Do you support imposing your belief system on non-believers?

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Dan123 said:
By advocating that the law reflect a Catholic view of marriage you’re in turn preventing other faith’s from exercising their rights with the support of the law you would be enjoying.
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it isn’t just the catholic view, it was the only view, until they redefined marriage.
Dan123 said:
The idea that marriage has been the same throughout history is frankly baffling.
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when was marriage ever between members of the same-sex?
jan10000 said:
Because that is what they are.
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no, it is what the US government redefined marriage to mean. it historically didn’t include this and it isn’t universal, in parts of the world it is still specifically a union between a man and a woman.
jan10000 said:
because there are legal rules and procedures that take affect when you involve more then two people. For instance, a union of three or more people is legally not a marriage, it is a corporation.
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wait, didn’t we just redefine the legal definition of marriage? why not do it again for 3 and then again for 4, etc.
Dan123 said:
Forcing churches to perform gay marriage ceremonies is not a common or popular opinion.
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no, but neither was gay marriage. it is being pushed and the groundswell is just starting. 2 gays are currently suing a seminary for kicking them out of school. it is an agenda.
K9Buck said:
Same-sex marriage affects no one outside of the two folks who VOLUNTARILY agree to marry one another. Two dudes getting married or engaging in sex in the privacy of their own dwelling is not an “imposition” upon you or anyone else.
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if that was all it was, look at what the lgbt is suing over and you can see an agenda.
 
PennyinCanada said:
God’s design for sex within the context of marriage…
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So people that don’t believe in God should, nevertheless, be forced to live by your belief system, right?

I disagree. I believe that non-Christians should be free to live their lives as they see fit, provided that their actions don’t adversely affect an innocent third party. In other words, your freedom to be you includes my freedom to be free FROM you. And if you still disagree, then think about this. If 200 million Americans converted to Islam and they wanted to impose Sharia Law in America, would you still want personal belief systems to be the law of the land?
 
“Forcing your beliefs on me” is usually code for “passing laws I don’t like.”

Some people who talk like that really are very libertarian and give as well as they get, but most have plenty of their own beliefs to “impose” on society and societal models they want to force others to support.
 
Brendan_64 said:
You have a point there , so long as such legal protections for religions and continue to exist. Although laws and protections can be challenged.
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They can, yes, though it’s harder with bill of rights type stuff but you’re right not impossible. But again, I just don’t see it. I know people who think the catholic church is an awful, bigoted, evil organization, and I also know they aren’t looking to force a church to do anything inside their walls that they don’t condone. You may find some individuals who would, certainly gay Catholics might, I bet we could find at least a couple Catholics who if given the chance would force everyone to convert by law. I don’t consider the existence of a few outliers evidence of anything.

A strong principle of ‘my rights end where yours begin’ is the best defense both for gay marriage, and against compulsory ceremonies by churches.
 
upant said:
no, but neither was gay marriage. it is being pushed and the groundswell is just starting. 2 gays are currently suing a seminary for kicking them out of school. it is an agenda.
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It’s curious how privilege is so often ignored. The school accepts federal funding, use private money and you don’t need to follow federal anti-discrimination laws.
 
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Dan123 said:
A strong principle of ‘my rights end where yours begin’ is the best defense both for gay marriage, and against compulsory ceremonies by churches.
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Or “Your freedom to be you includes MY freedom to be free FROM you”. - Andrea Wilkow (conservative commentator)
 
po18guy said:
Laws are also partially based on what contributes to a healthy, well-ordered and self-perpetuating society.
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That’s true. The litmus for me, however, is whether laws create victimless “crimes” wherein consenting adults are prohibited from engaging in activities in which NO third-party is adversely affected.

By that standard, stealing and rape are crimes because those acts adversely affect a third-party. Gay marriage does not affect a third party.
 
Dan123 said:
It’s curious how privilege is so often ignored. The school accepts federal funding, use private money and you don’t need to follow federal anti-discrimination laws.
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If they’re accepting federal money, then I would agree that they can be compelled to adhere to the terms attached to accepting said money. Aside from that, I’m of the opinion that, supposedly “free” people should be “free” to discriminate against anyone for any reason.
 
K9Buck said:
I believe that non-Christians should be free to live their lives as they see fit, provided that their actions don’t adversely affect an innocent third party. In other words, your freedom to be you includes my freedom to be free FROM you.
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I wrote out like half a page of the reality of actions that this culture has brought on itself, the harm it’s brought on itself and families and it’s country, and you just skipped right over that. The whole nation is affected by lose living, as I wrote out. Your own personal belief system resulted in 60 million abortions in your country. If that’s not an innocent third party, what is? The measure you measure to Christians has fallen on you. The ruler you use on others will be used to measure you. The crimes to the dignity of the human person fall on you.

You are like the person driving around town pulling out stop signs because they are too restricting. When there’s accidents and people hurt, it’s not your fault. The casualties fall on you.

No worries. In the end God will sort it all out. The wheat and the tares. The sheep and the goats. We are here for a short time, and we indeed get to chose. Chose wisely. Wake up from your sleep for your Savior is at the door. Don’t waste another day on this foolishness. The grace I wish for you.
 
K9Buck said:
The litmus for me, however, is whether laws create victimless “crimes” wherein consenting adults are prohibited from engaging in activities in which NO third-party is adversely affected.
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60 million abortions in the US.
That’s a big third party.
 
Dan123 said:
It’s curious how privilege is so often ignored. The school accepts federal funding, use private money and you don’t need to follow federal anti-discrimination laws.
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it has nothing to do with privilege, the students are going to be preachers, how can they preach the faith when they don’t follow the faith the school teaches? they had to know this going in, it is an agenda.
 
PetraG said:
Some people who talk like that really are very libertarian…
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If 200 million Americans converted to Islam and wanted to make Sharia Law the law of the land, I suspect that you would then agree with me that, government and laws should NOT be based on religion.
 
On another note, I’m curious as to why there is a message at the bottom of this thread stating that this thread will “automatically close” in 6 hours. Why is that? Does forum management not believe in the free flow of ideas?

In my experience, the two segments in America most likely to impose authoritarian rule is the political left and the religious right. Opposite sides of the same coin.
 
Brendan_64 said:
To remove the male and female union is to alter the nature of the institution and create something else.
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Yes, traditionally, that is true. However, should modern laws that govern society be based on tradition?
 
PennyinCanada said:
So this is a same sex marriage topic.
Why didn’t you say that at the top?
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The topic encapsulates same-sex marriage and many other activities that many Christians seek to outlaw through the force of government.

God gave us free will. Should we restrict another’s free will even when their actions affect no one else? Would you be ok with Sharia Law being imposed upon yourself?
 
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