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colliric
Guest
Yes but he is incorrect in asserting that scripture is infallible.
It is not living and cannot make decisions itself…
It is not living and cannot make decisions itself…
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c659smith
Guest
Great job of understanding.
Your teacher did well and you are a good student.
The one exception is the Bible. The Church teaches that everything the Bible asserts (properly understood, of course) is true and therefore without error.
the active agent is alive and capable of making decisions. A human being is an active agent. Normally human beings are fallible. Sometimes they decide rightly, and sometimes they decide wrongly. In a few instances (such as the pope when speaking ex cathedra or the bishops united with the pope when speaking through an ecumenical council) human beings may decide infallibly.
But a rock is never infallible. Nor is it fallible. It is neither because it makes no decision about anything. Ditto for a plant. No sunflower ever made the right decision—or the wrong decision. In fact, no sunflower ever made any decision, properly speaking.
The same can be said of a book. No book, not even the Bible, is capable of making a decision. This means it would be wrong to say that the Bible is either infallible or fallible—such terms should not be used about it or about any other book.
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Cleopas
Guest
Please allow me to qualify that my use of the term “infallible” was because that was precisely the term St. Rafael used in his reply to me.
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charlesh
Guest
From whence so much tenderness for so notorious an arch-heretic, the leader of that great rebellion that tore apart Christendom?Luther does not deserve that
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colliric
Guest
cool.
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colliric
Guest
Because it is an entirly christian notion to “love thy enemies”. Luther is wrong, but that does not mean that we are allowed to condemn him despite his actions. He thought he was right just like we think we are right and think he was a Heretic.
You can love someone, and be against them at the same time… in disagreeing with them, you can show love because you believe they do wrong and need to correct themselves, and the unloving thing to do would be to condemn them.
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charlesh
Guest
Being a peacenik is not Christian. Speaking the Truth is. Was John the baptizer not “loving his enemies” when he called out to the Pharisees: “Ye brood of vipers, who hath showed you to flee from the wrath to come?”
Was Jesus disobeying his own Law when he said: “O generation of vipers, how can you speak good things, whereas you are evil?” He said “you are evil”! Not, "I love you but the doctrine you teach is evil and not true.
Look at the example of the Saints. For example, when someone begged Pope St. Pius X to “go soft” on the Modernists, he replied:
Kindness is for fools! They want them to be treated with oil, soap, and caresses but they ought to be beaten with fists! In a duel you don’t count or measure the blows, you strike as you can! War is not made with charity, it is a struggle, a duel. If Our Lord were not terrible he would not have given an example in this, too. See how he treated the Philistines, the sowers of error, the wolves in sheep’s clothing, the traitors in the temple. He scourged them with whips!
Not that I particularly want to beat Luther with my fists, but I see nothing wrong with calling a spade a spade…or a demon a demon.
Was Jesus disobeying his own Law when he said: “O generation of vipers, how can you speak good things, whereas you are evil?” He said “you are evil”! Not, "I love you but the doctrine you teach is evil and not true.
Look at the example of the Saints. For example, when someone begged Pope St. Pius X to “go soft” on the Modernists, he replied:
Kindness is for fools! They want them to be treated with oil, soap, and caresses but they ought to be beaten with fists! In a duel you don’t count or measure the blows, you strike as you can! War is not made with charity, it is a struggle, a duel. If Our Lord were not terrible he would not have given an example in this, too. See how he treated the Philistines, the sowers of error, the wolves in sheep’s clothing, the traitors in the temple. He scourged them with whips!
Not that I particularly want to beat Luther with my fists, but I see nothing wrong with calling a spade a spade…or a demon a demon.
That’s relativistic thinking, my brother. We follow perennial Catholic Truth, we don’t try to change it or make war on God and his Church, no matter how right we **think **or **feel **we are.
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t68ware
Guest
Here is where the error is…you are throwing extra requirements in when it comes to deciding who is a Christian. I was not aware the Bible says believe in Jesus and the teachings of the Church and you will be saved. I always thought it said Believe on the Lord Jesus and you will be saved. Silly me…I should have known He was speaking of Vatican II centuries before it was written.
You cannot add what it means to become Christian just because the Church says so. The Bible is very clear on that subject and no Pope can add to it.
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charlesh
Guest
But how can one seriously say that one “believes on the Lord Jesus” when one rejects His teachings? I’m thinking particularly about His teachings on the authority of Peter the first Pope, on eating of Christ’s flesh and blood in Holy Communion, and Justification by grace alone through faith and works.
How can you say that you “believe in Him” when you reject His Divine teachings?
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saint_rafael
Guest
Gottle of Geer,
You seem to be a very confused neo-catholic.
Vatican II was an a ecumenical council, but it is not on the same level as Trent or Vatican I.
Pope John XXIII before the council startted said it was not giong to be dogmatic coucil and it’s only purpose was pastoral. Pope Paul VI said the documents carried no weight of infallibility.
The Catholic faithful therefore can view the documents of VII as pastoral advise. Catholics are not reqiured to accept any of them if they don’t want to. There is nothing about them that bind the faithful.
Martin Luther was not only a notorius heretic who destroyed western Christianity for centuries, but was one of the biggest
Anti-Christs in history. He served his master the father of lies, in which he is with him in eternity.
You seem to be a very confused neo-catholic.
Vatican II was an a ecumenical council, but it is not on the same level as Trent or Vatican I.
Pope John XXIII before the council startted said it was not giong to be dogmatic coucil and it’s only purpose was pastoral. Pope Paul VI said the documents carried no weight of infallibility.
