Do God and evolution agree?

[Gorgias]

Evolution says there is NO GOD

It’s really important to make sure we’re precise when we talk about these sorts of things.

Evolution does not say that there is no God. Evolution is science, and so, it cannot speak to theological and/or spiritual realities.

Now… there are people who have taken the science and have attempted to turn it into their own little pet quasi-philosophical, pseudo-spiritual view of life. They’re horribly confused, since there’s no way that science can speak to theology. However, they make the claim that evolution implies theology. Evolutionary science, however, makes no such claim.

the universe came into being by a Big Bang 13.7 billion years ago

Yes, science says that. There’s pretty good empirical evidence to support that claim, too.

over time things evolved through time over millions of years

There are two distinct claims here: one speaks to the question of how life appeared in the universe, and the other speaks to how those original forms of life became the forms of life that we see on earth these days. Both are scientific, not theological questions.

God’s Word says the earth was created in six days (Genesis chapter 1) and that man was created in the image of God.

God created man in His own image in the image of God He created him male and female He created them.

And these are theological constructs – and both of them true! (The question, of course, becomes whether these are also scientific constructs, and therefore, literal historical accounts.)

 

[goout]

It is tragic when our atheist friends have a better sense of our faith than some Catholics.

 

[edwest]

I’m talking about the public and a man abusing his title and position to attack the Church.

 

[niceatheist]

I’m talking about the public and a man abusing his title and position to attack the Church.

How is he abusing his “title”? He doesn’t pretend to be acting as a scientist when he writes these books.

 

[edwest]

He did a very good job on TV.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I’m not sure what’s going on in this thread. An atheist seems to be in some odd way defending the existence of God? Or at least saying science can’t disprove God?

 

[buffalo]

Or at least saying science can’t disprove God?

Science cannot disprove God.

 

[crai7]

It’s not necessary to compromise by claiming ‘guided evolution’. The scientific evidence is no longer in favour of Neo Darwinism. Behind closed doors biologists are scrambling for a replacement. The primary issue is that the ratios of deletrious to beneficial mutations that have actually been observed do not line up with the original 1:1 assumption Fisher made made in the 1930s. It is more along the lines of 1,000,000 : 1. See the Basener and Sanford paper published in the Journal of Mathematical Biology. Without mutations to replenish the lost variance that occurs due to natural selection, evolution cannot work.

Also some other resources:
If you’re Catholic see: http://kolbecenter.org
If you’re Protestant see: http://icr.org or

 

[niceatheist]

Can you define Neo-Darwinism? Phenomena like horizontal gene transfer have been known for a few decades now, and it strikes me you’re playing a bit of a rhetorical game. Evolutionary biology is not in any doubt, and your grasping at straws because the underlying theories are being improved.

Simply put, the number of scientists that actually doubt evolution is exceedingly small, and even the supposed skeptics like Michael Behe don’t actually deny evolution.

Sorry, but ID or Creationism isn’t going to suddenly become a science, and evolutionary theory isn’t going to be thrown out the window.

 

[edwest]

What is “evolutionary biology” used for? Bacteria have the built-in ability to recombine existing genetic material.

 

[crai7]

I define Neo Darwinism as the synthesis of natural selection and mutation. Without this mechanism functioning correctly, how would evolution work? I don’t see how horizontal gene transfer can totally replace the variance replenishing role of mutation or overcome the effect of accumulating deletrious mutations? The ACTUAL OBSERVATIONS are of declining fitness across species (see Lynch) in the range of 0.2 to 2% per generation, due to mutations apart from selection. Observations do not support micro evolution.
In terms of historical ‘macro evolution’ - is the evidence specific enough to exclude alternatives models that would also fit? I don’t think so.

 

[buffalo]

Also some other resources:

or

http://www.idvolution.org/

 

[Fatima-Crusader]

The word “simul” in the Latin text of Lateran IV translates as “simultaneously” or “together at the same time” or “at once”:

Deus…creator omnium visibilium et invisibilium, spiritualium et corporalium: qui sua omnipotenti virtute **simul **ab initio temporis utramque de nihilo condiditcreaturam, spiritualem et corporalem, angelicam videlicet et mundanam: ac deinde humanam, quasi communem ex spiritu et corpore constitutam.

Lateran IV says: Firmly we believe and we confess simply that the true God is one alone, eternal, immense, and unchangeable, incomprehensible, omnipotent and ineffable, Father and Son and Holy Spirit: indeed three Persons but one essence, substance, or nature entirely simple. The Father from no one, the Son from the Father only, and the Holy Spirit equally from both; without beginning, always, and without end; the Father generating, the Son being born, and the Holy Spirit proceeding; consubstantial and coequal and omnipotent and coeternal; one beginning of all, creator of all visible and invisible things, of the spiritual and of the corporal; who by His own omnipotent power at once from the beginning of time created each creature from nothing, spiritual, and corporal, namely, angelic and mundane, and finally the human, constituted as it were, alike of the spirit and the body. For the devil and other demons were created by God good in nature, but they themselves through themselves have become wicked. But man sinned at the suggestion of the devil.

