters in Christ! That would bring condemnation upon us. We call them to examine the fulness of God’s revelation as preserved in the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church. I am very sorry if you have heard to the contrary.

 

[wmscott]

Not so fast! Where or when has any Catholic ever told you, where or when has the Church ever taught that you are condemned for not converting? If you are Christian by Baptism, then you are in communion with the Catholic Church - albeit an imperfect communion. We do not condemn brothers and sisters in Christ! That would bring condemnation upon us. We call them to examine the fulness of God’s revelation as preserved in the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church. I am very sorry if you have heard to the contrary.

Maybe courtiswa should go back and read post #36

 

[twopekinguys]

Does anyone remember a certain poster here by the name of “thecourt”.

I think courtiswa is really thecourt in disguise.

He is talking much the same way, among other things.

 

[po18guy]

Does anyone remember a certain poster here by the name of “thecourt”.

I think courtiswa is really thecourt in disguise.

He is talking much the same way, among other things.

I clicked the red triangle. The mods will look into it.

 

[Ignatius]

Personally, if the Catholics had respect for other religious convictions recognizing they are not going to convert to Catholicism due to anything said here — those interested will go to the nearest parish and prepare for RCIA without any bias here, possibly from the good things
Catholics do.

The arrogance that everyone else is going to hell if they do not convert does not convince me to consider converting. I am grounded where I am.

Respect others religion even if it is not Catholicism.

Your impression is in error. The Catholic Church does NOT teach that all who do not convert are going to hell. I believe that you have been informed of this before.

You should also be aware that a great many, if not most, of the Catholics on this site are converts from Protestantism. We certainly have a deep love for our former denominations and deep respect for what we had received from them. But I would say we had to have great humility to admit when they had found the fullness of the Truth. Some were even pastors of sizable congregations and had to make great sacrifices including their very livelihood in order to follow the Truth that they learned. These are not actions of arrogant or selfish people.

May the grace and peace of Our Lord Jesus Christ descend upon you and remain with you always.

Your servant in Christ.

---

 

[Anna_Scott]

I have found Catholics to be far more tolerant and more charitable towards Protestants, than Protestants toward Catholics.

I’ve heard Baptist ministers say that Catholics are not our brothers and sisters in Christ. There is a great deal of anti-Catholic rhetoric in some (not all) Protestant Churches. That spills over on the forums here, and I cringe when I see it.

I don’t think we should judge all Catholics based on a few, who are less than charitable.

Likewise, I would not want Catholics to judge all Protestants based on the forum members who are so disrespectful to Catholics.

Let’s face it, there are times when we all have a bad day, and respond a bit too harshly–well, at least I’ve had those days. I’ve gone back and apologized to a few people. Thank God for forgiveness!

I’ve met many wonderful Catholics here at CAF. For the most part, I have found a deep level of discussion here. I am able to ask questions that I could not ask in the Baptist Church.

When the love of Christ is demonstrated, that gets my attention–regardless of the religious denomination. When there is no sign of the love of Christ, I notice that too.

It’s Christmas. Let’s celebrate the birth of our Lord, and the religious freedom to speak on this forum.

Anna

 

[schaick]

The Catholic Church is more ecumenical and inclusive than virtually all other Christian denominations. I do not know where you have gotten your information that the Catholic Church believes only Catholics are going to heaven but wherever it was it is false. Please do not make the typical, uninformed, statements about what Catholics believe and actually do some research first.

Lutherans allow Catholics to take comunnion at their church. I have noticed that depending on the priest -Catholics do not always allow Lutherans to take communion. They will actually say if you are Catholic you are welcome to come to communion.

For a long time communion was closed at our church and only those that believed that the blood and body is in, under and with the bread and wine. Now Pastor says any who believe that Jesus died for their sins is welcome to the table.

Lutherans accept baptism from any church. Do Catholics?

My great Aunt always said my parents weren’t married because they were married in a Lutheran Church.

My son divorced after 10 months [she lied about everything-who she was her name, etc.] and his bride divorced ater 2 years [druggy, alcholic] no children on either side. They could not get married at her church or by her priest so they are being married by our pastor.

