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rinnie
Guest
Okay how abou you sola-scripta Since coach wont answer me do you believe in Canon of scripture?
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T
thecoach
Guest
No you asked me if I believe in the Trinity, I answered yes. It is referred to in what the word means at the end of Matthew. Dont want to use the word Trinity, then dont, but three Persons are referred to. I believe in the OT Jewish canon and the NT canon. Did you know the Ethiopian Bible has two other OT books in it? You want the other 7 books of the OT, have them. I Have, they have value.
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rinnie
Guest
What about the canon of scripture?
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allhers
Guest
Actually, I believe the first time the Trinity was referred to in the New Testament was when Jesus was Baptized, wasn’t it?
God spoke, and the Holy Spirit decended upon Jesus…this is My Beloved Son, listen to Him…
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thecoach
Guest
Actually, you could say that, yes. Good! Check this post, it left ME speechless
forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=3959440&postcount=1
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rinnie
Guest
Just a simple yes or no would do!
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allhers
Guest
So that we all may be one, amen, that is what Jesus and the Blessed Mother pray for too, and I join them in their prayers for our unity.
That is what I find so awesome about the people from differing denominations when they join the Catholic Church, people like Scott Hahn, Tim Staples, and so many others…they are just so inspiring to listen to and read about, their conversion stories are so awesome, have you ever watched The Journey Home with Marcus Grodi?
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MrS
Guest
not in Scripture, unless somewhere it says
“…and the coach can call himself Rev, for he is saved with no proof of authority… and he need not answer any questions directly…”
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sola_scriptura
Guest
Overall, I do not view deuterocanon or apocrypha as canon. All the books of the Tanakh (Jewish Bible) and New Testament are canon.
For example, the book of Judith is not in my Bible. I’m evangelical & not associated with the more “mainstream” denominations, like the Episcopalians or Lutherans. I find harmony with those first Christians who broke bread with each other in their homes and simple obscure chapels before Rome or Greece came to dominate Christianity. I do have a great appreciation for later saints like Martin Luther but do not count myself as a Lutheran because of their focus on sacramentalism and their own Marian theology (which is close to the RCC rendition).
That being said, I have an appreciation for some of the early Catholic fathers, but do not view their writings as in anyway divinely inspired. Irenaeus was right about some things, wrong about others, as was Augustine, as was Aquinas. Great men, great thinkers, but they were just that … men & as such fallible. This isn’t denied by the RCC. One only need look at the theological disagreements between the Jesuits (Molinists) and Benedictines (Augustinians, which we would call Calvinists).
The only thing that is infallible is the right word of God. His church is the body of Christ, which is a collection of all the faithful in Christ. A denomination serves its flock, not the other way around. The right authority to preach flows up from the congregation not down from any institution. Men are anointed to preach with the assent of the congregation, and when they deviate from Scripture should be sanctioned or defrocked by that same body. This is how I view church validity and succession from the Apostolic teachings.
That is my view in full.
Blessings
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sola_scriptura
Guest
Funny, we have many more Catholics joining us than the other way around? Not trying to incite any hostility … we ought to be able to discuss these important issues with civility and a right temperment.So that we all may be one, amen, that is what Jesus and the Blessed Mother pray for too, and I join them in their prayers for our unity.
That is what I find so awesome about the people from differing denominations when they join the Catholic Church, people like Scott Hahn, Tim Staples, and so many others…they are just so inspiring to listen to and read about, their conversion stories are so awesome, have you ever watched The Journey Home with Marcus Grodi?
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MrS
Guest
And blessing to you for a direct and consise answer that comes from you.
As you have probably seen here already, that is not an attribute of the rev/coach.
May he follow your lead and quit acting like he never had any, ANY, training to be a REV… much less any authority.
oopps… mybad… he said he answered all those questions already… must have been in invisible ink.
But, seriously, thank you for stepping up to the plate and being honest with yourself… and thus with us…
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MrS
Guest
Well, it is not really funny…just proof that we have a whole generation of poorly catechised Catholics.
I promise you that those who leave Catholicism will have a variety of answers as to why. But every one of their objections can be given a reasonable answer from Scripture… perhaps except the “…I was bored…” objection
Sola Deo Gratias
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rinnie
Guest
Here is my point you said you believe in Scripture of Canon, now every scripture was written, copied translated handed down and preserved and canonized by the Catholic Church. You said you believe that God is one in three persons. But none of these things are expessly stated in Scripture. The teachings came down from Apostles through the Catholic Church. The church was born on Pentecost Sunday, not a word of the NT was written until ten years later. In John the last words are it is impossible to write everything down. Now here is my question, how can you not trust the Church to teach the word of God when the Catholic Church is the only Church to have the Tradiion, Oral and written teachings. How can you doubt the teachings, and then turn around and believe the bible then. Let me tell you what St Paul says That the Church not the bible is the pinnacle and foundation of the truth. How can you claim that the Church does not have the fullness of the truth and you do. Why is it the only church that has all of this is the Catholic Church. So NOT ALL IS WRITTEN. When the Pope explains to us about the Blessed Mother who would know better than him. We believe in the Church we trust what St Paul told us. How can you not believe it either? When it is the Catholic Church the Church still ran today by the Pope that has the fullness of the truth.
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rinnie
Guest
But you must remember SS we have never said that the Pope is perfect we just said when it comes to the word of God and scripture he is infallible. How do we know this, because this is what he said to his Apostles What my Father has given me I have given you. I will give you the words. And we can prove from Peter to the Pope today how that gift of the Holy Spirit has been handed down. And that is how Jesus gave them that Power before he left, now how could he give them that power and them not be able to hand it down also. They had the same power that the Father gave Jesus. And it is still going on today. And Jesus promised his Church will stand until he comes again.
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allhers
Guest
Speaking of funny, we don’t view Martin Luther as a Saint, and yet you do, and we do believe that all the early Church Fathers are, and yet you don’t seem to know that.
We believe that the Authority comes from God, not a congregation, and if someone deviates from Scripture, we set them straight. With lots of prayer.
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allhers
Guest
…and that the gates of hell will not prevail against His Church. I believe one of the Popes ages ago said to someone who was telling him that the Catholic Church would be wiped off the face of the earth before long, …he replied, “We can’t even do that.”
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Des
Guest
Catholics who knew zippo about their faith join you while we have protestants who know their Bibles inside out joining us. Huge difference SS. One is easily lead astray because of lack of knowlege, while the other is lead by understanding the lack of logic of sola scripture.
Thank you for pointing that out, I was sitting here trying to figure out how to word that.
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sola_scriptura
Guest
Well it’s funny you mention this. Even in the Catholic communion there’s disagreement (albeit slight) in Marian theology. So true uniformity doesn’t even exist within Catholicism (more broadly speaking) with regard to the role of our blessed mother.
It is written that we have only one God & He is a jealous God. We only have one mediator between God and ourselves, Jesus.
Now I know you will say that saints and Mary advocate on our behalf before the only one who can advocate before God, Jesus. So (forgive me if I’m using this term loosely) we have “secondary mediators” (and the RCC is careful not to juxtapose the role of the saints or Mary with that of Christ).
The earliest Christians didn’t venerate Mary. In fact Mariology didn’t even begin to develop until nearly 200 years after the death of Christ, first by Irenaeus. It wasn’t until the fifth century that Mariology began to find its way into church dogma; and it wasn’t until 1950 that the assumption of Mary was adopted into church doctrine.
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