Do I act or does God act in me?

[Saint2B]

Is this accurate to Catholic teaching or how should it be corrected?

**God offers me an opportunity to do good. He supplied the grace for me to accomplish it. I cooperate with my will.

Does God then work through me, or am I working, with God’s help to do the thing he wants?
**

if you can clarify that by Catholic teaching that helps. I am not discussing saved by works her,e but just who is working and where is my will? Only in consenting, orr in doing the work, too?

 

[passus]

Your understanding entirely correct. Your will is consenting to God’s working within you–that cooperation with His grace.

 

[Blade_and_Blood]

No matter what you do, it’s purely your own actions-- your choice, your thoughts, your actions…

The idea of God is merely an influence or an inspiration.

That’s my take.

Ironically Yours, Blade and Blood

 

[thistle]

No matter what you do, it’s purely your own actions-- your choice, your thoughts, your actions…

The idea of God is merely an influence or an inspiration.

That’s my take.

Ironically Yours, Blade and Blood

What does your comment mean? God is certainly not an idea!!

 

[reggieM]

Is Does God then work through me, or am I working, with God’s help to do the thing he wants?

It’s a mixture of the two. A classic spiritual goal is to arrive at a condition of “self-emptying” so that “it is no longer I who live but Christ who lives in me”.

But getting to that goal is a long and arduous journey of self-denial and spiritual battle – but to reach it is spirtual perfection and sanctification. We would call it also “theosis” (a term more common in Eastern Catholicism). That’s where God fully lives in the person and God’s will is done perfectly through the person.

But the path to that goal is just as you said. God gives us the grace to know His will and to do it. We have to pray to do both things and to receive that gift of grace continually. When we receive the insight about what God wants, and we also get the strength from God to do it – we still have to choose to carry it out and give our best effort.

But after a while, this all becomes habitual and every action can be done in union with God. It’s still a matter of making good choices and cooperating with grace, but it is done so frequently and with so much fidelity that the believer begins to lose his own will and let God’s will work in him constantly.

 

[Blade_and_Blood]

What does your comment mean? God is certainly not an idea!!

To some it is. Take me, for example; whether God exists, through my eyes, I’m not sure, but I would most certainly like to think He is real. The idea an all-loving, all-perfect, all-knowing entity I call God motivates me to be a kind person for the sake of being a friend to people.

To others, God is obviously not an ideal–as He is personified through the Bible, therefore they are motivated to abide by Scripture for the sake of self-interest-- or rather, Heaven.

There’s definitely more to it (pros and cons to each side), depending on your own beliefs, but that’s just the surface.

Ironically Yours.

 

[thistle]

To some it is. Take me, for example; whether God exists, through my eyes, I’m not sure, but I would most certainly like to think He is real. The idea an all-loving, all-perfect, all-knowing entity I call God motivates me to be a kind person for the sake of being a friend to people.

To others, God is obviously not an ideal–as He is personified through the Bible, therefore they are motivated to abide by Scripture for the sake of self-interest-- or rather, Heaven.

There’s definitely more to it (pros and cons to each side), depending on your own beliefs, but that’s just the surface.

Ironically Yours.

There are no pros and cons. Its very simple. God exists whether you believe that or not.

 

[Blade_and_Blood]

There are no pros and cons. Its very simple. God exists whether you believe that or not.

Of course, thistle. He is as real as you think He is…

…

Ironically Yours.

 

[thistle]

Of course, thistle. He is as real as you think He is…

…

Ironically Yours.

Sarcasm doesn’t make God not exist either. I feel sorry for you.

 

[Blade_and_Blood]

Sarcasm doesn’t make God not exist either. I feel sorry for you.

Mind you, that wasn’t really sarcasm. I was trying to prove a point, but alas! I failed.

Don’t feel sorry for me. I’ll never say God exists nor will I ever say He doesn’t. I just like the idea of Him; a free spirit who watches down on us from above.

Can I prove that, though? No. It just defeats the mystery of it all.

It’s a bit like dressing the invisible man. Once he’s got some clothes on, you can see him! But, of course, you don’t see him; you see the clothes. And that’s the problem. Everyone has become obsessed with the [blanked] clothes, we’ve forgotten if there was any man there in the first place.

Pat Condell, *The Curse of Faith *(YouTube)​

Ironically Yours, Blade and Blood

 

[thistle]

Mind you, that wasn’t really sarcasm. I was trying to prove a point, but alas! I failed.

Don’t feel sorry for me. I’ll never say God exists nor will I ever say He doesn’t. I just like the idea of Him; a free spirit who watches down on us from above.

Can I prove that, though? No. It just defeats the mystery of it all.

It’s a bit like dressing the invisible man. Once he’s got some clothes on, you can see him! But, of course, you don’t see him; you see the clothes. And that’s the problem. Everyone has become obsessed with the [blanked] clothes, we’ve forgotten if there was any man there in the first place.