 

[schaick]

Anna - Yes there are always those few rotten apples in every group.

When I first popped inot this forum I was expecting to see talk about the different religions-cults, sihkism, buddihism,etc.

I had to laugh because the different denominations of the One True Church of Christ were being discussed in a section labeled Non-Catholic Religions as though they were completely foreign to the Catholic Church.

 

[izoid]

Lutherans allow Catholics to take comunnion at their church. I have noticed that depending on the priest -Catholics do not always allow Lutherans to take communion. They will actually say if you are Catholic you are welcome to come to communion.
The Catholic understanding of the Eucharist is quite different than the protestant denominations, even Lutheran. It would be improper to open the table to those who do not fully understand and embrace the teachings of the Church.

For a long time communion was closed at our church and only those that believed that the blood and body is in, under and with the bread and wine. Now Pastor says any who believe that Jesus died for their sins is welcome to the table.
Again, the protestant understanding of communion is incomplete. It is merely symbolic and eating a piece of cracker and drinking a cup of juice. There is no reason that anyone who loves Jesus can not do this. Lutheran beliefs are closer to Catholics than other protestants but they are still not the same.

Lutherans accept baptism from any church. Do Catholics?
So long as the baptism was done in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. I think a better question is, do protestants accept Catholic and many other protestant baptisms. I can point you to many churches that require one to be re baptized if they were not submerged.

My great Aunt always said my parents weren’t married because they were married in a Lutheran Church.
Marriage is a sacrament in the Catholic Church.

My son divorced after 10 months [she lied about everything-who she was her name, etc.] and his bride divorced ater 2 years [druggy, alcholic] no children on either side. They could not get married at her church or by her priest so they are being married by our pastor.
THe Catholic Church would accept your son but not his divorce. The church does not allow divorce so your son can not remarry in the church.

The original post referred to Catholics claiming that if you are not Catholic you are going to hell. I pointed out that this was false and that the teach was more ecumenical than most. I do not see how your examples refer to ecumenism. I do not think you mean to say that churches should not have their own standards but that is what you are leaning towards with you examples.

 

[graceandglory]

I have found Catholics to be far more tolerant and more charitable towards Protestants, than Protestants toward Catholics.

I’ve heard Baptist ministers say that Catholics are not our brothers and sisters in Christ. There is a great deal of anti-Catholic rhetoric in some (not all) Protestant Churches. That spills over on the forums here, and I cringe when I see it.

When I left the Catholic Church, it was because protestants told me I wasn’t saved, The Catholic Church was the whore of babylon, or the antiChrist. I was told that I was a Mary worshipper, and prayed to idols, and that I wasn’t saved because I didn’t say the “sinners’ prayer.” When my dad died, my beloved pentecostal friend asked if he ever got “born again.” In her eyes, he was going to hell. In fact, according to many protestants, all Catholic are going to hell because they are in a false religion. If that isn’t uncharitable and ignorant, I don’t know what is. In time I almost came to believe just like them. (Although I knew that I was a believer when I was raised Catholic, so I always had that grounding).

Now as an adult Catholic convert, my deepest desire is for these protestant friends who are continually striving to recreate “the early church” to find the fullness of the Christian faith in the Catholic Church. I see how they love Christ but are being “tossed and driven by the wind,” never settling into “the perfect church,” and that breaks my heart. Sometimes I get over zealous. Sometimes “discussions” turns to “debates.” The Catholic Catechism says that my protestant friends are my “Separated Brethren,” and that is how I see it. I pray that one day we will be worshipping together again.

 

[Anna_Scott]

When I left the Catholic Church, it was because protestants told me I wasn’t saved, The Catholic Church was the whore of babylon, or the antiChrist. I was told that I was a Mary worshipper, and prayed to idols, and that I wasn’t saved because I didn’t say the “sinners’ prayer.” When my dad died, my beloved pentecostal friend asked if he ever got “born again.” In her eyes, he was going to hell. In fact, according to many protestants, all Catholic are going to hell because they are in a false religion. If that isn’t uncharitable and ignorant, I don’t know what is. In time I almost came to believe just like them. (Although I knew that I was a believer when I was raised Catholic, so I always had that grounding).

