Do Protestants Really Hate Catholicism?

[qui_est_ce]

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[nancy_dalrymple]

Would someone please help JosieElaine and granny?

I’m not sure how to explain what I do. I preview my post and if the quotes don’t look right, I play around with the icon on top which looks like the voice “box” in a cartoon. It is to the immediate left of the hash or number mark # Putting the pointer on it will say "Wrap

tags around selected text."

I start highlighting the text, click the Wrap thing at the top and bottom of the highlighted material and test it all in Preview Post which is a box at bottom of screen. If I pick up the wrong text or the text from a previous post then I start deleting the

things. And start over.

O.K. you guys ---- I hear you laughing

Close your mouths and please give us some instructions.

Blessings,
granny

All human life is meant for eternal life.

Hay the problem with you people is that you dont know when to be nice to someone or help them I went through this same **** when I came here,how about a little LOVE,and Help! Thank You Nancy

 

[jlhargus]

What I truly don’t understand is how anybody can claim that God couldn’t keep His word perfect no matter how much time is passed.

JL: Yes God can and does keep his Word and Church free from error. However, interpretations are not free from error as plainly evident by the tridition of men (sola scriptura) scattering into myriads of denominations and still scattering today. Has sola scriptura ever UNITED anyone? How many faith groups has it divided?

Who has the directive to interpret these “abstract concepts” in God’s Word? The infallible Pope?

JL: Yes, the pope, only, when he speaks as head and for the whole people of God. Also Ecuminical Councils, in union with the the pope. This would be the extraordinary way. The ordinary way, is holding fast the living Traditions whether by word=oral or epistle=scripture, as St Paul tells us. Traditions whether by word or epistle cannot contradict one another.

But where exactly is your foundation of Biblical Truth, if not the Bible?

JL: What did those early believers do when they received God’s Word. [ACTS 2:41 they that RECEIVED HIS WORD WERE BAPTIZED 42 THEY CONTINUED STEDFASTLY in the APOSTLES **DOCTRINE FELLOWSHIP in **BREAKING BREAD and in PRAYERS. 1Cor 1:9 God is faithful you were called into THE FELLOWSHIP OF **his Son JESUS CHRIST. 10 I appeal to you BRETHREN by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ that all of you AGREE that there be no dissensions among you that you **BE UNITED **in the same mind and the same judgment.] One fellowship no matter where it is located in the world. [Lk 24:48 you are witnesses of these things 49 I SEND the promise of my Father upon you WAIT in Jerusalem TILL YOU ARE ENDUED WITH POWER FROM ON HIGH. Jn 16:13 When THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH comes **HE WILL GUIDE YOU into ALL the TRUTH Jn 14:26 the Holy Spirit HE SHALL TEACH YOU ALL things and BRING ALL things TO YOUR REMEMBRANCE WHATEVER I HAVE SAID TO YOU.] Christ is speaking to the Apostolic Fellowship, who will be endued with power from on high, by whom the Church the pillar and ground of TRUTH, will be guided into all truth and teach all things whatsoever Christ said, through successors, by laying on of hands, till the end of the world. Even Paul knew is teaching could not disagree with the Church.

What did Paul do? Gal2:1 Then fourteen years after I WENT UP AGAIN TO JERUSALEM with Barnabas, and took Titus with me also. 2 And I went up BY REVELATION, and COMMUNICATED UNTO THEM that GOSPEL which I PREACH among the Gentiles, but privately to them which were of reputation, LEST BY ANY MEANS I SHOULD run, OR HAD RUN, IN VAIN. [Paul verified his teaching with the teaching authority SENT by Christ to teach ALL NATIONS till the end of the age, Mt28. If individual Christians had the ability to be led into ALL truth, because they have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, we would all be one without the lest disagreement. We can see that is not the case.

