Do Catholics still support Trump

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Having read the full article now, it’s even worse in whole than it was in part.
 
dvdjs said:
Are you really still missing the point? Amazing.
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Don’t just be amazed. If you don’t think the writer is attempting to argue equivalency between things deemed by the Church to be intrinsic evils and those that are within the prudential judgment of individuals, tell us why you think it.
 
And he stated noticing her the first time at a dance recital when she was a young teen.

The only time I’ve ever gone to dance recitals is to see family members perform. They aren’t too interesting, in my opinion, unless you are cheering for your friend or family.

Why was he at a dance recital checking out the performers? I sort of cringe. My daughter’s good friend performs in recitals. I hope 30 + year olds aren’t ogling her. 😡
 
Ridgerunner said:
If you don’t think the writer is attempting to argue equivalency between things deemed by the Church to be intrinsic evils and those that are within the prudential judgment of individuals
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Ahh… That is the problem.

The author doesn’t write at all about evils "that are within the prudential judgment of individuals. (And you will not hear such language from Benedict.)

The prudential judgement that may apply in matters of non-intrinsic evil is whether the matter in question is evil or not. If the matter is evil, then there is an equivalence to other matters of evil, and one has an equivalent moral responsibility.

The author criticizes the idea that one might approach their moral responsibility by checking the “5” (selected somehow from a much longer list form Benedict), and not bothering to consider other matters, as though there was not, potentially, the same moral responsibility.

From what I read here, agree that that is a concern.
 
dvdjs said:
Ahh… That is the problem.

The author doesn’t write at all about evils "that are within the prudential judgment of individuals. (And you will not hear such language from Benedict.)

The prudential judgement that may apply in matters of non-intrinsic evil is whether the matter in question is evil or not. If the matter is evil, then there is an equivalence to other matters of evil, and one has an equivalent moral responsibility.

The author criticizes the idea that one might approach their moral responsibility by checking the “5” (selected somehow from a much longer list form Benedict), and not bothering to consider other matters, as though there was not, potentially, the same moral responsibility.

From what I read here, agree that that is a concern.
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It is worth noting that racism and torture are intrinsic evils.
 
Did the majority of those voting for him do so because of the five non negotiables anyway?

He mentioned abortion rarely not even in his acceptance speech at the convention. I don’t remember anything on gay marriage, except an older blog post congratulating Elton John on his marriage. I haven’t heard much about stem cells, or cloning. Nothing on Euthanasia.

But I do remember lots of talk of building a wall, locking her up, appointing judges who would be strong on the second amendment.

I think another republican would have been the candidate if these non negotiables mattered to the primary voters who voted for trump.
 
Back when the list was compiled, I don’t think any candidates were openly for torture.

Could anyone really see that coming? Could anyone really see Catholics not understanding what torture could possibly be?

Inserting puréed food rectally, for example, isn’t a method of tube feeding. But I remember reading on CAF that it wasn’t torture to do so. I found that scandalous.
 
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Shakuhachi said:
How about “enhanced interrogation techniques”?
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I suppose that would go under the “non-intrinsic evil” category. And that makes a nice point.
Moving the matter into that category absolves no one of their moral responsibility. If the techniques being advanced are evil, then the gravity of supporting it the same as the gravity of supporting other evils.
 
You’ve got a point. When did we first hear of that? I’m referring to the CiA report that came out in 2014.

I know a John McCain was against. When George W. Bush ran the second time were we aware of that euphemism?
 
dvdjs said:
I suppose that would go under the “non-intrinsic evil” category. And that makes a nice point.

Moving the matter into that category absolves no one of their moral responsibility. If the techniques being advanced are evil, then the gravity of supporting it the same as the gravity of supporting other evils.
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Nope, still an intrinsic evil.
 
Of course.

But when you have Catholic news networks rationalizing what torture could be, of course Catholics will be confused.

At least trump called it torture.
 
dvdjs said:
The point is that that doesn’t matter.

Supporting evil carries a moral responsibility, whether the evil is intrinsic or not.
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I agree. I find the distinction to be one to make an excuse for supporting evil. Just because someone doesn’t think the Iraq War is evil through prudential judgement doesn’t mean I can’t weigh it as much as I feel is appropriate when making a voting decision because I do believe it is evil and an unjust war.
 
Jig_Saw said:
Just because someone doesn’t think the Iraq War is evil through prudential judgement
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The prudential judgement, from a properly formed conscience, doesn’t bother me as much as the taking the issue off the table a priori since the evil of war is considered non-intrinsic (to Latins).
 
Luke6_37 said:
I knew the tu quoque defense would come up. It always does. :roll_eyes:
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Tu quoque = Claiming the argument is flawed by pointing out that the one making the argument is not acting consistently with the claims of the argument.

“Pray for both sides” is not arguing for anything but prayer.
 
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