Do YOU think marijuana use is wrong?

[DL82]

I was using the search tool on this forum, and found numerous thread regarding how marijuana use (recreational) is wrong, and even a priest responded it is morally wrong because it is illegal.

My oh my. I pity those who condemn the use of marijuana. If it’s the illegal aspect of it that makes you see it as being wrong, consider this: Getting a prostitute in Las Vegas is legal, so it that right?

Besides, we all know Holland has very liberal drug laws, and the statistics actually show it has among the lowest crime rates in all of Europe. The Dutch have gotten it right…they distinguish cannabis from harder drugs…which means there are significantly less dealers on the streets looking to push the drug.

What really comes to mind is the health aspect. Everyone knows 0 deaths have been directly linked to Marijuana…while millions die each year of tobacco and alcohol, which are obviously legal…such a shame.

While smoking pot has limited harm, it’s no secret pure THC does wonders to the body…it widens the blood vessels (unlike tobacco, which constricts them), helps those of glaucoma, it’s even been found it helps with memory, since it stimulates neurotransmitters…which is why many people often find themselves remembering things that happened a while ago, almost with a photographic description…and of course, it gives people a feeling of complete ecstasy, a super feeling which heightens the senses…

which is what brings me to post here. Believe it or not, Marijuana is actually a spiritual ritual to me…I use it at night, think about life, pray…it’s an experience that I wouldn’t trade for the world…it’s very peaceful. I wish more fellow Catholics realized the truth about God’s magical plant, and that it wasn’t so wrongly viewed upon by corporate America.

God bless you all.

The Dutch situation is far from ideal. Though Holland has legalised possession of small quantities, and licensed sales in coffee shops, the import and wholesale of the drug is still controlled by organised crime.

The Italian Mafia controls almost all the ‘coffee houses’ in Amsterdam, though there were some murders in the 1990’s when the Russians tried to gain influence. The money from the legal sales of marijuana in Holland go into supporting the smuggling of harder drugs like cocaine and heroin, and into trafficking of marijuana into the rest of Europe and the USA.

Even if a country were to control and license the import and wholesale of marijuana, they would still be propping up the profits of drug growers in South America and the Caribbean who are breaking their own country’s laws and involved in other criminal activities, e.g. hard drugs, prostitution, people trafficking, and are often in armed revolt against their own governments.

I can’t agree that moderate use of marijuana is no more harmful than moderate use of alcohol either. Recent studies have proven links between cannabis smoking and paranoid schizophrenia and all kinds of other problems. Unlike cigarettes and alcohol, marijuana has an effect that people don’t want to come down from. Even the most hardened alcoholic will need to be sober some of the time, and will know that he’s drunk when he’s drunk, and that a drunk mind is a clouded mind. The whole problem with being stoned is that the drug tricks your mind into believing that it is at its clearest when stoned, that means once you start using you want to go on using to make sure you’re always stoned.

 

[Hippie4Peace]

The Dutch situation is far from ideal. Though Holland has legalised possession of small quantities, and licensed sales in coffee shops, the import and wholesale of the drug is still controlled by organised crime.

The Italian Mafia controls almost all the ‘coffee houses’ in Amsterdam, though there were some murders in the 1990’s when the Russians tried to gain influence. The money from the legal sales of marijuana in Holland go into supporting the smuggling of harder drugs like cocaine and heroin, and into trafficking of marijuana into the rest of Europe and the USA.

Even if a country were to control and license the import and wholesale of marijuana, they would still be propping up the profits of drug growers in South America and the Caribbean who are breaking their own country’s laws and involved in other criminal activities, e.g. hard drugs, prostitution, people trafficking, and are often in armed revolt against their own governments.

I can’t agree that moderate use of marijuana is no more harmful than moderate use of alcohol either. Recent studies have proven links between cannabis smoking and paranoid schizophrenia and all kinds of other problems. Unlike cigarettes and alcohol, marijuana has an effect that people don’t want to come down from. Even the most hardened alcoholic will need to be sober some of the time, and will know that he’s drunk when he’s drunk, and that a drunk mind is a clouded mind. The whole problem with being stoned is that the drug tricks your mind into believing that it is at its clearest when stoned, that means once you start using you want to go on using to make sure you’re always stoned.

I disagree. The Netherlands’ drug policy is the most nonpunitive in Europe. For more than twenty years, Dutch citizens over age eighteen have been permitted to buy and use cannabis (marijuana and hashish) in government-regulated coffee shops. This policy has not resulted in dramatically escalating cannabis use. For most age groups, rates of marijuana use in the Netherlands are similar to those in the United States. However, for young adolescents, rates of marijuana use are lower in the Netherlands than in the United States. The Dutch people overwhelmingly approve of current cannabis policy which seeks to normalize rather than dramatize cannabis use. The Dutch government occasionally revises existing policy, but it remains committed to decriminalization.