If you notice, I said “The only thing that Protestants (or any other Christian believers) should hate is when denominational doctrine contradicts Scripture.” It is literally stated in the Bible (see Rev22:18 below, and I stand by this literal proclamation. Mormons have their additions to the Bible, does that mean they are right also?

JL: If none contradict scripture, why are there so many faith groups?

 

[DavidCatechumen]

It looks like my premise that non-Catholic Christians misunderstand Catholicism as unbiblical is holding up well, given the comments from Nancy and Josie.

To reiterate: Everything the Catholic Church teaches is Biblical–every teaching of the Church is either explicitly or implicitly taught in Scripture!

Does anyone have a list of things the Catholic Church actually teaches that they contend as contradicting the Bible? If not let’s get back on topic…

 

[nancy_dalrymple]

It looks like my premise that non-Catholic Christians misunderstand Catholicism as unbiblical is holding up well, given the comments from Nancy and Josie.

To reiterate: Everything the Catholic Church teaches is Biblical–every teaching of the Church is either explicitly or implicitly taught in Scripture!

Does anyone have a list of things the Catholic Church actually teaches that they contend as contradicting the Bible? If not let’s get back on topic…

Hi David,I was just wondering why you said,i made a coment that to you was unbiblical? Was it I couldnt understand baby Baptism? I see Baby Baptism as a dedication to raise your child Catholic but not as an exceptance of the faith as a baby cannot decide for them selfs.But when they are a little older? actually it will not get you to heaven and there is realy nothing so wrong as to fight about it as a child grows he can decide,maybe that’s why the seperation of the church happened people felt Jesus was older and was not Baptised young. All back then were of age of understanding,were they not? To tell you the truth when my Grandson was dying my daughter asked me to Baptise him,so i did he died a few days later.I was a Baptist then,so go figure. And please dont tell me he didnt go to heaven as i was so recked about his death and then my daughters so please spare me if possible Thank You Love of Christ I do the best i can Nancy

 

[JosieElaine]

grannymh;4948500:

Would someone please help JosieElaine and granny

?

I’m not sure how to explain what I do. I preview my post and if the quotes don’t look right, I play around with the icon on top which looks like the voice “box” in a cartoon. It is to the immediate left of the hash or number mark # Putting the pointer on it will say "Wrap

tags around selected text."

I start highlighting the text, click the Wrap thing at the top and bottom of the highlighted material and test it all in Preview Post which is a box at bottom of screen. If I pick up the wrong text or the text from a previous post then I start deleting the Hay the problem with you people is that you dont know when to be nice to someone or help them I went through this same **** when I came here,how about a little LOVE,and Help! Thank You Nancy

From JosieElaine
Sweetheart , the solution to the problem is worse than the initial problem !

 

[nancy_dalrymple]

:sad_yes:

nancy dalrymple;4948594:

grannymh;4948500:

Would someone please help JosieElaine and granny

?

I’m not sure how to explain what I do. I preview my post and if the quotes don’t look right, I play around with the icon on top which looks like the voice “box” in a cartoon. It is to the immediate left of the hash or number mark # Putting the pointer on it will say "Wrap

From JosieElaine
Sweetheart , the solution to the problem is worse than the initial problem ! Well you know when your new it’s hard to find your way around sorry if I as abrupt,so are you going to give her some help or not? :shrug:Nancy Thank You

 

[DavidCatechumen]

And please dont tell me he didnt go to heaven as i was so recked about his death and then my daughters so please spare me if possible Thank You Love of Christ I do the best i can Nancy

The Catholic Church teaches that ANYONE can baptize in an emergency. [CCC 1256] No need to be a priest or even be Catholic! So your Baptism of your grandson was valid.

And what did that Baptism do for your grandson?

Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? v4 Therefore we have been buried with him by baptism into death, so that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, so we too might walk in newness of life.

v5 For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we will certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his. v6 We know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body of sin might be destroyed, and we might no longer be enslaved to sin. v7 For whoever has died is freed from sin. v8 But if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him.

