Do LDS Prophets Really Talk To God?

[ParkerD]

Another example of failed apologetics and the need to change history. In all truth, the curse WAS the darkening of skin. But, they were promised they would become “white and delightsome” if they accepted God. Problem is, many DID accept God, but never became white. So, the curse has been changed from skin to presence and white had to be changed to “pure”.

TexanKnight,

The Book of Mormon is a plain, forthright text, but one can’t take one verse and have it convey the entire meaning of a passage where other verses are needed to build the context. Verse 20 described the “curse”. That same description of the “curse” appears several times in the Book of Mormon–being “cut off from the presence of the Lord”, because of hard-heartedness.

A wish of peace to you and all readers.

 

[TexanKnight]

TexanKnight,

The Book of Mormon is a plain, forthright text, but one can’t take one verse and have it convey the entire meaning of a passage where other verses are needed to build the context. Verse 20 described the “curse”. That same description of the “curse” appears several times in the Book of Mormon–being “cut off from the presence of the Lord”, because of hard-heartedness.

A wish of peace to you and all readers.

Peace, Brother Parker, but that is more on the nonsensical apologetics from which I had hoped to sway you.

It is clear it was taught blacks would become white.

It is clear blacks did not become white.

It is clear that the Book of Mormon had a verse that changed from White and Delightsome to Pure and Delightsome AFTER it was clear blacks were not becoming white.

 

[theidler]

Parker, come home already to the Church friend. I would be exhausted if I were you from doing all these apologetical acrobatics. Christ is there to welcome your return with open arms brother.
PS: I noticed you did not deal with my second set of replies - any reason?

 

[ParkerD]

Parker, come home already to the Church friend. I would be exhausted if I were you from doing all these apologetical acrobatics. Christ is there to welcome your return with open arms brother.
PS: I noticed you did not deal with my second set of replies - any reason?

theidler,

I’m fine, thanks.

As I had explained to you before, most topics I have responded to already, including all those others your second set of replies covered, so I gave you the Biblical scriptural support you requested (just briefly), and there is no need to enter another revolving door.

Peace to you and all.

 

[TexanKnight]

theidler,

I’m fine, thanks.

As I had explained to you before, most topics I have responded to already, including all those others your second set of replies covered, so I gave you the Biblical scriptural support you requested (just briefly), and there is no need to enter another revolving door.

Peace to you and all.

Yet you have dodged my questions, Brother Parker

 

[ParkerD]

Yet you have dodged my questions, Brother Parker

No, I’ve already discussed all those items also, and there is no need for me to enter a revolving door discussing them again.

Peace to you and all readers.

 

[TexanKnight]

No, I’ve already discussed all those items also, and there is no need for me to enter a revolving door discussing them again.

Peace to you and all readers.

Actually, you haven’t. And this is just another way for you to dodge.

Thats ok, Brother Parker. There was no way you could answer my questions without admitting you are following a false prophet

I pray for you daily

 

[theidler]

theidler,

I’m fine, thanks.

As I had explained to you before, most topics I have responded to already, including all those others your second set of replies covered, so I gave you the Biblical scriptural support you requested (just briefly), and there is no need to enter another revolving door.

Peace to you and all.

Truly sad Parker that you have chosen rejection. But the offer is always there. Christ does not only knock once.

Secondly, forgive me, but I have never seen your responses to these topics elsewhere - might you humor me and respond to my questions anyway, or at least give me a link to where you answered them.

 

[ParkerD]

Actually, you haven’t. And this is just another way for you to dodge.

Thats ok, Brother Parker. There was no way you could answer my questions without admitting you are following a false prophet

I pray for you daily

TexanKnight,

I’ve been posting on this forum for 2 1/2 years longer than you. There is no way in the world that you would know whether I have discussed the topics you have brought up, since a person can look up “all posts by this person” but that really means the 1,500 most recent posts.

Peace to you and all readers.

 

[TexanKnight]

TexanKnight,

I’ve been posting on this forum for 2 1/2 years longer than you. There is no way in the world that you would know whether I have discussed the topics you have brought up, since a person can look up “all posts by this person” but that really means the more recent posts.