Do NOT even talk about crime in Holland, as it is among the lowest in all of Europe.

What is your claim about the effect of Marijuana? If anything, one who is under its effects will be more cautious. For example, a drunk will most likely drive or try to drive a car, and it will be up to his friends to prevent him…if they don’t, he’ll feel as though he’s able enough to drive, whereas a person who is “stoned” knows he/she is unable, nor wants to drive. And I don’t know who you know is always “stoned”…everyone I knows uses it in MODERATION, it’s definitely NOT a daily thing.

As for the claim earlier about a pregnant mother using Marijuana…Studies of newborns, infants, and children show no consistent physical, developmental, or cognitive deficits related to prenatal marijuana exposure. Marijuana had no reliable impact on birth size, length of gestation, neurological development, or the occurrence of physical abnormalities. The administration of hundreds of tests to older children has revealed only minor differences between offspring of marijuana users and nonusers, and some are positive rather than negative. Two unconfirmed case-control studies identified prenatal marijuana exposure as one of many factors statistically associated with childhood cancer. Given other available evidence, it is highly unlikely that marijuana causes cancer in children.

 

[setter]

Botom line: Longitudinal, anecdotal evidence all but demonstrates that regular, chronic use of any mood-mind altering substance mariginalizes and hadicaps one’s ability to perceive and interact with reality, i.e., it makes one dumb and often fearful. There are also variables such as the age of onset of use which add to the complicating consequences from regular use. Note: The chronic user is most often the last one to realize it.

 

[Bennie_P]

everyone I knows uses it in MODERATION, it’s definitely NOT a daily thing.

.

So you only know pot heads?:hypno:

Peer pressure gets Lemmings to jump over cliffs. :hypno:

Suggested web site hazelden.org/web/landing.view

 

[Al_Masetti]

Hey dude, if a surgeon uses marijuana, would you want that person to operate on you? I guess that would be ok if he (or she) was really cool and felt totally in control, like.

 

[Hippie4Peace]

Marijuana is wrong unless used for medical purposes (i.e. pain relief). If you need proof of that have a look at the paranoid kids running around every major city constantly thinking someones after them and stealing (with or without violence) to feed their habit. Tell me when alcoholics or smokers attack en masse for the price of a pint or a couple of fags?

I appreciate your opinion, however, that’s your biased view. It all goes back to the beginning of time…ever heard the quote, “God made pot. Man made beer. Who do you trust?” The problem is nowadays everybody who hasn’t experienced pot first hand is quick to reprimand it and condemn of its use.

By your view, I could say Beer or alcohol is wrong, unless used for blood thinning purposes. The problem is, the majority of people use that alcohol, use it to get drunk, and “free their problems.” In order to achieve it’s blood thinning, beneficial qualities, it needs to be consumed in MODERATION. Moderation is an average of one to two drinks a day for men and one for non-pregnant women. A drink is defined as either 12 ounces of regular beer, five ounces of wine, 1.5 ounces of 80-proof spirits or one ounce of 100-proof spirits.

Paranoid kids…and marijuana? Do you any reference point? I don’t know ANYONE who uses marijuana and is paranoid…sounds like you are either talking of a different drug or kids who were born with disorders. To say the least, alcohol is the number one cause of violence. In just about every case of violence, alcohol is involved. Marijuana, if anything, makes people more relaxed and peaceful. You are way off base.

 

[Hippie4Peace]

Botom line: Longitudinal, anecdotal evidence all but demonstrates that regular, chronic use of any mood-mind altering substance mariginalizes and hadicaps one’s ability to perceive and interact with reality, i.e., it makes one dumb and often fearful. There are also variables such as the age of onset of use which add to the complicating consequences from regular use. Note: The chronic user is most often the last one to realize it.

Common misconception.

For twenty-five years, researchers have searched for a marijuana-induced amotivational syndrome and have failed to find it. People who are intoxicated constantly, regardless of the drug, are unlikely to be productive members of society. There is nothing about marijuana specifically that causes people to lose their drive and ambition. In laboratory studies, subjects given high doses of marijuana for several days or even several weeks exhibit no decrease in work motivation or productivity. Among working adults, marijuana users tend to earn higher wages than non-users. College students who use marijuana have the same grades as nonusers. Among high school students, heavy use is associated with school failure, but school failure usually comes first.