Edit: This is Romans 5:3-8. The word of the Lord.

The Catholic Church also teaches that upon passing from this world, one immediately passes into the presence of God. Only God can judge a soul–not me, and certainly no church, even the Catholic Church can do that–but I believe that your grandson passed directly into the arms of Our Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[jake23]

“the word of God is too rich in literature to take literally upon.”

2 Timothy 3:16 (New International Version)
16**All Scripture is God-breathed **and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,

All Scripture comes from God, but we are not to take it literally?

John 1
The Word Became Flesh
1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning.

Jesus is the logos (word) of God. Are we not to take Him or His testimony from others literally?

Your generalization of protestants is simply untrue. The only thing that Protestants (or any other Christian believers) should hate is when denominational doctrine contradicts Scripture. (e.g. not taking the Bible literally.) This is not specific to catholics, but to every Christian denomination.

As a past protestant I can tell you that protestant religion teaches so much hate that they think there protestant realtives of another church down the street is going to hell! I have gone to almost all protestant practices and they validate this. I went to Liberty Universtiy to becom a pastor and discovered in my REAL education that the protestant interpretation of the Bible was horrible way off and though I did not loke it at all at the time, the catholic church showed to be christ tru church from historical and biblical teaching! And on a personal not I was so busey thinking about poeple who where going to hell supposedly and now in the catholic church I am filled with love from Christ for others instead of evil judgement! So yes the protestants do not like catholics and truth be they dont like anybody within there little congregation and since there over a billion catholics and only a million or so in your congregation so if you think about it they hate allot of poeple and think they are all going to hell even though they really have no idea what the scripture is saying!

Hey Maranatha stay this summer! Now do I mean stay cool in behavior or stay cool in temperature? getting a clue yet?

 

[jake23]

forgive my spelling, I am typing on a small blackberry!

 

[KestrelRose]

I’m a Protestant (Wesleyen-Arminian/Pentecostal-Holiness background), and I don’t hate Catholics. I disagree strongly with some of the beliefs of Catholicism though. I also do the same with Lutherenism, Calvinism, and several other of my brothers and sisters in Christ. Just because you disagree or even hate a person’s theological beliefs doesn’t mean you hate the person who practice it. I hate Oneness Pentecostalism (because it’s a corruption of my own theology), but I don’t hate Jesus-Only folk.

I am a devout Catholic. I want you to know that I have never been attacked or hated by any Protestant. I can also disagree with another person’s beliefs without any hint of dislike much less hatred. I certainly do not hate even the beliefs of another person unless it is a truly hateful belief. I have great respect for Wesley, Calvin and other leaders of the Protestant history. I don’t agree, but I don’t hate any part of it.

I am not very pleased with the approach of this thread.

 

[JosieElaine]

From JosieElaine :

I was a Catholic for 20 and not a single Protestant ever bothered me .

I was nothing (no religion) for 45 years and no Catholic or Protestant ever bothered me .

I have been a Baptist for 1 year and I had never heard from either of these two groups any word of hate until last week when I happened upon this forum .

Are you sure this is hate or maybe it is only disagreement ?

In real life , does a real Protestant hate a real Catholic ?

Or vice-versa ?

JosieElaine

 

[SteveGC]

I do not understand what you mean by your P.S . If I did something wrong , I apologize . It was unintentional . Maybe there is something I do not understand about the formatting of my answers …
We are back to the same issue . I do not believe there are such people are biblical successors to the Apostles …Back to the Bible again !
A year ago today , God snatched me from the kingdom of Darkness into which I was born and had been living for 65 years . He transported me into His kingdom of Light . Between the two kingdoms is a chasm . I cannot go back . I can sin , yes , but I was already forgiven forever at Calvary by the once-and-for all times Death of my Saviour . When I call on His Blood , I am kept forever His . His Spirit speaks to my spirit and tells me so , through the reading and meditating on his Word . So there is no common ground on which we can discuss . We get back to the same issue always : Word of God or Word of God plus words of the church .
May the Lord bless you again .
JosieElaine

No worries about the formatting thing. One simple trick to follow while you’re still learning how it works…If you “quote” someone for your reply, make sure you don’t write anything in between the two [QU0TE] boxes. Type in everything after the final box that looks like this: [/QU0TE]. That’ll keep you square.