Peace to you and all readers.

Thank you for your latest dodge. It is totally understandable.

You are in my prayers.

 

[ParkerD]

Truly sad Parker that you have chosen rejection. But the offer is always there. Christ does not only knock once.

Secondly, forgive me, but I have never seen your responses to these topics elsewhere - might you humor me and respond to my questions anyway, or at least give me a link to where you answered them.

theidler,

If I understand correctly, you are in a process of learning, and have made a decision about that. I support your having made that kind of decision for yourself. There are more important things for you to study that involve the decision you have made, it would seem to me.

Peace to you.

 

[theidler]

theidler,

If I understand correctly, you are in a process of learning, and have made a decision about that. I support your having made that kind of decision for yourself. There are more important things for you to study that involve the decision you have made, it would seem to me.

Peace to you.

Just because I am a catechumen does not mean I know nothing about my faith, and have not studied religion in general for years now.
Humor me, as I would love to see the answers to my specific questions. I’m interested.

 

[ParkerD]

Just because I am a catechumen does not mean I know nothing about my faith, and have not studied religion in general for years now.
Humor me, as I would love to see the answers to my specific questions. I’m interested.

theidler,

I’ll answer two specific questions if you re-ask them (only two).

Bear in mind that I have eight children (four living at home, one about to leave for two years to a foreign country after language training), and my time is extremely limited, so that’s why only two questions.

 

[theidler]

theidler,

I’ll answer two specific questions if you re-ask them (only two).

Bear in mind that I have eight children (four living at home, one about to leave for two years to a foreign country after language training), and my time is extremely limited, so that’s why only two questions.

Parker, while I respect your request, I find it hard to believe given how much time you spend on here defending Mormonism. But if it’s the only way I can get any answers from you instead of excuses, I’ll take what I can get I guess.

Second issue –
You referenced John 5:19 in support of the Mormon doctrine (if there even is such a thing anymore, I’m beginning to wonder) of God once being a man and living on another planet. This kind of absurd reasoning is not even worth arguing with – I might as well cite Jeremiah 1:1 in support of my own doctrine that potato salad is disgusting. There is no relation here.

Fifth issue –
On the contrary, Origen (whom seems to be a favorite of ransacking and twisting by Mormon apologists) tells us “But also the ‘darkness’ which was ‘upon the face of the deep’ is not uncreated; for both were created out of nothing. Hear God speaking in Isaiah: ‘I am the Lord; I form light and create darkness’ (Isa 45:7). Listen how Wisdom in Proverbs proclaims: ‘When there were no depths I was brought forth’ (Prov 8:24). These things are not uncreated, but when or how they were born, I do not know.” (Homily on Isaiah IV:1).

 

[Crdl2Grv]

Second issue –
You referenced John 5:19 in support of the Mormon doctrine (if there even is such a thing anymore, I’m beginning to wonder) of God once being a man and living on another planet. This kind of absurd reasoning is not even worth arguing with – I might as well cite Jeremiah 1:1 in support of my own doctrine that potato salad is disgusting. There is no relation here.

Eidler,

I’m conversant (not quite fluent) in Parker-ese, so let me give you one word of advice: you’ll probably want to re-phrase the above question. He’ll use your characterization of “God once being a man and living on another planet” to dodge the real point of your question. He will say, “I’ve never stated that Heavenly Father was ever a ‘man’ like us” and just move on.

If you’ll permit me, I’d suggest a better way to phrase your question: “… in support of the Mormon doctrine that Heavenly Father was once on another Earth performing the same work in the same way that Jesus did on our Earth.” That will give him one less excuse to dismiss your question.

 

[ParkerD]

Parker, while I respect your request, I find it hard to believe given how much time you spend on here defending Mormonism. But if it’s the only way I can get any answers from you instead of excuses, I’ll take what I can get I guess.

Second issue –
You referenced John 5:19 in support of the Mormon doctrine (if there even is such a thing anymore, I’m beginning to wonder) of God once being a man and living on another planet. This kind of absurd reasoning is not even worth arguing with – I might as well cite Jeremiah 1:1 in support of my own doctrine that potato salad is disgusting. There is no relation here.