Now as an adult Catholic convert, my deepest desire is for these protestant friends who are continually striving to recreate “the early church” to find the fullness of the Christian faith in the Catholic Church. I see how they love Christ but are being “tossed and driven by the wind,” never settling into “the perfect church,” and that breaks my heart. Sometimes I get over zealous. Sometimes “discussions” turns to “debates.” The Catholic Catechism says that my protestant friends are my “Separated Brethren,” and that is how I see it. I pray that one day we will be worshipping together again.

graceandglory,

Sadly, I have heard precisely those things from other Protestants. A friend of mine got so upset with me, because I have a Catholic Comparative New Testament.

I have been very open on these forums about my issues with Protestantism. It is difficult to break free from a lifetime of indoctrination. I have said many times, that I feel like I am drowning in a sea of Protestant voices.

At least you have things settled. I hope to reach that point, eventually. I keep praying and studying. It’s been a rocky road.

Anna

 

[AmateurPianist]

IF you want an official accurate representation of the Catholic Faith read a Catechism of the Catholic Church alongside a bible.

Maybe it is the particular Christianese of the Catechism, but I find it a difficult read.

If you want a living witness who practices his Catholic faith day by day through test and trials, this forum is a good medium.

I don’t understand this sentence to be honest.

What you may be mistaken as a superior attitude, is when a Catholic is trying to hand on the Apostolic biblical teaching that Jesus is the Head of the Catholic Church, and the Catholic church is the body of Jesus Christ. This is not a surperior attitude this is a biblical, historical fact. This biblical Apostolic teaching can come across as arrogant, your persecution to this truth, fulfills Jesus prophecy that his Catholic Church members will be persecuted just as he was, when he proclaimed to the World that He, Jesus was God come in the flesh. This teaching of Jesus revealing the Father to us, was just as hair-raising back then for which he was crucified, is the same when the Catholic Church proclaims Jesus True Presence in our (Catholic liturgies) midst.

I understand that you believe your faith to be superior to us Protestants.

Similarly I believe the Christian faith to be the superior faith to say Islam or even the various restorationalist Christian sects. I think I will expand upon my point below though.

I do not understand the phrase your persecution. Do you really think that I am here to persecute Catholics.

No, I do not believe that you are exclusively the church of Jesus Christ and are in a superior relationship to the rest of us, but that doesn’t mean I am persecuting you.

If you want fruit from the Tree, look at how the Apostles, Catholic Saints and Martyrs who lived out their Catholic faith since the first century to the present time in Mother Teresa, Pope John Paul II of late.

I find Mother Teresa and pope JP to be exemplary and attractive examples of the Christian faith. But then again I know Protestants and evangelicals that I can say the same thing about. So if I compare the upper ends of both faiths I: would say push.

And of course if we want to go into the mud, I can do it with equality on both sides. So push there also.

Now here is the interesting thing. As far as rank-and-file on internet message boards, on Protestant / Evangelical sites I have found the Catholics there to be more interesting and attractive while on the Catholic sites I have found the Protestants / Evangelicals there (the long term ones not the fly bys) to be more attractive.

Probably the internet is not a fair gauge.

Now what I am ultimately trying to do is to examine your superior / inferior claims from all sides of the equation, and not just cherry pick my metrics.

The church militant, which encompasses these Catholic forum sites, come in all colors and shapes. Personally I dont think these forums express exactly what each person’s attitude reflect here truthfully, be it Catholic or non catholic. If a non catholic community possesed the history from its members who walked and lived with the Orginal Apostles, canonnized the bible, and throughout history since the resurrection defended the Apostolic biblical faith for the past 2000 years, you better believe that these non catholics would be shouting from the roof tops.