Pat Condell, *The Curse of Faith *(YouTube)​

Ironically Yours, Blade and Blood

Well if God does not exist then I am no better off than you when we die, just a rotting corpse, but if I am right and die in a state of grace then I will be saved and you will be in Hell forever. Is that something you are happy to risk?

 

[Blade_and_Blood]

Well if God does not exist then I am no better off than you when we die, just a rotting corpse, but if I am right and die in a state of grace then I will be saved and you will be in Hell forever. Is that something you are happy to risk?

Of course I am. I will never fall for Pascal’s Wager.

But, who are you to judge my destination (if any) after Death?

Ironically Yours, Blade and Blood

 

[thistle]

Of course I am. I will never fall for Pascal’s Wager.

But, who are you to judge my destination (if any) after Death?

Ironically Yours, Blade and Blood

As you cannot claim invincible ignorance your destination will be Hell.

 

[Blade_and_Blood]

As you cannot claim invincible ignorance your destination will be Hell.

Says you. Apparenly, your perception of ignorance is quite different than mine.

I will never say you will go to Hell because that is neither right on my part or kind, but lighten up . There’s nothing wrong with a little “existential intelligence” (Gardner).

Ironically Yours.

 

[thistle]

Says you. Apparenly, your perception of ignorance is quite different than mine.

I will never say you will go to Hell because that is neither right on my part or kind, but lighten up . There’s nothing wrong with a little “existential intelligence” (Gardner).

Ironically Yours.

Apparently!!
I know the difference between innocent ignorance and invincible ignorance and neither applies to you. You are a Catholic and have rejected the Church and its teachings. Heresy earns you Hell.

 

[larry85704]

Has somebody clarified Jesus teachings about “Judge not lest you be judged?” I just read on another thread about some woman caught in adultery that Jesus saved. Has the Catholic Church decided these teachings are not Catholic any more? Please supply a reference to a church teaching about why it is all the sudden your job to tell people they are going to hell. I can supply teaching why it is Jesus’ or God’s job, to condemn. So, kindly get yourself back in the fold, if you know what I mean.

If you believe in free will then everything you do is something you choose to do. Again, at what point does free will get revoked? If somehow God took over and made decisions for you I think you are mentally ill and should see a doctor.

Faith is the belief in God. We must believe. God, be His design, cannot be proven, He has decided we must accept Him on faith. Or did somebody repeal that too?

 

[Blade_and_Blood]

Apparently!!
I know the difference between innocent ignorance and invincible ignorance and neither applies to you. You are a Catholic and have rejected the Church and its teachings. Heresy earns you Hell.

Whether in favor or against me, I side with larry85704. :tiphat:

…Besides, I didn’t reject the Church’s teachings… I questioned them, for the sake of my own sanity. No offence.

Ironically Yours, Blade and Blood

 

[thistle]

Whether in favor or against me, I side with larry85704. :tiphat:

…Besides, I didn’t reject the Church’s teachings… I questioned them, for the sake of my own sanity. No offence.

Ironically Yours, Blade and Blood

You have said you don’t know or you’re unsure if there is a God or not.
How does that stack up with the Creed: “I believe in God…”
If you do not believe then you have rejected Christ and his Church which is heresy, maybe apostasy.

 

[thistle]

Has somebody clarified Jesus teachings about “Judge not lest you be judged?” I just read on another thread about some woman caught in adultery that Jesus saved. Has the Catholic Church decided these teachings are not Catholic any more? Please supply a reference to a church teaching about why it is all the sudden your job to tell people they are going to hell. I can supply teaching why it is Jesus’ or God’s job, to condemn. So, kindly get yourself back in the fold, if you know what I mean.

If you believe in free will then everything you do is something you choose to do. Again, at what point does free will get revoked? If somehow God took over and made decisions for you I think you are mentally ill and should see a doctor.

Faith is the belief in God. We must believe. God, be His design, cannot be proven, He has decided we must accept Him on faith. Or did somebody repeal that too?

We are not called to judge a person but we are to judge their actions.
As for your comments on freewill you have made my point. Blade and Blood is a Catholic but he is saying he does not know if God exists or not. He is using his freewill to reject God.
Rejecting Christ and his Church for a Catholic means they are in a state of mortal sin and if he dies unrepentent in that state he goes to Hell.
While only God knows the state of a person’s soul at death, are you saying that if someone dies in a state of mortal sin they are not going to Hell?

 

[Blade_and_Blood]

You have said you don’t know or you’re unsure if there is a God or not.
How does that stack up with the Creed: “I believe in God…”
If you do not believe then you have rejected Christ and his Church which is heresy, maybe apostasy.

Oh, but I *do *believe in God. :yup: I just refuse to define Him. That brings us back to my first response to this entire thread:

“The idea of God acts as an inspiration or an influence.”

…something along the lines of that.

Ironically Yours.

P.S. I am a girl.