Fifth issue –
On the contrary, Origen (whom seems to be a favorite of ransacking and twisting by Mormon apologists) tells us “But also the ‘darkness’ which was ‘upon the face of the deep’ is not uncreated; for both were created out of nothing. Hear God speaking in Isaiah: ‘I am the Lord; I form light and create darkness’ (Isa 45:7). Listen how Wisdom in Proverbs proclaims: ‘When there were no depths I was brought forth’ (Prov 8:24). These things are not uncreated, but when or how they were born, I do not know.” (Homily on Isaiah IV:1).

theidler,

Those aren’t questions, but here are the rationale:

Second issue:

Jesus said He saw what His Father did, and did the same. He said His Father had power over resurrection, and He did also. They are simple statements. He was speaking the truth about Himself simply in those statements.

Fifth issue:

If you read the verses in Genesis, you will note that man was “formed” “of the dust of the ground”.

If the hypothesis were true that God created everything from nothing, then there was no need to “form man of the dust of the ground” and it would be exactly contrary to the hypothesis.

Verse two of Genesis 1 describes the initial situation: “the earth was without form, and void”–so there was no “earth” because the matter and energy were without “form”–they had not been formed, but that does not mean nothing existed prior to that point.

 

[theidler]

theidler,

Those aren’t questions, but here are the rationale:

Second issue:

Jesus said He saw what His Father did, and did the same. He said His Father had power over resurrection, and He did also. They are simple statements. He was speaking the truth about Himself simply in those statements.

Fifth issue:

If you read the verses in Genesis, you will note that man was “formed” “of the dust of the ground”.

If the hypothesis were true that God created everything from nothing, then there was no need to “form man of the dust of the ground” and it would be exactly contrary to the hypothesis.

Verse two of Genesis 1 describes the initial situation: “the earth was without form, and void”–so there was no “earth” because the matter and energy were without “form”–they had not been formed, but that does not mean nothing existed prior to that point.

Yes, I know, they were replies to your statements which I wanted you to address.
Um…your reply concerning the second issue explains nothing about how God was a man on another planet. If you asked me if the sky was blue and I responded, “I am going down to fourth street cafe for a cup of coffee”, then you might feel how I do about this response.

As for the second issue, the dust that man was created from was already part of the created universe, which was created ex nihilo.

 

[ParkerD]

Yes, I know, they were replies to your statements which I wanted you to address.
Um…your reply concerning the second issue explains nothing about how God was a man on another planet. If you asked me if the sky was blue and I responded, “I am going down to fourth street cafe for a cup of coffee”, then you might feel how I do about this response.

“The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for whatsoever things he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.”

“For the Father loveth the Son, and sheweth him all things that himself doeth:”

The Son, Jesus explained to the Jewish leaders, only does “what he seeth the Father do”, and “can do nothing of himself”.

If I said that I can only do what I have seen my father do, then I would mean that I have seen my father do “all the things he did”, and that I do what my father did because I saw him do them and because I know (in Jesus’ case, He knows perfectly) how to do those same things.

In verse 20, “himself doeth” is referring back to the Father.

 

[theidler]

“The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for whatsoever things he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.”

“For the Father loveth the Son, and sheweth him all things that himself doeth:”

The Son, Jesus explained to the Jewish leaders, only does “what he seeth the Father do”, and “can do nothing of himself”.

If I said that I can only do what I have seen my father do, then I would mean that I have seen my father do “all the things he did”, and that I do what my father did because I saw him do them and because I know (in Jesus’ case, He knows perfectly) how to do those same things.

In verse 20, “himself doeth” is referring back to the Father.

That’s great Parker, but it doesn’t touch on anything to do with the idea of God once being a man on another planet…?!

 

[ParkerD]

That’s great Parker, but it doesn’t touch on anything to do with the idea of God once being a man on another planet…?!

theidler,

Jesus was born on this earth, a planet. He is Man of holiness. He took upon himself a tabernacle of flesh and bones. After His death, He brought about His own resurrection with a glorified body of flesh and bones.

To say that the Father also did those things, before, on another earth, is the answer to your question about why those verses apply. Jesus did what He had seen that His Father had already done.