The Catholic Church is the only one that possesses Apostolic authenticity, authenticated the bible, and possesses the 2000 year old recorded Christian history to date. To practice love your enemies, is a life long commitment for Catholics that comes with tests and trials, Do we fail at times? Yes we do, but thank God for the ministry of reconciliation.

To those who do not reach far back to the resurrection as the Catholic Church does, may see my comments are very arrogant, I assure you these comments are not from my attitude, but from much research and eyewitness accounts to these facts. The one who rejects the biblical Apostolic Traditional Faith from afar, hold to a new man made christianity and protests the “Rock” of Christianity in the Catholic Church.

I challenge the reverse here for non catholics; Why do you protest the Catholic church without learning and accepting her proven historical unbroken succession 2000 year old Christian Apostolic faith?
Peace be with you:

)
Of course that is your claim.

And just spitting it out there is OK with me. I am not offended by it even though I am not convinced. But its when you get into the other stuff (like insisting that some Protestants greatly dislike Mary despite evidence of the contrary) that you really lose me.

Your claims actually carry more weight when they are not accompanied by over-the-top rhetoric.

 

[Priscilla_Ann]

When I left the Catholic Church, it was because protestants told me I wasn’t saved, The Catholic Church was the whore of babylon, or the antiChrist. I was told that I was a Mary worshipper, and prayed to idols, and that I wasn’t saved because I didn’t say the “sinners’ prayer.” When my dad died, my beloved pentecostal friend asked if he ever got “born again.” In her eyes, he was going to hell. In fact, according to many protestants, all Catholic are going to hell because they are in a false religion. If that isn’t uncharitable and ignorant, I don’t know what is. In time I almost came to believe just like them. (Although I knew that I was a believer when I was raised Catholic, so I always had that grounding).

Now as an adult Catholic convert, my deepest desire is for these protestant friends who are continually striving to recreate “the early church” to find the fullness of the Christian faith in the Catholic Church. I see how they love Christ but are being “tossed and driven by the wind,” never settling into “the perfect church,” and that breaks my heart. Sometimes I get over zealous. Sometimes “discussions” turns to “debates.” The Catholic Catechism says that my protestant friends are my “Separated Brethren,” and that is how I see it. I pray that one day we will be worshipping together again.

How odd! When I left the Catholic Church for non-Catholic Christianity, there were Catholics who told me that I would go to hell because I left the Catholic Church. Do you believe that?

 

[TheresaLS]

How odd! When I left the Catholic Church for non-Catholic Christianity, there were Catholics who told me that I would go to hell because I left the Catholic Church. Do you believe that?

No I do not think you will go to hell…but God might want to know why you left the Church He sent his Son to give to us a gift…

 

[Priscilla_Ann]

No I do not think you will go to hell…but God might want to know why you left the Church He sent his Son to give to us a gift…

Jesus is the gift! Through believing in him, we have eternal life.

 

[Ignatius]

Jesus is the gift! Through believing in him, we have eternal life.

Even if you have “all faith even so as to move mountains, and have not love” it is useless.

And What does Jesus Himself say?
John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
We need to go by everything that Jesus commanded.

Do you think that you can be saved if you have faith but don’t forgive others? Not according to Jesus:
**Mat 6:15 **But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

The doctrine of Sola Fide or Faith Alone is a false, doctrine of man that was not taught by Jesus, the Apostles whom Jesus sent or the Early Christians for 1, 600 years. Then, in the 16th century some men who knew neither Christ nor His Apostles had the hubris think that they knew better than every Christian who had existed for 16 centuries including those taught directly by the Apostles that Jesus had appointed for exactly that purpose.

A little checking the scripture will reveal that the scripture clearly teaches against Sola Fide as noted above. Here is a small sample of verses that completely refute Sola Fide:
Jam_2:14-26… what good is faith w/o works? Heb_10:26-27, Rom_8:12-13… must avoid sin. Jam_5:20… forgiveness. Joh_5:28-29; 2Co_5:10; Rom_2:6-13; Mat_25:32-46; Gal_6:6-10; Rev_20:12… judgement according to works. Luk_6:46-49; Mat_7:21; Mat_19:16-21… must do will of God. 1Co_9:27… “buffet my body” Phi_2:12; 1Pe_1:14-17… works have merit. 1Jo_2:3-6; 1Jo_3:24; 1Jo_5:3… keep commandments. Intellectual assent (1Th_2:13), confidence in promise (Rom_4:2-3, Gen_15:5-6), obedience (Rom_1:5) and love (Gal_5:6) implied by faith.