Yes, seems we have no common ground we can discuss. I’m curious though. You decided to quote my text, which was not directed at you, and then proclaimed “I don’t want to talk about this anymore”. As if I somehow was pushing the issue with you. I’m also curious what brings you to a website dedicated to “answers” about the Catholic faith, if you’ve already decided that we are wrong. Do you need more proof we’re wrong?

If I can be frank, being so rigid on your certitude that you’re living your faith precisely the way Christ intended you to, clinging only to your Bible as your safeguard, is quite an anchor to your development as a Christian. Don’t get me wrong, I have no doubt you are a wonderful person, would do anything for anyone, and truly love the Lord with all your heart. And the Bible is absolutely Sacred and Holy. But only someone who feels there is no more to really learn about Christ’s full teachings proclaims unfounded and unresearched absolutes about the falsehood of anyone else’s views.

Further, the Bible you cling to is made available to you by humans. Yes the words and messages within it are all God’s, but the canonization and book format provided to all the world came to you by the early Church. You may know this, but you seem to immediately dismiss any importance of determining precisely what this Church was. I would think anyone so closely tied to their Bible as their sole authority on earth would really want to know the exact truth of where it came from. Do you happen to know where?

And lastly (sorry to carry on)…the fact that you don’t believe in apostolic succession doesn’t change the fact that you (like all of us) place all of your trust in humans for your understanding and learning regarding the Christian faith. Yes, we all place our trust and hope ultimately in Jesus, but to learn about Jesus’ precise messages, we all trust the humans in our lives…not the Bible. The Bible in fact is an inspired supplement to our reception of human teaching. You may think the Bible has taught you everything you ever need to know, but it hasn’t. It has only complimented what you’ve heard from others. The Bible contains the fundamentals we need to know regarding salvation, but to accurately extract the contents requires human teaching…and Christ didn’t allow just anybody to do this. He appointed people, and those people have done likewise throughout the ages. The point I make is, one has to really ask oneself…are the individuals in their lives who have taught them the Christian faith really trustworthy with the authentic message from Christ? And why are they? Or why are they not?

God Bless

 

[JosieElaine]

I happened on this Forum more or less by accident . It was interesting at first but now I would like to disconnect myself from it and I do not know how . Also , when someone sends me a message first , I am curious about what it says . Human nature !

Another reason is because my very Catholic son-in-law keeps telling me that the Catholic church has changed so much since I left it in 1963 . I was curious to know if this was really a fact . I keep telling him that the Catholic church I knew could not turn its back on any of its foundational teachings . He disagrees with me . So there , I was just checking !

 

[nancy_dalrymple]

The Catholic Church teaches that ANYONE can baptize in an emergency. [CCC 1256] No need to be a priest or even be Catholic! So your Baptism of your grandson was valid.

And what did that Baptism do for your grandson?

Edit: This is Romans 5:3-8. The word of the Lord.

The Catholic Church also teaches that upon passing from this world, one immediately passes into the presence of God. Only God can judge a soul–not me, and certainly no church, even the Catholic Church can do that–but I believe that your grandson passed directly into the arms of Our Lord Jesus Christ.

Boy that came as a shock,i am realy pleased to know that,at least i did something right in my life.Where is it in the bible we are judged right after we die? And if so what about the resurection? Someone said Christ comes back 3 times,in my other thread,so in other words hell already exists? And judjement has already started? Then why purgatory? You either make it or you dont? Please enlighten me Nancy Thank You

 

[SteveGC]

I happened on this Forum more or less by accident . It was interesting at first but now I would like to disconnect myself from it and I do not know how . Also , when someone sends me a message first , I am curious about what it says . Human nature !

