Do you fear Death?

[Bob_Crowley]

To me death and judgement are tied together. I had the peculiar experience of my father turning up in my room the night he died, as I’ve said ad infinitum on these forums. He started with an apology for a lifetime of cruelty, we talked and argued and at the end he gave this almighty scream and then just disappeared. That was 36 years ago today to the day (11 January 1979), and I still remember it, and especially the terrifying scream at the very end. It sure wasn’t a dream.

It was obvious he was being judged, and it was also obvious that at the very end something awful was coming for him. He was terrified to the core.

Now I’m not particularly looking forward to physical death, particularly if there’s going to be considerable pain involved. But I think I’d become resigned to it.

And I’m not looking to the judgement either. I think it’s fairly tough. So if someone says they’re not afraid of death, I assume they’re confident of getting through the inevitable judgement that will accompany it, with one hundred percent certainty.

 

[truetofaith]

From your friendly grammar police: you mean comma. When I read “the colon does the job,” I thought of something else.

Me too! Medically speaking.

 

[drifter106]

Last Aug I was diagnosed with cancer. The initial diagnosis wasn’t very good…large tumor 5 x 4x 5 in my torso. Anyway, the initial shock made me think back when I was younger and remember thinking what it would be like when my parents die. My parents have since died and their death experience for me was nothing like I thought it would be. Same thing can be said about thinking about dieing and actually knowing that you, because of your situation, will die…completely different.

During this time I totally had this “pleasant feeling” come over me. Wasn’t mad, sad or trying to blame anyone or thing. The 2 things that were on my mind, and what I focused on, was getting things in order for my wife and getting my things in order with Jesus (I can say the Divine Mercy prayer forwards, backwards and upside down)…lol

Pray a lot, think about Jesus a lot…sometimes the thought of death is scary (the unknown) but I always go back to the “Jesus I trust in you”. All through this period I honestly feel like I have so many things to be thankful for…especially the faith in knowing that Christ will be there for me.

My cancer…it was first diagnosed as sarcoma but after a biopsy it was changed… to lymphoma. Currently taking chemo and the tumor is shrinking.

HAVE FAITH IN THE LORD…

 

[phil_at_dayboro]

Last Aug I was diagnosed with cancer. The initial diagnosis wasn’t very good…large tumor 5 x 4x 5 in my torso. Anyway, the initial shock made me think back when I was younger and remember thinking what it would be like when my parents die. My parents have since died and their death experience for me was nothing like I thought it would be. Same thing can be said about thinking about dieing and actually knowing that you, because of your situation, will die…completely different.

During this time I totally had this “pleasant feeling” come over me. Wasn’t mad, sad or trying to blame anyone or thing. The 2 things that were on my mind, and what I focused on, was getting things in order for my wife and getting my things in order with Jesus (I can say the Divine Mercy prayer forwards, backwards and upside down)…lol

Pray a lot, think about Jesus a lot…sometimes the thought of death is scary (the unknown) but I always go back to the “Jesus I trust in you”. All through this period I honestly feel like I have so many things to be thankful for…especially the faith in knowing that Christ will be there for me.

My cancer…it was first diagnosed as sarcoma but after a biopsy it was changed… to lymphoma. Currently taking chemo and the tumor is shrinking.

HAVE FAITH IN THE LORD…

this is exactly what I would hope my response would be.
Thanks for shareing

 

[Bahman]

Last Aug I was diagnosed with cancer. The initial diagnosis wasn’t very good…large tumor 5 x 4x 5 in my torso. Anyway, the initial shock made me think back when I was younger and remember thinking what it would be like when my parents die. My parents have since died and their death experience for me was nothing like I thought it would be. Same thing can be said about thinking about dieing and actually knowing that you, because of your situation, will die…completely different.

During this time I totally had this “pleasant feeling” come over me. Wasn’t mad, sad or trying to blame anyone or thing. The 2 things that were on my mind, and what I focused on, was getting things in order for my wife and getting my things in order with Jesus (I can say the Divine Mercy prayer forwards, backwards and upside down)…lol

Pray a lot, think about Jesus a lot…sometimes the thought of death is scary (the unknown) but I always go back to the “Jesus I trust in you”. All through this period I honestly feel like I have so many things to be thankful for…especially the faith in knowing that Christ will be there for me.

My cancer…it was first diagnosed as sarcoma but after a biopsy it was changed… to lymphoma. Currently taking chemo and the tumor is shrinking.

HAVE FAITH IN THE LORD…

Have faith in your chemo!

 

[BrunoMaria]

As to: "I also resent getting old and losing my youthful strength, having difficulty with recalling some of my memories. A truly “loving” creator would have been able to create a much better universe.“ (in Page one of this thread)

The universe and world we got, is the best we could have. It’s us who spoil it all. That God truly is the one and only LOVING Creator is stated in John 3,16: God loved the world so much, that He gave His one and only Son, so that everyone who believes in Him will not perish but have eternal life.