May the Blessings of Our Lord Jesus Christ descend upon you and remain with you always.

Your Servant in Christ.

 

[izoid]

Even if you have “all faith even so as to move mountains, and have not love” it is useless.

And What does Jesus Himself say?
John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Do you think that you can be saved if you have faith but don’t forgive others? Jesus says
We need to go by everything that Jesus commanded. Do you think that you can be saved if you do not forgive? Not according to Jesus: **
Mat 6:15** But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

The doctrine of Sola Fide or Faith Alone is a false, doctrine of man that was not taught by Jesus, the Apostles whom Jesus sent or the Early Christians for 1, 600 years. Then, in the 16th century some men who knew neither Christ nor His Apostles had the hubris think that they knew better than every Christian who had existed for 16 centuries including those taught directly by the Apostles that Jesus had appointed for exactly that purpose.

A little checking the scripture will reveal that the scripture clearly teaches against Sola Scriptura as noted above. Here is a small sample of verses that completely refute Sola Scriptura:
Jam_2:14-26… what good is faith w/o works? Heb_10:26-27, Rom_8:12-13… must avoid sin. Jam_5:20… forgiveness. Joh_5:28-29; 2Co_5:10; Rom_2:6-13; Mat_25:32-46; Gal_6:6-10; Rev_20:12… judgement according to works. Luk_6:46-49; Mat_7:21; Mat_19:16-21… must do will of God. 1Co_9:27… “buffet my body” Phi_2:12; 1Pe_1:14-17… works have merit. 1Jo_2:3-6; 1Jo_3:24; 1Jo_5:3… keep commandments. Intellectual assent (1Th_2:13), confidence in promise (Rom_4:2-3, Gen_15:5-6), obedience (Rom_1:5) and love (Gal_5:6) implied by faith.

:clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping:

 

[izoid]

Even if you have “all faith even so as to move mountains, and have not love” it is useless.

And What does Jesus Himself say?
John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Do you think that you can be saved if you have faith but don’t forgive others? Jesus says
We need to go by everything that Jesus commanded. Do you think that you can be saved if you do not forgive? Not according to Jesus:
**Mat 6:15 **But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

The doctrine of Sola Fide or Faith Alone is a false, doctrine of man that was not taught by Jesus, the Apostles whom Jesus sent or the Early Christians for 1, 600 years. Then, in the 16th century some men who knew neither Christ nor His Apostles had the hubris think that they knew better than every Christian who had existed for 16 centuries including those taught directly by the Apostles that Jesus had appointed for exactly that purpose.

A little checking the scripture will reveal that the scripture clearly teaches against Sola Fide as noted above. Here is a small sample of verses that completely refute Sola Fide:
Jam_2:14-26… what good is faith w/o works? Heb_10:26-27, Rom_8:12-13… must avoid sin. Jam_5:20… forgiveness. Joh_5:28-29; 2Co_5:10; Rom_2:6-13; Mat_25:32-46; Gal_6:6-10; Rev_20:12… judgement according to works. Luk_6:46-49; Mat_7:21; Mat_19:16-21… must do will of God. 1Co_9:27… “buffet my body” Phi_2:12; 1Pe_1:14-17… works have merit. 1Jo_2:3-6; 1Jo_3:24; 1Jo_5:3… keep commandments. Intellectual assent (1Th_2:13), confidence in promise (Rom_4:2-3, Gen_15:5-6), obedience (Rom_1:5) and love (Gal_5:6) implied by faith.

May the Blessings of Our Lord Jesus Christ descend upon you and remain with you always.

Your Servant in Christ.

:clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping: