Do Protestants really follow the Bible alone?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Zenkai
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
If your goal is to get others to see your viewpoint, I would say that you’re failing. 🤷
My viewpoint does not matter. My goal is to get others to seek the Truth no matter where it may lead them. In my case, it lead me to the Catholic Church. The Truth is the Truth.
 
My goal is to get others to seek the Truth no matter where it may lead them.
If that is indeed your goal, you would do well to study some techniques that encourage others, rather than immediately drive them away.

For most audiences I would say that if you find yourself having the tone of a Jack Chick tract, then that would be a good indication to seek more fruitful methodologies.
 
Please!

This is the electronic age, as well as the age of the w.w.w.

Do not act as if you can not just Google: “Martin Luther Bipolar” or “Martin Luther Manic Depressive”

There are various studies and opinions that have been submitted for decades from Catholic and non-Catholic Psychologists and Psychiatrists about Martin Luther.

It is the same for any assertion. Do not take my word, when the Web holds the answers.
Papa,

Poppa,

Daddy,

Father,

Sire,

Padre,

it’s incumbent on a poster to support their comments without forcing all others to search the web. You are also asserting that if it is on the web it is true. How do I know what source you looked at? The burden is 100% on you to provide a reference.
 
So, that’s a no on the sources then. Thank you for sharing.
Not exactly a no.

What I am saying is, that I am not going to waste my time doing another person’s homework. I will point and state, but the curious must take the steps to discover for themselves.

Yes, I could make lists of books and authors in a vain attempt to persuade, but that is not my goal. I just want others to seek out the Truth. Knowledge is no longer hidden and only available to the privileged.

The good Lord has made His Truth available to all via the electronic age. What was once confined to “person to person” word of mouth and Scripture has been expanded to the masses.

At one time the Good News was confined to the Jews within their Hebrew and Greek traditions, but the day of Penticost changed all of that. Suddenly the Word of God was presented in all languages and to all peoples. It took time before the apostles acknowledged what the Lord intended, but Paul was the insrument of understanding.
 
Not exactly a no.

What I am saying is, that I am not going to waste my time doing another person’s homework. I will point and state, but the curious must take the steps to discover for themselves.

Yes, I could make lists of books and authors in a vain attempt to persuade, but that is not my goal. I just want others to seek out the Truth. Knowledge is no longer hidden and only available to the privileged.

The good Lord has made His Truth available to all via the electronic age. What was once confined to “person to person” word of mouth and Scripture has been expanded to the masses.

At one time the Good News was confined to the Jews within their Hebrew and Greek traditions, but the day of Penticost changed all of that. Suddenly the Word of God was presented in all languages and to all peoples. It took time before the apostles acknowledged what the Lord intended, but Paul was the insrument of understanding.
Papa,

Then play this out… You don’t provide any support for your beliefs / assertions (Luther was bi-polar among others) and expect everyone to research the net? So in response it would be fair for someone else to make a statement countering you, and then tell you to research it yourself. That results in no discussion…no progress, no learning…it is not a productive dialogue…it’s not dialogue. Plus a good way to get on a lot of “ignore” lists.
 
Papa,

Poppa,

Daddy,

Father,

Sire,

Padre,

it’s incumbent on a poster to support their comments without forcing all others to search the web. You are also asserting that if it is on the web it is true. How do I know what source you looked at? The burden is 100% on you to provide a reference.
I assert nothing of the kind.

I assume the seeker has enough common sense to sift through data and identify the ice cream and seperate it from the manure.

My assumption is flawed, however, in that many refuse to seek the Truth with honesty, in an attempt to avoid discomfort.

Of this I am sure, if you open your heart to the Truth, you do not need Papa Paul to lead you to it and then rub your nose in it. I love you too much to take the credit for your salvation.

This is between you and the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, my Lord and my God, Whom I love because He is always loving me, and He is always loving you.

Your brother in Christ
 
I assert nothing of the kind.

I assume the seeker has enough common sense to sift through data and identify the ice cream and seperate it from the manure.

My assumption is flawed, however, in that many refuse to seek the Truth with honesty, in an attempt to avoid discomfort.

Of this I am sure, if you open your heart to the Truth, you do not need Papa Paul to lead you to it and then rub your nose in it. I love you too much to take the credit for your salvation.

This is between you and the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, my Lord and my God, Whom I love because He is always loving me, and He is always loving you.

Your brother in Christ
Pops,

So your interpretation of 1 Peter 3:15…your answer…is to send everyone to the Internet to sift through and find the ice cream? The early Church had neither. My first job was working at baskin Robbins, I know ice cream and how to make a shake.😛

15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:
 
Papa,

Then play this out… You don’t provide any support for your beliefs / assertions (Luther was bi-polar among others) and expect everyone to research the net? So in response it would be fair for someone else to make a statement countering you, and then tell you to research it yourself. That results in no discussion…no progress, no learning…it is not a productive dialogue…it’s not dialogue. Plus a good way to get on a lot of “ignore” lists.
I understand.