This wouldnt allow for modern day science, how can this be true then?

 

[Fatima-Crusader]

The word “simul” in the Latin text of Lateran IV translates as “simultaneously” or “together at the same time” or “at once”:

Deus…creator omnium visibilium et invisibilium, spiritualium et corporalium: qui sua omnipotenti virtute **simul **ab initio temporis utramque de nihilo condiditcreaturam, spiritualem et corporalem, angelicam videlicet et mundanam: ac deinde humanam, quasi communem ex spiritu et corpore constitutam.

Lateran IV says: Firmly we believe and we confess simply that the true God is one alone, eternal, immense, and unchangeable, incomprehensible, omnipotent and ineffable, Father and Son and Holy Spirit: indeed three Persons but one essence, substance, or nature entirely simple. The Father from no one, the Son from the Father only, and the Holy Spirit equally from both; without beginning, always, and without end; the Father generating, the Son being born, and the Holy Spirit proceeding; consubstantial and coequal and omnipotent and coeternal; one beginning of all, creator of all visible and invisible things, of the spiritual and of the corporal; who by His own omnipotent power at once from the beginning of time created each creature from nothing, spiritual, and corporal, namely, angelic and mundane, and finally the human, constituted as it were, alike of the spirit and the body. For the devil and other demons were created by God good in nature, but they themselves through themselves have become wicked. But man sinned at the suggestion of the devil.

This wouldnt allow for modern day science, how can this be true then?

 

[Fatima-Crusader]

The word “simul” in the Latin text of Lateran IV translates as “simultaneously” or “together at the same time” or “at once”:

Deus…creator omnium visibilium et invisibilium, spiritualium et corporalium: qui sua omnipotenti virtute **simul **ab initio temporis utramque de nihilo condiditcreaturam, spiritualem et corporalem, angelicam videlicet et mundanam: ac deinde humanam, quasi communem ex spiritu et corpore constitutam.

Lateran IV says: Firmly we believe and we confess simply that the true God is one alone, eternal, immense, and unchangeable, incomprehensible, omnipotent and ineffable, Father and Son and Holy Spirit: indeed three Persons but one essence, substance, or nature entirely simple. The Father from no one, the Son from the Father only, and the Holy Spirit equally from both; without beginning, always, and without end; the Father generating, the Son being born, and the Holy Spirit proceeding; consubstantial and coequal and omnipotent and coeternal; one beginning of all, creator of all visible and invisible things, of the spiritual and of the corporal; who by His own omnipotent power at once from the beginning of time created each creature from nothing, spiritual, and corporal, namely, angelic and mundane, and finally the human, constituted as it were, alike of the spirit and the body. For the devil and other demons were created by God good in nature, but they themselves through themselves have become wicked. But man sinned at the suggestion of the devil.

This wouldnt allow for modern day science, how can this be true then?

 

[goout]

The word “simul” in the Latin text of Lateran IV translates as “simultaneously” or “together at the same time” or “at once”:

Deus…creator omnium visibilium et invisibilium, spiritualium et corporalium: qui sua omnipotenti virtute **simul **ab initio temporis utramque de nihilo condiditcreaturam, spiritualem et corporalem, angelicam videlicet et mundanam: ac deinde humanam, quasi communem ex spiritu et corpore constitutam.

Lateran IV says: Firmly we believe and we confess simply that the true God is one alone, eternal, immense, and unchangeable, incomprehensible, omnipotent and ineffable, Father and Son and Holy Spirit: indeed three Persons but one essence, substance, or nature entirely simple. The Father from no one, the Son from the Father only, and the Holy Spirit equally from both; without beginning, always, and without end; the Father generating, the Son being born, and the Holy Spirit proceeding; consubstantial and coequal and omnipotent and coeternal; one beginning of all, creator of all visible and invisible things, of the spiritual and of the corporal; who by His own omnipotent power at once from the beginning of time created each creature from nothing, spiritual, and corporal, namely, angelic and mundane, and finally the human, constituted as it were, alike of the spirit and the body. For the devil and other demons were created by God good in nature, but they themselves through themselves have become wicked. But man sinned at the suggestion of the devil.

This wouldnt allow for modern day science, how can this be true then?

You might want to follow one of the thousand-post threads on this that are always ongoing.

 

[Fatima-Crusader]

Can u link it?

 

[1ke]

This wouldnt allow for modern day science

I’m not sure what you mean.

how can this be true then?

Because it’s not talking about science. It’s talking about theology.

 

[goout]

There are seven thousand posts on this thread, and there are many just like it, going in circles for years and years.

Why you should think that the Natural-Evolution of species is true Philosophy

This is just a commonsense argument. If God created species, then apart from animals that have gone extinct, all the animals that exist today should be no different from when they were first created; there should be no new species. So it should be true that the Platypus has always existed for as long as there have been animals. From the moment animals existed they ought to be identical to the animals that live today. The evidence does not bare out that cl;aim. So while one might not want to ta…

 

[edwest]

Funny. Science as belief system does not sit well with me. That’s why threads like this have been going on for years.