Do you think priests should be allowed to marry?

[BSHoop96]

**Originally Posted by veritashunter **
*]Dear Distracted:

1. You seem to be confused…you stated that you didn’t know how difficult it was to subdue your sexual urges. *

*with all due respect, you are the one who seems confused… I didn’t say that. *

Distracted…you did say this. I just read it in your post. Sometimes when someone brings up something you said and it’s worded slightly different you have a tendency to say that’s not what you said when actually…it was.

 

[distracted]

if a Priest does leave the Priesthood, and chooses marriage, do i believe that he is no longer a Priest,

You are wrong. The Church doesn’t teach that. the Church teaches that, as in the case of Melchizedek, “you are a priest forever”…

I believe he gave up that right when he broke that oath to God,

The Church does not say this… The Church can grant dispensations for a priest to be married and also be in good standing with the Chruch.

 

[distracted]

Im sorry distracted but again we disagree. just because God knows what we are going to do, before we do it, does not take away our free will.

and i am sorry but that is totally illogical. Just my opinion… (except that logic tells me it is illogical)…

Just because he knows everything and if what you are saying is true and i am wrong why did he tell Peter that he would betray him 3 times. he by no means made Peter do that. he just knew.

He knew Peter was capable of it and mabye God the Father gave Jesus the foreknowledge or what have you, to know tht Peter was highly likely to do that… but… well, i don’t have all the answers. I am not God… and neither are you.

All i am saying is that we are free to do whtever we want, for good or bad… Accepting Christ and committing to Him doesn’t mean we will never fall… but just because we are human and weak, doesn’t mean we will fall either, in every way or even in one way… It is possible (though not likely?) that a person can accept Christ and never commit mortal sin again… It is all about choice… (except that none of us stays clear of venial sin…)…

(Of course, some peole define mortal sin differently… If the definition of mortal sin is to do soemthing that we know God doesn’t want and to do it with full knowoledge and consent… then very few Christians , i woiuld think, commit mortal sin…)…

 

[rinnie]

Well like I said distracted I dont agree with you. But thats okay, I believe that God knows who we are and if we are one of his or not. He tell us that himself, that is when he comes back he will know who is his and who isnt. You cant fool him and he knows what we are going to do before we do it. Like i said i didnt say he would not forgive us he knows, Again look at Peter, he knew Peter would betray him 3 times,and he did. God did not make Peter do that.

 

[BSHoop96]

Im sorry distracted but again we disagree. just because God knows what we are going to do, before we do it, does not take away our free will.

Distracted may say this is illogical but it makes perfect sense to me!

 

[rinnie]

Distracted may say this is illogical but it makes perfect sense to me!

Thanx BShoop96 have a good week-end everyone, you too distracted!

 

[distracted]

I read this thing in the Bible last night… about how God told some prophet to tell a king (can’t recall names but could find it)… about how the king was wicked and God was going to do terrible things to him… I mean, the prophet told this guy as though these things would DEFINITELY happen… no way to stop it…

The king repented… and God was pleased and relented in his punishment… so the terrible things predicted by the prophet did not come to pass…

It seems in the passage that God had “not expected” him to repent…

God does not “know” what we are going to do… If that were the case, we would not have free will…

 

[rinnie]

I read this thing in the Bible last night… about how God told some prophet to tell a king (can’t recall names but could find it)… about how the king was wicked and God was going to do terrible things to him… I mean, the prophet told this guy as though these things would DEFINITELY happen… no way to stop it…

The king repented… and God was pleased and relented in his punishment… so the terrible things predicted by the prophet did not come to pass…

It seems in the passage that God had “not expected” him to repent…

God does not “know” what we are going to do… If that were the case, we would not have free will…

See thats not the way i see it distracted God knew like you said that the king needed to repent so he warned him to do it. And luckily the King listened. If God does not know who is going to go to heaven why is it written who are of God and who are not. The bible tells you when the end does come God will separate the Sheep from the Goats. God knows all. Where i think you and i are not connecting is you think just because God knows what choices we are going to make, that some how takes our choices off of us. Just like God knew that Judas was going to betray him and he also knew that Peter would, how do you explain that one then, Are you saying God took Peters free will away or Judas free will away. No he did not. God promised us that, he would give us that, look at job, he let the devil do whatever he wanted to job, but the devil could not take away jobs free will. How do you explain that, But God knew didnt he, He knew that Job would not betray God, why because God knows the difference between the sheep and goats. Just because we fail, and sin and do wrong does not take away our free will, what i dont think you are understanding sinning and repentance are the big thing here. What did Peter do he repented, he asked for forgiveness, thats the difference between Peter and Judas, Judas took the easy way out and took his own life he gave into the devil. Peter did sin yes, but he asked God for forgiveness and was sorry Now do you see the difference.God knew Peter would repent, and come back to him, he also knew Judas would not. But he still let it be their choice. Does that make sense now.