I have said all I need to say at the moment, but maybe others know of what I speak. I will allow them to elaborate.

My goal was to spark honest discussion on the founding father of Protestantism. This discussion lends itself to the question concerning Protestants and if they really do follow the Bible at all.

In my opinion, they do not, as Martin Luther and his followers attempted to devalue and discard whole books from the Bible. Protestant founders do not even include these books in Protestant versions of the Bible.

If that is untruthful, I deserve to be ignored and so be it. No hard feelings.

With Love, your brother in Christ.
 
In my opinion, they do not, as Martin Luther and his followers attempted to devalue and discard whole books from the Bible. Protestant founders do not even include these books in Protestant versions of the Bible.

If that is untruthful, I deserve to be ignored and so be it. No hard feelings.

With Love, your brother in Christ.
You are right.
 
Pops,

So your interpretation of 1 Peter 3:15…your answer…is to send everyone to the Internet to sift through and find the ice cream? The early Church had neither. My first job was working at baskin Robbins, I know ice cream and how to make a shake.😛

15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:
I’d like two scoops of Rocky Road please!

I agree with 1 Peter 3:15

That is why I do not feel qualified to teach or preach. My positions are simple and the Truth has been made accessible to all. Is it too much to ask, that a seeker look? I am confident in the will of God and His providence. “Knock and the door will be opened.”
 
I understand.

I have said all I need to say at the moment, but maybe others know of what I speak. I will allow them to elaborate.

My goal was to spark honest discussion on the founding father of Protestantism. This discussion lends itself to the question concerning Protestants and if they really do follow the Bible at all.

In my opinion, they do not, as Martin Luther and his followers attempted to devalue and discard whole books from the Bible. Protestant founders do not even include these books in Protestant versions of the Bible.

If that is untruthful, I deserve to be ignored and so be it. No hard feelings.

With Love, your brother in Christ.
Wow, This tired old story still floatin around? Listen Papa Paul, Luther DID NOT remove any books from the bible. The Luther translation has all the same number of books that the Catholic bible has. Luther moved them to the middle. Protestant bibles still have the same number of New Testament books as well. The reason most bibles dont have the DCs was they were taken out for cost cutting a long time ago. Seriously, you need to have more charity, and you need to provide sources. This is how it’s done here.
 
I’ve been considering lately the doctrine of solo and sola scripture. For the sake of argument I accept this dichotomy though most times Ive experienced people who want to have both.

Protestant’s cannot have the bible alone as their highest authority or only source. In the former because the bible alone would not be their only source. The protestant would admit the spirit of God is needed to read and understand the scripture properly to guide the mind into correct interpretation, so this right from the start means we have two highest authorities in the eyes of a sola scripturist. And it must be asked if God can inspire the person to read scripture correctly, why can’t the same be done for tradition? It would be no less chaotic than the thousands of ideas which have come about since sola scriptura and the principle of Just me and my bible, in fact I would suggest by the most ancient churches which exist today it actually works better.
 
Wow, This tired old story still floatin around? Listen Papa Paul, Luther DID NOT remove any books from the bible. The Luther translation has all the same number of books that the Catholic bible has. Luther moved them to the middle. Protestant bibles still have the same number of New Testament books as well. The reason most bibles dont have the DCs was they were taken out for cost cutting a long time ago. Seriously, you need to have more charity, and you need to provide sources. This is how it’s done here.
I ask you then to name the books of the Bible.

Seems to me that there is a difference between what the 4th Century Catholic Magisterium and the 21st Century Catholic Magisterium agree upon as the Canonical Books of Holy Scripture and what books are contained in the Protestant Bible today.

This is a faily simple request that I hope you do not ignore. I admit that I have not read a Protestant version of the Bible in many years, so please enlighten me.
 
I’d like two scoops of Rocky Road please!

I agree with 1 Peter 3:15

That is why I do not feel qualified to teach or preach. My positions are simple and the Truth has been made accessible to all. Is it too much to ask, that a seeker look? I am confident in the will of God and His providence. “Knock and the door will be opened.”
Ok Papa, good…very honest and heartfelt answer. Sometimes you really have to show em what door to go to…the Internet has way too many doors to knock on to understand which one opens and has the truth. One thing that I try to do…for my own sanity … stay on one topic per post and not throw out multiple topics at once. All my sentences were two words in high school,usually “Da Bears”. Simple guy from Chicago I am.
 