I’m near 80 and don’t regret in the least, that I’m past my youthful health. Otherwise I’d have to repeat it all. No thanks
The elder I am, the nearer I’m to God’s Kingdom. Fear of death? Truly and definitely NO! I often exercised it - among others by 3 heart attacks and 4 strokes and a lot of breakdowns. Once I was brought back by docs with a lot of allogeneic blood and what have you. So what? Sticking of the present earthly life? No! None of us will ever be dead! Not in 10000 years. Never!

As to "death is the extinction of consciousness“ - terribly funny. What about Lazarus and Abraham who told the rich man in hell, that he had his good life on earth, whilst Lazarus started his real life in heaven? None of them was unconscious, all very much alive.
I wouldn’t call this philosophical views at all. It’s the truth of Bible and Gospel. The real truth is understood a lot deeper by simple people then by those who think they are highly sophisticated, as Jesus told in Mt 11,25.
Yes, we only then have to fear death, “Only when I’m not in the state of grace!“ True! But it’s not ours to say this or that person is unworthy.
„Fear of death only when I’m not in the state of grace!” That’s ever so true, for as St. Paul said “it’s a fearful thing to fall in the hands of God” if we denied God. But still; Richard Dawkins’ books become bestsellers… en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Dawkins
He fights for his conviction that „there is no God“ and finds willing followers, though the just hope there is no God; which doesn’t make there is no God.
Let’s ponder what they think about death.… Where is their value of a „life“ just within two dates - date of birth and date of death …. then „nothing“ … and God’s incredible deed of salvation with Jesus’ passion was nil?!

Yes as here said: "consider whether I truly believe in eternal life.“ Same did the father in Mark 9:24 when he cried out and said, “I believe; help my unbelief!” Let this be a steady prayer of ours!

Hamlet’s “TO BE OR NOT TO BE” is not at all the question, for all of us are (live) and will be forever. The question far more so is; “to be in God or not to be in God”. This is the choice we got to make. And all do make this choice for either - willingly or unwillingly. With our birth, through God’s grace we are given the opportunity literally beyond belief; to live forever with God or without God. But live forever we will. Even then, when we will have to suffer the second death of Revelation 21,8.
It is simply wrong to say "Religious faith doesn’t change the purely hideous reality that is human death“. For if we think so, we disregard Jesus Christ’s clear truth and statement in John 11,26: The one who lives and believes in me will never die. Jesus Christ even added: Do you believe this? - which indicates that there are but two options: To believe or not to believe. That is the question. For there is no halfway house. We got to decide for one of the two! Was it of any use to be terrified about „death“ for any one of those who died? No! We all will. But there is no death! „Death“ is simply the door to God - nothing else! A throughway.

Yours
Bruno

 

[Rhubarb]

Oh my, yes. Not so much fear as dread. Like in the Lovecraftian sense. The thought of my consciousness and identity just… disappearing and never to return. It’s disturbing. It’s been on my mind a lot lately.

 

[ChainBreaker]

Oh my, yes. Not so much fear as dread. Like in the Lovecraftian sense. The thought of my consciousness and identity just… disappearing and never to return. It’s disturbing. It’s been on my mind a lot lately.

This is perfectly Natural. Life itself is rather bizarre to begin with anyway. Its even stranger that any physical construct would have a concept of eternal death for it presumes that being alive is more true to our dignity. Which leads me to wonder why a physical construct would be aware of its dignity. Dignity is not a physical construct and yet you are aware of it.

 

[GEddie]

This is perfectly Natural. Life itself is rather bizarre to begin with anyway. Its even stranger that any physical construct would have a concept of eternal death for it presumes that being alive is more true to our dignity. Which leads me to wonder why a physical construct would be aware of its dignity. Dignity is not a physical construct and yet you are aware of it.

Not so presumptive at all. Aliveness **is **more congruent with “human dignity”, because there is no dignity whatever in being dead. Human death is the ultimate indignity.

In the cultural customs surrounding human death, dignity is simulated by trying to make the body look asleep (therefore alive), and so hiding the shamefulness of death.

Dignity is only possible in the context of aliveness.

ICXC NIKA.

 

[meltzerboy]

Not so presumptive at all. Aliveness **is **more congruent with “human dignity”, because there is no dignity whatever in being dead. Human death is the ultimate indignity.

In the cultural customs surrounding human death, dignity is simulated by trying to make the body look asleep (therefore alive), and so hiding the shamefulness of death.

Dignity is only possible in the context of aliveness.

ICXC NIKA.

I must quibble somewhat with your last statement. It is true that in Judaism, death is not revered at all and one is not even supposed to focus on it. Also, it is necessary to wash one’s hands after returning from a gravesite, which gives the impression of something undignified and unclean about death. And a Jewish kohen must not even enter such a location. This may sound like the denial of and revulsion towards death. At the same time, however, the dead person is to be treated with the utmost dignity. The rituals of the mourning period in Judaism reflect that. Further, during the process of washing the body of the deceased and preparing the person for burial, one is not permitted to pass an instrument over the person’s body but is instead required to walk around the body out of respect and dignity for the individual. Also, it is required for a pious Jew to sit with the person’s body overnight saying prayers, rather than leaving the person alone. (I’m not certain but perhaps the latter custom hearkens back to former times when bodies were stolen.) In short, while death may be undignified, the dead person retains their dignity, which is probably what you meant in the first place.