 

[fix]

I was using the search tool on this forum, and found numerous thread regarding how marijuana use (recreational) is wrong, and even a priest responded it is morally wrong because it is illegal.

My oh my. I pity those who condemn the use of marijuana. If it’s the illegal aspect of it that makes you see it as being wrong, consider this: Getting a prostitute in Las Vegas is legal, so it that right?

Fornication is intrinsically wrong no matter the civil law in affect. Laws regulating drugs are not unjust simply because they disallow them for recreation.

Besides, we all know Holland has very liberal drug laws, and the statistics actually show it has among the lowest crime rates in all of Europe. The Dutch have gotten it right…they distinguish cannabis from harder drugs…which means there are significantly less dealers on the streets looking to push the drug.

What really comes to mind is the health aspect. Everyone knows 0 deaths have been directly linked to Marijuana…while millions die each year of tobacco and alcohol, which are obviously legal…such a shame.

The difference bewteen so called soft and hard drugs is not that significant. The point is why do people want to alter their mentation? That question goes to a serious problem in this culture.

While smoking pot has limited harm, it’s no secret pure THC does wonders to the body…it widens the blood vessels (unlike tobacco, which constricts them), helps those of glaucoma, it’s even been found it helps with memory, since it stimulates neurotransmitters…which is why many people often find themselves remembering things that happened a while ago, almost with a photographic description…and of course, it gives people a feeling of complete ecstasy, a super feeling which heightens the senses…

which is what brings me to post here. Believe it or not, Marijuana is actually a spiritual ritual to me…I use it at night, think about life, pray…it’s an experience that I wouldn’t trade for the world…it’s very peaceful. I wish more fellow Catholics realized the truth about God’s magical plant, and that it wasn’t so wrongly viewed upon by corporate America.

Any possible physiological benefits from any drug need to be weight against harm. Would you claim it moral to use morphine because one has a slight headache?

As for spiritual ritual I would politely say we can all be easily deceived.

 

[Hippie4Peace]

So you only know pot heads?:hypno:

Peer pressure gets Lemmings to jump over cliffs. :hypno:

Suggested web site hazelden.org/web/landing.view

First of all, I would only deem the term “pothead” to a daily user of Marijuana. Second, of the people I know who USE marijuana, they use it moderately. My best friend in fact, is against alcohol, tobacco, marijuana, etc. and is a vegetarian. But that doesn’t affect our relationship…we’ve been best friends since elementary school, and are currently living together in college.

I guess any DRUG starts to create a problem for oneself once their life begins to revolve around it, at which point, a person must be very low mentally, and have very little in terms of success going for them. My two cents.

 

[Hippie4Peace]

Hey dude, if a surgeon uses marijuana, would you want that person to operate on you? I guess that would be ok if he (or she) was really cool and felt totally in control, like.

Actually, to be honest, it may help the surgeon. He or she would be more cautious and slight with movements and the incisions would be more likely to be precise. Not to sound like an ***, but I wouldn’t mind it. I have heard of snipers who use it to help them with the constant position they must hold for very extended periods of time…it keeps them still, and the gun more steady.

 

[setter]

Common misconception.

For twenty-five years, researchers have searched for a marijuana-induced amotivational syndrome and have failed to find it.

 

[setter]

Actually, to be honest, it may help the surgeon. He or she would be more cautious and slight with movements and the incisions would be more likely to be precise. …

I do believe that this assertion just sealed the nail on the casket of your argument.

 

[Hippie4Peace]

I do believe that this assertion just sealed the nail on the casket of your argument.

I’m glad you changed ‘argument’ to ‘assertion.’ For your sake, it doesn’t sound redundant anymore .

However, I was expressing my thoughts. I would think everyone on here would equate marijuana use with poor thought process, skills, etc. so I was giving my opinion…unless of course, he consumed too much, and had to leave the operating room for a case of the “munchies.”

 

[Bennie_P]

I figured right away that you were probably in college or younger. Your trying to justify a choice you know that others don’t approve of (probably your parents)and that is not a sign of maturity. With time I pray that you see how your wasting your time getting wasted, I just hope you open your mind, before it becomes a life changing problem. For many it usually takes something tragic or life changing, such as going to jail or death (yours or someone elses). I pray that God gives you mercy and wisdom before something like that happens.

“It is the nature of addiction that addicts don’t believe they are ill. Marijuana addicts, in particular, tend to believe that they must be “OK” since there are much worse drugs, and other people whose lives are *much *worse off as a result of their using. That is denial.”