Another reason is because my very Catholic son-in-law keeps telling me that the Catholic church has changed so much since I left it in 1963 . I was curious to know if this was really a fact . I keep telling him that the Catholic church I knew could not turn its back on any of its foundational teachings . He disagrees with me . So there , I was just checking !

Fair enough, Josie. But I didn’t send you any message. My post was not directed at any one person. Perhaps you were referring to someone else?

Anyway, peace be with you on your journey.

 

[DavidCatechumen]

Boy that came as a shock,i am realy pleased to know that,at least i did something right in my life.Where is it in the bible we are judged right after we die? And if so what about the resurection? Someone said Christ comes back 3 times,in my other thread,so in other words hell already exists? And judjement has already started? Then why purgatory? You either make it or you dont? Please enlighten me Nancy Thank You

Nancy,

I was about to give up on this topic (it’s getting too judgmental) but I’m glad I could help you.

To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. 2 Cor. 5:8. See also Ecclesiastes 11:9 and 12:1, Hebrews 9:27, Luke 23:43, etc. So the Church’s teaching is that each soul receives a particular judgment upon departing from the body. Jesus, the only Judge, either embraces one or casts one away. However, after He hugs you, He may tell you you aren’t quite ready for Heaven just yet, as I’ll explain.

Purgatory exists because “nothing unclean shall enter [heaven,]” Rev. 21:27, and because those whom God loves but whose works have been “burned up” will “be saved, but only as through fire.” 1 Cor. 3:15. So those of us who have merited Heaven because of the grace of Christ, but still have some attachments to worldly things, have to take a bath in Purgatory before we can formally go to Heaven.

We know Purgatory exists because Jesus preached to the dead who were imprisoned there during the three days that He himself was dead (1 Pet. 3:18-20 and 1 Peter 4:6), and because Jesus told us Himself that there was an age to come in which there is still sin (that can’t be Heaven, which contains nothing unclean). Mt 12:32. Purgatory is not a second chance for those who rejected Christ in life. It is always temporary–anyone who is being cleansed in Purgatory is destined for Heaven.

My opinion, not that of the Church: I don’t think Purgatory is an actual place, but rather a state of existence. What exactly happens “there” probably depends on the worldly attachments of the person. So, for example, ghosts might be souls in purgation who are trying to let go of something in the world.

(Note that I completely ignored 2 Maccabees because non-Catholic/non-Orthodox Christians don’t accept it as Scripture since Luther threw it out.)

Now, we will not remain as disembodied souls forever. As the book of Revelation explains, God will eventually decide to end the world and establish a new Jerusalem in a new Earth. At that time we will receive glorified resurrection bodies, probably like Jesus transfigured himself. This is the “resurrection of the body” we profess our faith in at Mass. I am not too familiar with this particular area of the Church’s teaching so I leave it to someone else to provide the Scripture and Catechism cites.

 

[nancy_dalrymple]

Nancy,

I was about to give up on this topic (it’s getting too judgmental) but I’m glad I could help you.

To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. 2 Cor. 5:8. See also Ecclesiastes 11:9 and 12:1, Hebrews 9:27, Luke 23:43, etc. So the Church’s teaching is that each soul receives a particular judgment upon departing from the body. Jesus, the only Judge, either embraces one or casts one away. However, after He hugs you, He may tell you you aren’t quite ready for Heaven just yet, as I’ll explain.

Purgatory exists because “nothing unclean shall enter [heaven,]” Rev. 21:27, and because those whom God loves but whose works have been “burned up” will “be saved, but only as through fire.” 1 Cor. 3:15. So those of us who have merited Heaven because of the grace of Christ, but still have some attachments to worldly things, have to take a bath in Purgatory before we can formally go to Heaven.

