Do Muslims think Jesus was crucified or not?

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Thanks. So for now at least, all we know for sure is that only Mohammad saw the angel.
Eh? The Hadith Jibreel is the very FIRST hadith in the Sahih Muslim collection, in the Book of Faith. There you have the witnesses, starting with 'Umar ibn al-Khattab who narrates the account saying he was sitting with some other Companions with the Messenger. So that’s at least one witness, and I don’t have the names of the rest, which is what I said before.

Wanna read it?

usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/hadith/muslim/001.smt.html
 
She’s talking about the Quran, not the angel.
lol! no she isn’t, she said:
"He did quite a few miracles, actually. And yes, his Companions saw the angel. You can’t see those miracles, and you can’t see the angel. But there’s a miracle you can still witness. "

And then replied to me:
*Yeah, you’ve mentioned your “tempOral lobe seizures” theory before. However, there were witnesses to the angel. Not sure who told you otherwise, but there’s a list of witnesses who saw the angel walk into town on one occasion, sit with Muhammad and ask him some questions (a teaching moment for the benefit of the Companions.) I’ve even listed the witnesses elsewhere on the forum. But mostly people just ignore it.

They huff and they puff and ignore all the facts. Reality has little to do with their defense anyway. *
 
Eh? The Hadith Jibreel is the very FIRST hadith in the Sahih Muslim collection, in the Book of Faith. There you have the witnesses, starting with 'Umar ibn al-Khattab who narrates the account saying he was sitting with some other Companions with the Messenger. So that’s at least one witness, and I don’t have the names of the rest, which is what I said before.

Wanna read it?

usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/hadith/muslim/001.smt.html
No bright flashing lights? A man saunters in speaks and saunters out lol!

The man who is supposedly Gabriel says Muhammad, inform me about al-Islam

…One day we were sitting in the company of Allah’s Apostle (peace be upon him) when there appeared before us a man dressed in pure white clothes, his hair extraordinarily black. There were no signs of travel on him. None amongst us recognized him. At last he sat with the Apostle (peace be upon him) He knelt before him placed his palms on his thighs and said: Muhammad, inform me about al-Islam. The Messenger of Allah (peace be upon him) said: Al-Islam implies that you testify that there is no god but Allah and that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah, and you establish prayer, pay Zakat, observe the fast of Ramadan, and perform pilgrimage to the (House) if you are solvent enough (to bear the expense of) the journey. He (the inquirer) said: You have told the truth. He (Umar ibn al-Khattab) said: It amazed us that he would put the question and then he would himself verify the truth. He (the inquirer) said: Inform me about Iman (faith). He (the Holy Prophet) replied: That you affirm your faith in Allah, in His angels, in His Books, in His Apostles, in the Day of Judgment, and you affirm your faith in the Divine Decree about good and evil. He (the inquirer) said: You have told the truth. He (the inquirer) again said: Inform me about al-Ihsan (performance of good deeds). He (the Holy Prophet) said: That you worship Allah as if you are seeing Him, for though you don’t see Him, He, verily, sees you. He (the enquirer) again said: Inform me about the hour (of the Doom). He (the Holy Prophet) remarked: One who is asked knows no more than the one who is inquiring (about it). He (the inquirer) said: Tell me some of its indications. He (the Holy Prophet) said: That the slave-girl will give birth to her mistress and master, that you will find barefooted, destitute goat-herds vying with one another in the construction of magnificent buildings. He (the narrator, Umar ibn al-Khattab) said: Then he (the inquirer) went on his way but I stayed with him (the Holy Prophet) for a long while. He then, said to me: Umar, do you know who this inquirer was? I replied: Allah and His Apostle knows best. He (the Holy Prophet) remarked: He was Gabriel (the angel). He came to you in order to instruct you in matters of religion.

No one else recognizes that this is Gabriel?!
Simply Mohammad’s word that this is Gabriel!?! lol!!
 
Could you please link to that location and to the source of the list? Thanks.
I would if I could but I can’t seem to find a record of either.