For more information http://www.marijuana-anonymous.org

 

[Hippie4Peace]

I figured right away that you were probably in college or younger. Your trying to justify a choice you know that others don’t approve of (probably your parents)and that is not a sign of maturity. With time I pray that you see how your wasting your time getting wasted, I just hope you open your mind, before it becomes a life changing problem. For many it usually takes something tragic or life changing, such as going to jail or death (yours or someone elses). I pray that God gives you mercy and wisdom before something like that happens.

“It is the nature of addiction that addicts don’t believe they are ill. Marijuana addicts, in particular, tend to believe that they must be “OK” since there are much worse drugs, and other people whose lives are *much *worse off as a result of their using. That is denial.”

For more information http://www.marijuana-anonymous.org

Bennie, I pray for you.

Does the fact that I’m in college jepardize my credibility? Shame on you. People that hold college degrees in America are definitely the MINORITY.

Bennie, you sound like all the other ignorant people in the world by talking about it as “a choice others don’t approve of.” That’s the problem. You are probably one of the million who watch those anti-drug commercials on TV, and are proud of the fallacies it presents. The fact is, it SHOULDN’T be a choice others don’t approve of.

A waste of time? To each their own, but it’s certainly not a waste of time, and it definitely does NOT inhibit me from maintaining a 3.7 GPA while balancing work and volunteering at a local hospital.

Open my mind? Bennie, I am very open minded. It sounds to me like you are anything but that. I believe all drugs should be legalized…if people want to buy cocaine, heroine, LSD, at a government-run facility, let them be, after all, God gave us all free will. They know that those drugs are dangerous, and if they are weakened or made to do something they wouldn’t have while not intoxicated, that is their own fault.

“Marijuana is self-punishing. It makes you acutely sensitive, and in this world, what worse punishment could there be?”

For more informationerowid.org/plants/cannabis/cannabis_myth.shtml

 

[BLB_Oregon]

You’re going to wish you hadn’t said that…I could go on and on…

I’ll name people who YOU may be aware of…William Shakespeare… Thomas Jefferson, etc.

Are they not intelligent enough?

I don’t think anyone has ever been canonized or denied canonization based on their intelligence. It is not the fact that one has gifts that is important, but how they are used.

I was responding with intelligent users because she claimed intelligent and drug users do not go together…which is the common thought surrounding most Americans…

which is why most “stoner” movies depict the characters as stupid, lazy, and unproductive…

The fact remains that I have lived in a science dorm and had marijuana users tell me that when they were doing pot, they got "B"s, and when they weren’t, they got "A"s. I have heard of all sorts of reports of the drug increasing relaxation and relieving stress, but nobody has ever told me that pot made them smarter.

They have told me it makes them think they’re smarter. They get stoned, they write down all these profound revelations, and then they sober up and it is all jibberish. If you weren’t a philosopher or a poet before you smoked it, pot isn’t going to make you into a philosopher or poet.

This is the testimony I have gotten from people who use and see nothing wrong with it, not from “converts” who never do it any more, so I see no reason to doubt their word on it. Lowered productivity and lowered mental acuity are common side-effects of marijuana use.

here is a quote from Willie Nelson:

"I think people need to be educated to the fact that marijuana is not a drug. Marijuana is an herb and a flower. God put it here. If He put it here and He wants it to grow, what gives the government the right to say that God is wrong?

God put us here with many medicinal plants. Being a flower or and herb and being a drug are not mutually exclusive. Most of pharmacology rests on discoveries taken from the plant world.

Many of your points are valid ones, but they fail to address the morality of an individual person’s use of marijuana and only focus on whether the drug should be legal…

I would definitely say that there is a much stronger argument, which I posted earlier, for an individual not using mind-altering substances, than there is for keeping marijuana illegal. That said, I don’t think legalizing the drug should really be on the top of anyone’s agenda.

That marijuana may have legitimate uses, even vitally important ones, does not imply that it is legitimate for anyone to use any time that they want. That it makes a person feel good does not imply that it is good.

Likewise, just because something poses a moral threat does not imply that the best societal response is to make the thing illegal. The main thing is that society finds a way to have each thing used responsibly and that punishment required of those who break the law is commensurate with the harm done (or likely to be done, if the perpetrator doesn’t amend their ways).

As the users I know have noted, marijuana is not conducive to academic excellence. Although some excellent students still excel in spite of it and a few nervous ones do better with it, this is not a substance that young people should have free access to. The evidence does not support the idea that young people will use either alcohol or marijuana responsibly with regards to either promoting academics or avoiding the reckless behaviors that the adolescent mind is already heir to just by reason of the physical changes the person is going through. Furthermore, youth is the time when habits learned own us, rather than the other way around. We need to keep kids from using pot and alcohol.

