Do you pray in a Protestant Mass?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Mada85
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
I think it’s the same for Calvinists. Zwingli and Calvin differed on the Lord’s Supper.
 
lilypadrees said:
Not something I read Pup7. I spoke directly to Lutherans who said they and the members of their church (the Lutheran church) believe in consubstantiation.
Click to expand...
I didn’t read it on Wiki, for the record. I read it on a Lutheran page amongst some church documents when I was looking up and disputing someone who once posted that “most Protestants” believed in transubstantiation, which they do not.

I went to the “main” pages for the denominations pulling screenshots from official docs.
 
Last edited:
If you mean to say that Calvinist belief is the same as Lutheran, that would be very, very wrong. Calvinist thought is its own thing. It cannot be considered in harmony with the Lutheran position because Calvin denies the Real Presence except in a spiritual sense.

Lutherans would rather profess Transubstantiation than deny the Real Presence. Or, as Luther put it: “I’d rather drink pure blood with the Pope than mere wine with the Enthusiasts!” He was then speaking of Zwingli, but the point holds true against Calvinists for the same reasons.
 
Last edited:
steido01 said:
If you mean to say that Calvinist belief is the same as Lutheran, that would be very, very wrong.
Click to expand...
I wasn’t. Just Calvinism itself.
I remember a cartoon from a Lutheran satirizing Zwingli and Calvin for ‘hijacking’ Luther’s Reformation and the Real Presence was one of the points. It was very effective in making the case for the Lutheran view of the Reformation. If you know what I’m referring to, that’s great because I won’t provide the link because the end part could create chaos and arguing and derail this thread if not getting myself into trouble.
 
Last edited:
I thought we had been through this topic ad nauseam.
Lutherans believe in the real presence.
Catholics believe in transsubstantion and believe that Lutherans believe in constansubstation.

It’s about as meaningful as discussing veneration/dulia/hyperdulia (which I’m not going to do, just made a parallell) or demand that the Orthodox define the divine mysteries.
 
Yep.

I used to use “Yep” a lot on the old board. Here, I have to add something.
 
Since I was hoping to lure a Lutheran out on this (and here you are, as I hoped), don’t take the comment following as disagreeing. But, in evidence of possible Lutheran motleydom, I have met and read a very scholarly Lutheran cleric, theologically an analogue of an Anglo-Catholic, orthodox to the core, who has a different view. I wouldn’t begin to try to explain it, I just point: Behold…motley.
 
Roseary said:
Why the hate? The Bible tells us not to gossip.

We need less division and more love. We all need to make sure that we are speaking in love to each other and not in hate.

Pray for each other. Don’t return evil for evil.
Click to expand...
What exactly are you talking about?

What hate and gossip??

She has a 1000 year ban. That would be an irrefutable fact. No need to lecture me on hate. I’m not a kid.
 
Last edited:
ATraveller said:
I wasn’t. Just Calvinism itself.
Click to expand...
Ah, I see your meaning now. Yeah, “hijacking” is an accurate way of putting it, from the Lutheran perspective. There are some great historical episodes of ‘secret wars’ waged by Crypto-Calvinists within Lutheran churches, often targeting pastors’ wives for a foothold. Unpleasant stuff.
GKMotley said:
Since I was hoping to lure a Lutheran out on this (and here you are, as I hoped)
Click to expand...
You had the right incantation. I keep your summoning spell at hand for when Henry’s shiny comes up.
GKMotley said:
I have met and read a very scholarly Lutheran cleric
Click to expand...
Belonging to an LWF communion or one of its predecessor bodies, no doubt? Likely an American?
 
Ok, now you’ve got me curious. A product of the German merged churches? Or a Scandinavian who studied under them?
 
My dad failed his vicarage needed more compassion and did not have the temper to be a pastor.
 
Reuben_J said:
I have seen non-Catholics (including Muslims - we knew by the head cover the women worn)
Click to expand...
Be careful with that assumption. We have a lot of copts at my parish. By the way they are dressed You’d think they were Muslim, but they are very much Catholic.
 
steido01 said:
As impanation - where the substances don’t change, but Christ’s presence is substantially stored in the substance of the bread and wine

As incorporation - where the substances don’t change, but Christ’s presence is mingled into the substance of the bread and wine
Click to expand...
steido01 said:
That He truly, physically gives Himself for us for the forgiveness of sins in (and with and under and in every inadequate human way of understanding) the bread and the wine
Click to expand...
How are these statements different? They sound, more or less, exactly the same.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top