We know Purgatory exists because Jesus preached to the dead who were imprisoned there during the three days that He himself was dead (1 Pet. 3:18-20 and 1 Peter 4:6), and because Jesus told us Himself that there was an age to come in which there is still sin (that can’t be Heaven, which contains nothing unclean). Mt 12:32. Purgatory is not a second chance for those who rejected Christ in life. It is always temporary–anyone who is being cleansed in Purgatory is destined for Heaven.

My opinion, not that of the Church: I don’t think Purgatory is an actual place, but rather a state of existence. What exactly happens “there” probably depends on the worldly attachments of the person. So, for example, ghosts might be souls in purgation who are trying to let go of something in the world.

(Note that I completely ignored 2 Maccabees because non-Catholic/non-Orthodox Christians don’t accept it as Scripture since Luther threw it out.)

Now, we will not remain as disembodied souls forever. As the book of Revelation explains, God will eventually decide to end the world and establish a new Jerusalem in a new Earth. At that time we will receive glorified resurrection bodies, probably like Jesus transfigured himself. This is the “resurrection of the body” we profess our faith in at Mass. I am not too familiar with this particular area of the Church’s teaching so I leave it to someone else to provide the Scripture and Catechism cites.

Excuse me but didn’t Jesus free the souls there and every believer? I know there is a heaven and hell but I dont know why God would be luke warm and have an inbetween,after he freed those waiting already for so long You know what I mean? Read it again Love of Christ Nancy

 

[nancy_dalrymple]

Also you whome it may concern Jesus died on the cross for our sins and to cleanse us from all unrightousness how can we deny that by saying purgatory cleanses us from are sins? Dosent that rob God?Were Baptised,washed by water into the death of Christ were cleansed by his royal blood he shed and I still dont get purgatory.Why would he free us and those trapped there for us to go back there? That takes away from his death and all he done for us dosent it? love of Christ Nancy

 

[DavidCatechumen]

Excuse me but didn’t Jesus free the souls there and every believer?

Yes. But that was in A.D. 34, on the original Easter Sunday. Purgatory did not cease to exist at the time that the Old Testament Saints were taken up to Heaven, otherwise it would not be described in 1 Corinthians 3:15, which was written long after Jesus ascended into Heaven. Jesus still does return to minister those who are in Purgatory today, just as He did during His time in the tomb. That is why we pray for the holy souls in Purgatory and ask for Jesus to help them into Heaven.

I know there is a heaven and hell but I dont know why God would be luke warm and have an inbetween,after he freed those waiting already for so long You know what I mean?

Purgatory is not there because God is luke-warm, but because WE are often luke-warm about our love for God!

Also you whome it may concern Jesus died on the cross for our sins and to cleanse us from all unrightousness how can we deny that by saying purgatory cleanses us from are sins?

Because we are still sinners. Jesus’ one sacrifice is sufficient atonement for our sins, therefore, He has the power to set us free. However, Jesus also calls us to pick up our cross and follow Him and to love Him and not the world. Purgatory is not about Jesus not being powerful enough to save us, it is about US not letting go of the world and letting Him into our lives.

So this is going back to the whole “Once Saved, Always Saved” thing which you already stated that you do NOT believe in, and rightly so. We have free will, we can reject God, we can sin and we have to be reconciled to Him when that occurs. **Edit: ** Purgatory is what happens when we are not fully reconciled to Christ at our death. (As I think you understand, Purgatory is completely different than hell, which is what happens when someone freely and voluntarily throws Jesus out of their heart…)

Dosent that rob God?Were Baptised,washed by water into the death of Christ were cleansed by his royal blood he shed and I still dont get purgatory.Why would he free us and those trapped there for us to go back there? That takes away from his death and all he done for us dosent it? love of Christ Nancy

He unlocked the shackles around us, but He will not remove them for us because He created us in His image with free will, and He will never violate our free will. We are always free to choose the world over Him, sad as that may be.