Nevertheless, filling our jails with marijuana users does not seem to me to be a very good way to deal with the problems that are often associated with the use of marijuana. Even if we had the resources to incarcerate everyone who committed transgressions against moral law (which we don’t), incarceration is hardly a panacea against immorality.

IOW, I think that self-medication with marijuana is to be avoided, just as self-medication with alcohol should be avoided. Those who cannot use without self-medicating should avoid use altogether. I think that the fact that marijuana is currently illegal adds another layer of immorality to its use (unless perhaps there is a legitimate need which the law ignores, but this is a more unusual case than people suppose). Nevertheless, I think that current marijuana laws do not serve the best interest of the people, and should be changed.

Keeping pot criminal is VERY expensive, both in dollars and lives. While the intentions are good, our efforts to regulate marijuana use need to be re-examined.

That’s my two cents.

 

[fix]

.if people want to buy cocaine, heroine, LSD, at a government-run facility, let them be, after all, God gave us all free will. They know that those drugs are dangerous, and if they are weakened or made to do something they wouldn’t have while not intoxicated, that is their own fault.

For one thing all the problems that would increase would fall on all the folks who do not engage in such things. Freedom includes law. With no restraint on freedom we have tyranny.

 

[rr1213]

Is Marijuana use wrong?

Easy answer for American citizens. It is illegal in this country and, since we are called by God to obey all non-sinful laws of the government, yes it’s wrong. Now, what if the government were to legalize marijuana use? Then I think that it would depend on whether it is possible to use the drug without becoming intoxicated. Much comparison is made to alcohol, but we know from Scripture that it is not sinful to use alcohol in a moderate fashion, indeed Jesus himself did this. What is sinful is becoming intoxicated through alcohol. If marijuana was legal, and it was possible to use it without being intoxicated, then I think that it would not be sinful. If not, then yes it is sinful.

 

[LDNCatholic]

Paranoid kids…and marijuana? Do you any reference point? I don’t know ANYONE who uses marijuana and is paranoid…sounds like you are either talking of a different drug or kids who were born with disorders. To say the least, alcohol is the number one cause of violence. In just about every case of violence, alcohol is involved. Marijuana, if anything, makes people more relaxed and peaceful. You are way off base.

I can assure you my sisters wern’t born with any disorders and that their poison of choice is marijuana not another drug. I wasn’t talking about violence under the effects of marijuana, but the violence that stems from being cut off from their supply.

 

[Bennie_P]

Bennie, I pray for you.

Does the fact that I’m in college jepardize my credibility? Shame on you. People that hold college degrees in America are definitely the MINORITY.

Bennie, you sound like all the other ignorant people in the world by talking about it as “a choice others don’t approve of.” That’s the problem. You are probably one of the million who watch those anti-drug commercials on TV, and are proud of the fallacies it presents. The fact is, it SHOULDN’T be a choice others don’t approve of.

A waste of time? To each their own, but it’s certainly not a waste of time, and it definitely does NOT inhibit me from maintaining a 3.7 GPA while balancing work and volunteering at a local hospital.

Open my mind? Bennie, I am very open minded. It sounds to me like you are anything but that. I believe all drugs should be legalized…if people want to buy cocaine, heroine, LSD, at a government-run facility, let them be, after all, God gave us all free will. They know that those drugs are dangerous, and if they are weakened or made to do something they wouldn’t have while not intoxicated, that is their own fault.

“Marijuana is self-punishing. It makes you acutely sensitive, and in this world, what worse punishment could there be?”

For more informationerowid.org/plants/cannabis/cannabis_myth.shtml

“Hello my name is Bennie, I’m an addict.”

Been there done that.

Come to a NA meeting with me and hear the stories of all the Lawyers, Doctors, Scientist, School Teachers, College Professors, Etc. and Etc. At one time they had it all figured out too and so did I.

God does love us so much that He gave us a free will. We can choose to accept his love or we can choose to follow our idols. I’ve been hearing all those arguments that you are giving since the 60s and at one time I also used many of those same arguments to justify my bad choices.
The worst prejudice is that of youths, they close their minds off to experience, for wisdom comes with experience over time, not from intellect, IQ or a 4.0 GPA.

I’m not a wise man, nor a saint, but with the Grace of God I may be both some day and I pray that you will too. Hope to see you in heaven.

1Cor 13:11 *When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child. But, when I became a man, I put away the things of a child. *

1Co 1:21
For, seeing that in the wisdom of God, the world, by wisdom, knew not God, it pleased God, by the foolishness of our preaching, to save them that believe.

Marijuana is good for making rope and cloth, getting stone is a waste of time, wasting time is wrong and I’ve wasted enough time on this thread. Thus I have sinned.

PAX