 

[GEddie]

Well, yeah.

Death submits someone to final indignity, does not make them undignified per se.

As to your statement about stealing the bodies: was this during the 55-5600s for medical-school purposes, or earlier for more obscure/nefarious intentions?

 

[GEddie]

The person praying over the body may also have been equivalent to the “wake” in the Christian orbit: Watching over the body to make sure they were in fact deceased before proceeding with burial.

ICXC NIKA

 

[ChainBreaker]

Not so presumptive at all. Aliveness **is **more congruent with “human dignity”, because there is no dignity whatever in being dead. Human death is the ultimate indignity.

In the cultural customs surrounding human death, dignity is simulated by trying to make the body look asleep (therefore alive), and so hiding the shamefulness of death.

Dignity is only possible in the context of aliveness.

ICXC NIKA.

I am not saying that it is presumptive. I was speaking to the posters atheism. Its strange that an atheist is aware of dignity when such a thing does not exist if atheism is true.

 

[GEddie]

I am not saying that it is presumptive. I was speaking to the posters atheism. Its strange that an atheist is aware of dignity when such a thing does not exist if atheism is true.

The fact that something is a human construct does not make it irrelevant. Justice is a human construct – nature knows nothing of it – yet we all object to being subjected to injustice, so much so that we evolved civil society to restrain it.

Even if dignity is a human construct, it too has a real importance in human life.

I am not at all sure In any case whether the indignity of death is primarily why human beings object to the prospect of being dead. It isn’t primary for me.

ICXC NIKA

 

[BrunoMaria]

Oh my, yes. Not so much fear as dread. Like in the Lovecraftian sense. The thought of my consciousness and identity just… disappearing and never to return. It’s disturbing. It’s been on my mind a lot lately.

Funny really. You stick to being an agnostic, and you fear your consciousness and identity just… disappearing and never to return. But this is agnostic’s belief. Not Christian’s belief. Christians know this can’t happen. So, why not simply turn to Christianity?

Everyone will see God after one’s death. So, why not jump into belief right now. To stick to agnosticism, doubts, atheism and several other “I don’t knows” is like the little skeptic who refuses food, because he doesn’t know if it’s good.

I for my part would fear the consequences… The little sceptic dies of starvation, the agnostic will be terribly shocked, that it was all true after all. What then, when one has to admit to God: I REFUSED YOU!

But you are right: Agnosticism indeed is a “Lovecraftian horror of the unknown” (named after American author H. P. Lovecraft). Christian believers don’t know these Edgar Allan Poe-like fears, but they do know what “Death” is. It’s the door to the loving and just God. To him who believed in God in earthly lifetime, death is a wonderful throughway. But it’s a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the just God - to him, who denied God in spite of God’s incredible deed of salvation through Jesus Christ…

Yours
Bruno

 

[schaeffer]

Most of the time I don’t fear death, but every once in awhile I get a sudden shot of fear…then I remember my near death experience, my faith etc, and I’m OK again.

I liken it to hiking (which I do a lot of), I’ll be going happily along the trail, but occasionally I “lose” it. I’ve been lost a few times. really lost. In the woods. Miles away from anyone. That is pretty terrifying, easy to panic.

But I gather my wits, come up with a plan and find my way back.

If feels very much like that.

 

[JackVk]

Oh my, yes. Not so much fear as dread. Like in the Lovecraftian sense. The thought of my consciousness and identity just… disappearing and never to return. It’s disturbing. It’s been on my mind a lot lately.

Well, Lovecraft usually has his characters go nuts before they die. After witnessing Cthulhu or the Color Out of Space, or turning into a fish after vacationing in Innsmouth, death would be mercy

 

[ChainBreaker]

The fact that something is a human construct does not make it irrelevant. Justice is a human construct – nature knows nothing of it – yet we all object to being subjected to injustice, so much so that we evolved civil society to restrain it.

Even if dignity is a human construct, it too has a real importance in human life.

I am not at all sure In any case whether the indignity of death is primarily why human beings object to the prospect of being dead. It isn’t primary for me.

ICXC NIKA

There is no such thing as dignity in a world where God does not exist. Its meaningless.

 

[Crown_of_Stars]

To be honest, I do fear death. I mostly fear it than not. And I feel I will grow even more afraid, the closer I get to it. I don’t feel I’m worthy of heaven. There are times when I just sense that I will be damned. I can only hope I’m wrong, and strive to make it so this won’t be true.

 

[JackVk]

There is no such thing as dignity in a world where God does not exist. Its meaningless.

I couldn’t agree more. Secular humanism doesn’t have a leg to stand on. If there is no God, then we’re the compost of the cosmos that was lucky enough to self-replicate, and nothing more.