Do we as Catholics worship Mary

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myredeemerlives said:
Ok let me get this straight… because Mary gave birth to Jesus that means to we have to also go through Mary so that we can get to Jesus?

Do we exit through her uterus too?

The bible teaches that we are to go to Jesus DIRECTLY to get to the Father. Nowhere does the bible teach to go through Mary to get to Jesus to get to the Father.

If you can show me a very, very clear scripture stating that fact then I will bow my knee to Mary. Until that I will bow to Jesus.
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Again no one is saying that to you. What we are saying is we go to Mary to pray for us. Just like in Job God listens to the prayers of the good, we know he will listen to Marys prayers. Jesus left Mary to us. At the foot of the cross behold your Mother. She is also our Mother and she loves us all. And if you ask her to pray for you when you are in trouble she will. And Jesus Loves his Mother he is very close to her. Jesus also tells us to pray for eachother. Do you ever ask anyone to pray for you, Do you believe if they pray for you that God is listening? Same thing, she has found favor with God we know she is Blessed and will pray for us. No one has every said Mary has more power than God nor ever will. But people dont want to listen they want to argue and twist words around, why i have no idea.
 
allhers said:
Well if it was good enough for God that Jesus would come to us through Mary, then I don’t think that there is anything wrong with us going to Jesus through her. There is nothing wrong either with going directly to Jesus to get to the Father, as a matter of fact, all the prayers of the Mass are directed to God the Father, through Jesus and in the Holy Spirit. In Him, with Him and through Him.

We believe that Jesus is our only mediator but we have a lot of intercessors, His Blessed Mother is the best one of them, in my humble opinion.

We, just like Jesus, and just like the early Church still pray with His Mother.

We only genuflect to Jesus however, so, there would be no need to ever genuflect to His Mother, you could however, kneel in prayer, nothing wrong with anyone kneeling when they pray.
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GUess we’re all gonna get crucified too, after all, using your logic…if it was good enough for Jesus…
 
Originally Posted by thecoach forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif
I have answered your questions.
rinnie said:
No really you havent can you answer them again then, Because i must have missed it.
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yeah, he pulled that one on me too… I can only figure that the good Rev has no belief that he can answer… just a continuing misuse and abuse of selective Scripture verses.

As I have often declared…

To use the Scripture against the very Church from which it came, is not to use… but to abuse.
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Unfortunately, he has also left my questions of him unanswered, seems to be a pattern with him.
 
Yes i am seeing that too, How is it that someone that has all the answers cant answer such a simple question from me.
 
rinnie said:
Again no one is saying that to you. What we are saying is we go to Mary to pray for us. Just like in Job God listens to the prayers of the good, we know he will listen to Marys prayers. Jesus left Mary to us. At the foot of the cross behold your Mother. She is also our Mother and she loves us all. And if you ask her to pray for you when you are in trouble she will. And Jesus Loves his Mother he is very close to her. Jesus also tells us to pray for eachother. Do you ever ask anyone to pray for you, Do you believe if they pray for you that God is listening? Same thing, she has found favor with God we know she is Blessed and will pray for us. No one has every said Mary has more power than God nor ever will. But people dont want to listen they want to argue and twist words around, why i have no idea.
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Jesus left Mary to you? Jesus left the holy spirit! Not Mary. Where does Jesus say he left us Mary?

John 16:7, 8, “Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away; for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send Him unto you. And when He is come, He will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment.”

Also, take a look into the historical Catholic church teachings…
  1. If in all this series of Mysteries, Venerable Brethren, are developed the counsels of God in regard to us – “counsels of wisdom and of tenderness” (St. Bernard) – not less apparent is the greatness of the benefits **for which we are debtors to the Virgin Mother. **No man can meditate upon these without feeling a new awakening in his heart of confidence that he will certainly obtain through Mary the fullness of the mercies of God. And to this end vocal prayer chimes well with the Mysteries. First, as is meet and right, comes the Lord’s Prayer, addressed to Our Father in Heaven: and having, with the elect petitions dictated by Our Divine Master, called upon the Father, from the throne of His Majesty we turn our prayerful voices to Mary. Thus is confirmed that law of merciful meditation of which We have spoken, and which St. Bernardine of Siena thus expresses: "Every grace granted to man has three degrees in order; for by God it is communicated to Christ, from Christ it passes to the Virgin, and from the Virgin it descends to us."
    Source: **http://www.aloha.net/~mikesch/star.gif IUCUNDA SEMPER EXPECTATIONE (On the Rosary), **Encyclical of Pope Leo XIII promulgated on September 8, 1894.
The bible does not teach that God’s mercy comes from Mary to Jesus. See if you can find one piece of scripture that supports that statement.
 
myredeemerlives said:
Jesus left Mary to you? Jesus left the holy spirit! Not Mary. Where does Jesus say he left us Mary?
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" …all gererations shall call me blessed…"

No one else in Scripture has that high a “recommendation” or pronouncement.

My generation calls her blessed… how about yours?

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MrS said:
" …all gererations shall call me blessed…"

No one else in Scripture has that high a “recommendation” or pronouncement.

My generation calls her blessed… how about yours?

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Amen, you beat me to the punch, Thanks.
 
MrS said:
" …all gererations shall call me blessed…"

No one else in Scripture has that high a “recommendation” or pronouncement.

My generation calls her blessed… how about yours?

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Are we not all blessed in Christ?
 
You’ll notice that the verse I gave you says right after that, in verse 27 Then he said to the diciple, “Behold, your mother.” And from that hour the diciple took her into his home. (we do too.)
Then, in verse 28 AFter this, aware that everything was now finished, …
Now you must admit that if Jesus words are for everyone, that they are meant for us too.
 
MrS said:
" …all gererations shall call me blessed…"

No one else in Scripture has that high a “recommendation” or pronouncement.

My generation calls her blessed… how about yours?

.
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No one denies the blessed status of Mary. You can play the game of either Mary is a co-redeemer to be quasi-worshiped (venerated) or else we’re disrespecting her, but I’m not biting.

I’m always glad to discuss the proper role of Mary from a Scriptural standpoint. I’m always glad to concede a point if shown to be in error (since my eternal salvation is worth more than my pride). However, I see little in the way of a scriptural argument.

Yes I concede Mary is blessed among women. However, I do not agree that she is a co-redeemer, mediatrix, or a queen of heaven. Why should I think she is when all the exegesis from Catholic theologians seems so flawed?

Here’s an example. Take the use of Ezekiel 44:2 to evidence the doctrine of perpetual virginity. The verse is one about redemption. When we read it in tandem with related verses, such as Ezekiel 46:8-9 it becomes clear that this verse was foretelling the coming of Christ. Yes the door of the temple where annual atonement rituals were done would be shut when Christ, our high priest, enters it. This is because no longer would there be annual atonement rituals, rather one sacrifice for all sin.

I can go on and on pointing to the erroneous typologies drawn by RCC theologians; and I have in this thread. I’ve heard nothing that truly rebuts my exegesis (I was hoping I might hear from an educated Catholic who has a solid foundation in the Bible, but all I’ve heard so far is recanting of the church Catechism)?

I respectfully disagree with your views of Marian theology & regardless of what you may think, I hold Mary in the highest regard, blessed among women. I’m open to hearing good exegesis taken from Scripture that illustrates what the proper role of Mary should be?
 
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