Basically, the primary evidence of people seeing the Angel Gabriel is an account calledthe Hadith Jibreel, an authentic (saheeh) report. At the time I found a list of 7 witnesses (who recounted the occasion, which is why they’re listed as witnesses.) That’s how I found them, by looking at narrators of the hadith

Among them were 'Umar ibn Al-Khattab, Abu Hurayrah and Abu ad-Dhar, I think, but I can’t remember.
Eh? The Hadith Jibreel is the very FIRST hadith in the Sahih Muslim collection, in the Book of Faith. There you have the witnesses, starting with 'Umar ibn al-Khattab who narrates the account saying he was sitting with some other Companions with the Messenger. So that’s at least one witness, and I don’t have the names of the rest, which is what I said before.

Wanna read it?

usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/hadith/muslim/001.smt.html
Thanks for the clarification. I had read that before; I should have recalled it. The hadith recounts what a guy said another guy said his father told him. The chain has been deemed authentic.
 
While Christianity might not promote good hygiene, Islam does. Islam is a complete way of life with guidance from God, so why shouldn’t it include good hygiene? It’s part of good health, and shouldn’t your way of life promote good health?
Are muslims healthier than christians.
Then I little or no value in bringing up “good hygeine/health” in a religious doctrine. As you seem to admit, people are just as healthy without Islam.
 
Try reading the first five chapters. These account for almost 25% of the Qur’an and talk at length about Christianity.

What is more important is having a relationship with God. Direct, no intermediaries. Understanding who God is, understanding how to obey and worship Him.
I have read those; they say very little “about christianity.” Christ (Issa) is mentioned maybe 10 times.

Yet you say they “talk at length about christianity”, like many muslims on the internet.
But both say almost nothing about the crucifixion, which you admitted is very important to christianity. So, according to you, the Koran talks at length to christians yet neglects the thing that you say important to them, but also insignificant.

That is a HUUUUUGE contradiction by yourself and the man you follow. A gaping hole in Islam, imo.
Let me break it down:
و قولهم And their saying/speech:
إنا قتلنا المسيح عيسى ابن مريم رسول الله: certainly, we killed the Messiah Jesus the son of Mary the Messenger of Allah
و ما قتلوه : they didn’t kill him
و ما صلبوه : and they didn’t crucify him
و لكن شبه لهم: however it seemed that way to them
و إن الذين اختلفوا في لفي شك منه: and certainly those who differ about it are in doubt about it
ما لهم به من علم الا اتباع الظن: they have no knowledge (at all) except following assumption
و ما قتلوه يقينا: but no, they didn’t kill him, for sure
Anyway, this ayah is one of many which directs people towards truth. It does a few thing–it mentions a false claim that’s being made. It honors Jesus with the best titles, and then it disputes two different claims. Not one, check it, but two. First, it says Jesus wasn’t killed. (What happened to him? Oh, the next ayah says Allah raised Jesus up to Himself.) And then it says that they didn’t crucify him. However, the ayah also acknowledges that it seemed like a crucifixion happened.
I’ve read that many times.
'They killed him not."
It just “seemed that way.”

???

That is substantial information on the matter, you say.
I say it is incredibly lacking, but understandable. As I said before: if Mohammad can’t come up with a good story, it is wise in some respects that he not even try.
The Qur’an mentions Jesus literally dozens of times. Mostly it talks about Allah, however. After all this time, have you even read it?
Most of it. It is painful to read, I’m sorry.
I would say Jesus is mentioned 1 or 2 dozen times in passing.
Although mentioned by name maybe only six times, the “messenger of Allah” defintely has a much more prominent role. That is understandable. But I reject the notion that Jesus is a big deal in the Koran.
what really happened at the crucifixion is less important in reality than Christianity has made it seem.
As I’ve said more than once, I wouldn’t expect you to think anything else: it is best to essentially flank what you can’t confront successfully.

I’m curious though, how exactly is the crucifixion less important to christianity than what christians think it is?

I thought the conversation wa essentially over, but let’s pursue that.
 
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