If your goal is to get others to see your viewpoint, I would say that you’re failing. 🤷
I agree, sometimes it is difficult for me to be diplomatic.

I ask that you pray for me to find a more appealing approach. Maybe this venue is beyond my reach as a vehicle to bring others to the fullness of Christianity.

I was hoping to inspire curiosity, instead I may be causing deeper division.

Pehaps I should disappear?
 
I’ve been considering lately the doctrine of solo and sola scripture. For the sake of argument I accept this dichotomy though most times Ive experienced people who want to have both.

Protestant’s cannot have the bible alone as their highest authority or only source. In the former because the bible alone would not be their only source. The protestant would admit the spirit of God is needed to read and understand the scripture properly to guide the mind into correct interpretation, so this right from the start means we have two highest authorities in the eyes of a sola scripturist. And it must be asked if God can inspire the person to read scripture correctly, why can’t the same be done for tradition? It would be no less chaotic than the thousands of ideas which have come about since sola scriptura and the principle of Just me and my bible, in fact I would suggest by the most ancient churches which exist today it actually works better.
Nice post. The ECFs all believed in Sacred Scripture + Sacred Tradition as well which is why we see the following in the catholic catechism.

CCC - “Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture, then, are bound closely together, and communicate one with the other. For both of them, flowing out from the same divine well-spring, come together in some fashion to form one thing, and move towards the same goal.” Each of them makes present and fruitful in the Church the mystery of Christ, who promised to remain with his own “always, to the close of the age”.

**Paradosis - Apostolic tradition
**
“So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught, whether by word of mouth or by letter from us (apostolic).” 2 Thessalonians 2

“Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from every brother who leads an unruly life and not according to the tradition which you received from us (apostolic).” 2 Thessalonians3

Now I praise you because you remember me in everything and hold firmly to the tradition, just as I (Paul, an apostle) delivered them to you." Corinthians 11

**Paradosis - non-Apostolic tradition
**

Mark 7:3 - “For the Pharisees and all the Jews do not eat unless they carefully wash their hands, thus observing the traditions of the elders.”

Mr 7:5 The Pharisees and the scribes asked Him, “Why do Your disciples not walk according to the tradition of the elders, but eat their bread with impure hands?”

Mr 7:8 - “Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men.”

Mr 7:9 - "He was also saying to them, "You are experts at setting aside the commandment of God in order to keep your tradition.

Col 2:8 - "See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, according to the tradition of men, according to the elementary principles of the world, rather than according to Christ.
 
I agree, sometimes it is difficult for me to be diplomatic.

I ask that you pray for me to find a more appealing approach. Maybe this venue is beyond my reach as a vehicle to bring others to the fullness of Christianity.

I was hoping to inspire curiosity, instead I may be causing deeper division.

Pehaps I should disappear?
Nah, you are fine. Stick around brother. 👍
 
I ask you then to name the books of the Bible.

Seems to me that there is a difference between what the 4th Century Catholic Magisterium and the 21st Century Catholic Magisterium agree upon as the Canonical Books of Holy Scripture and what books are contained in the Protestant Bible today.

This is a faily simple request that I hope you do not ignore. I admit that I have not read a Protestant version of the Bible in many years, so please enlighten me.
Catholic: 27 New Testament + 46 Old testament = 73 total

Old Testament:
Genesis
Exodus
Leviticus
Numbers
Deuteronomy
Joshua
Judges
Ruth
1 Samuel
2 Samuel
1 Kings
2 Kings
1 Chronicles
2 Chronicles
Ezra

Nehemiah
Tobit
Judith
Esther
1 Maccabees
2 Maccabees
Job
Psalms
The Proverbs
Ecclesiastes
The Song of Songs
Wisdom
Ecclesiasticus / Sirach
Isaiah
Jeremiah

Lamentations
Baruch
Ezekiel
Daniel
Hosea
Joel
Amos
Obadiah
Jonah
Micah
Nahum
Habakkuk
Zephaniah
Haggai
Zechariah
Malachi

New Testament:
Matthew
Mark
Luke
John
Acts of Apostles
Romans
1 Corinthians
2 Corinthians
Galatians

Ephesians
Philippians
Colossians
1 Thessalonians
2 Thessalonians
1 Timothy
2 Timothy
Titus
Philemon

Hebrews
James
1 Peter
2 Peter
1 John
2 John
3 John
Jude
Revelation
 
Ok Papa, good…very honest and heartfelt answer. Sometimes you really have to show em what door to go to…the Internet has way too many doors to knock on to understand which one opens and has the truth. One thing that I try to do…for my own sanity … stay on one topic per post and not throw out multiple topics at once. All my sentences were two words in high school,usually “Da Bears”. Simple guy from Chicago I am.
Da Bears gave Da Cards Da Boot!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top