The Catholic faithful therefore can view the documents of VII as pastoral advise. Catholics are not reqiured to accept any of them if they don’t want to. There is nothing about them that bind the faithful.
Martin Luther was not only a notorius heretic who destroyed western Christianity for centuries, but was one of the biggest
Anti-Christs in history. He served his master the father of lies, in which he is with him in eternity.
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saint_rafael
Guest
There are two ways to be a heretic.
One is a baptized Catholic who rejects an article of faith and becomes a heretic.
The second way is a person who is baptized in the trinitarian formula, recieves sanctfying grace, but loses it uopn commiting mortal sin like most Protestants.
A person is born into a heretical religion like Protestantism stays in that religion for his whole life without seeing the heretical nature of the religion. They do not enter the only salvific faith of Christ’s religion. They do not receive the sacraments that lead to salvation.
The Apostles who wrote the gospels were Catholic. At the time of Jesus and the apostles there was one Church, the Catholic Church. Many passages about accepting Jesus was written to get Jews and Pagans to become Catholic. Decades and centuries passed before the divisions fully culminated in our time where you now have 30,000 false sects.
Gods hates all religions except Roman Catholicism, which is the one true religion and his divine plan.
One is a baptized Catholic who rejects an article of faith and becomes a heretic.
The second way is a person who is baptized in the trinitarian formula, recieves sanctfying grace, but loses it uopn commiting mortal sin like most Protestants.
A person is born into a heretical religion like Protestantism stays in that religion for his whole life without seeing the heretical nature of the religion. They do not enter the only salvific faith of Christ’s religion. They do not receive the sacraments that lead to salvation.
The Apostles who wrote the gospels were Catholic. At the time of Jesus and the apostles there was one Church, the Catholic Church. Many passages about accepting Jesus was written to get Jews and Pagans to become Catholic. Decades and centuries passed before the divisions fully culminated in our time where you now have 30,000 false sects.
Gods hates all religions except Roman Catholicism, which is the one true religion and his divine plan.
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charlesh
Guest
Not according to the definition you *just *provided. [Scratching my head on that one.]
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wisdomseeker
Guest
YOU FORGOT TO MENTION THE PART WHEN JESUS SAYS TO THE APOSTLES “WHOEVER LISTENS TO YOU LISTENS TO ME.” DO YOU SEE THE LIGHT?Here is where the error is…you are throwing extra requirements in when it comes to deciding who is a Christian. I was not aware the Bible says believe in Jesus and the teachings of the Church and you will be saved. I always thought it said Believe on the Lord Jesus and you will be saved. Silly me…I should have known He was speaking of Vatican II centuries before it was written.
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saint_rafael
Guest
Martin Luther was a demon among other things. He was a heretic and one of the biggest Anti-Christs in history. I call him a deomon as has many saints because he served Satan by helping to tear the Church apart.
Martin Luther’s real last name was really Luder. Luder in German, means beast. He changed his last name to Luther so he would not be associated with the demonic even though his actions later in life was.
Martin Luther’s real last name was really Luder. Luder in German, means beast. He changed his last name to Luther so he would not be associated with the demonic even though his actions later in life was.
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fbl9
Guest
basically then the church is not full of heresies but rather full of HERETICS.in my little parish i do not personally know of any but there are some in the area maybe that’s why i never see them come Sunday.
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fbl9
Guest
in the sign of peace i do not celebrate myself but offer the peace of Christ to my brothers and sisters in Him.and you never felt the wieght of your savoir in your hand then.touching my savoir has never harmed my faith.i have to agree i feel somewhat awkward standing but in my heart i on my knees face down.kinda wondered how Christ has died… was a mystery of faith.as for the last part of your list i haven’t ran into this things in the church but woe to those if i do.
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justasking4
Guest
Must a person belong to the catholic church to be saved?
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Gottle_of_Geer
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To deny that Luther was a demon is to speak the truth. There is nothing inherently Christian about using violent language. As for the Baptist, we are told only what he said; not that he was right, or wrong, to using such language. Besides, the Saints are not always to be imitated.
We are not Jesus Christ. For Christians, who are sinful, to use language like that can too easily become an expression of unrighteous ill-temper. We have been commanded to love one another, and to bless, rather than to curse - to use evil language is too congenial to unregenerate human nature; it is unworthy of our calling as Christians, as well as a very dangerous excuse for Christians to express the sinfulness that is in their hearts under a cloak of zeal for God. If we do that, we are in danger of falsifying the meaning of Love - & what it means, is revealed in the Crucified.
God has revealed Who He is in Jesus Christ, Who did not curse or kill those who betrayed, denied, arrested, tried, condemned, crucified & mocked Him; He prayed for them, & poured out His Life upon the Cross, & “became sin that we might become in Him the Righteousness of God”. That boundless self-sacrificing Love shows the true character of God - that is what God is really like. That is Our God - a God Who repays Love for hate, & came that sinners, His enemies, might become His brethren. That God, of love & compassion & forebearance, is Our Model - what place is there for us to curse our fellow-men ?Cursing is easy - but only the God of free grace & undeserved mercy “whose property is always to have mercy, and to spare” (as the Missal says) can teach us who are unlovely to “love one another”. He has commanded us to do so - He has not commanded us to curse.
Christians are disciples of Jesus Christ - not of his servants.
- Luther was a human being - not a demon
- If we curse other Christians, we have no right to complain when or if they return curse for curse
- Jesus Christ embodies, shows, & exemplifies God’s Love - if we try to set aside that Love, we falsify the Gospel.
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