 

[BSHoop96]

I read this thing in the Bible last night… about how God told some prophet to tell a king (can’t recall names but could find it)… about how the king was wicked and God was going to do terrible things to him… I mean, the prophet told this guy as though these things would DEFINITELY happen… no way to stop it…

The king repented… and God was pleased and relented in his punishment… so the terrible things predicted by the prophet did not come to pass…

It seems in the passage that God had “not expected” him to repent…

God does not “know” what we are going to do… If that were the case, we would not have free will…

God knows what someone will do, but that is not the same as forcing them or preventing them from doing it, IMO.

 

[veritashunter]

Dear Distracted:

To say that God does not know what we will do before we do it is equivalent to saying that God is not God at all. Your concept of the Omnipotent seems somewhat small and limited, judging from your previous posts.

Let me attempt to reveal something about the points being made in regard to the all-knowing nature of God from a modeled perspective.

God is outside of time as He looks upon His creation (all that is). Time is a flawed reality in the following sense. Time is of no consequence or measure to God for He is outside of its restrictions. It is merely a mental construct and concept that we relate and rationalize our finite existence on an eternal plane of infinity.

If time were a circle having no beginning or end you or I (and our lifetime/existence) would be a small dot crossing/bisecting the line of the circle with a definite beginning and end. The smaller the dot…the shorter your life span.

As God (infinite in His divine nature) gazes upon time from a place, position, and perspective outside of it or its confining nature He can see our beginning and end. He can also see all of the choices that one makes during the finite span we refer to as a lifetime. All of our choices are apparent to He who is “I AM”.

But, merely because He sees the outcome before it occurs (from a perspective that we cannot enjoy outside of time) does not mean that He thereby removes our ability to choose good over evil. We stilll have free will and the opportunity to choose right or wrong, good over evil. It is just that He has better seats at the Friday night fight.

God respects your right to choose (free will) good over evil so much that He permits you to have what you want (good or evil). Both have consequences and rewards. Yet, the ability of God to see the grand stage from a perspective that we cannot does not restrict or in any way injure our ability to make a good choice over an abuse of free will (known as sin).

If I were asked if my sister would murder an innocent child for a bucket of mud I would know (in advance) that she was incapable such an act. Yet, my understanding that my sister would not act in such a way prior to the actual event (free will choice) in no way injures her capacity to exercise free will. And I would know that from a far less cognitive and factual position/perspective than that available to God.

Yours in Christ,

Veritashunter

 

[BSHoop96]

Dear Distracted:

To say that God does not know what we will do before we do it is equivalent to saying that God is not God at all. Your concept of the Omnipotent seems somewhat small and limited, judging from your previous posts.

Let me attempt to reveal something about the points being made in regard to the all-knowing nature of God from a modeled perspective.

God is outside of time as He looks upon His creation (all that is). Time is a flawed reality in the following sense. Time is of no consequence or measure to God for He is outside of its restrictions. It is merely a mental construct and concept that we relate and rationalize our finite existence on an eternal plane of infinity.

If time were a circle having no beginning or end you or I (and our lifetime/existence) would be a small dot crossing/bisecting the line of the circle with a definite beginning and end. The smaller the dot…the shorter your life span.

As God (infinite in His divine nature) gazes upon time from a place, position, and perspective outside of it or its confining nature He can see our beginning and end. He can also see all of the choices that one makes during the finite span we refer to as a lifetime. All of our choices are apparent to He who is “I AM”.

But, merely because He sees the outcome before it occurs (from a perspective that we cannot enjoy outside of time) does not mean that He thereby removes our ability to choose good over evil. We stilll have free will and the opportunity to choose right or wrong, good over evil. It is just that He has better seats at the Friday night fight.

God respects your right to choose (free will) good over evil so much that He permits you to have what you want (good or evil). Both have consequences and rewards. Yet, the ability of God to see the grand stage from a perspective that we cannot does not restrict or in any way injure our ability to make a good choice over an abuse of free will (known as sin).

If I were asked if my sister would murder an innocent child for a bucket of mud I would know (in advance) that she was incapable such an act. Yet, my understanding that my sister would not act in such a way prior to the actual event (free will choice) in no way injures her capacity to exercise free will. And I would know that from a far less cognitive and factual position/perspective than that available to God.

Yours in Christ,

Veritashunter

I love the way you explain things.

 

[veritashunter]

***Originally posted by BSHoop96:

“I love the way you explain things.”***

Dear BSHoop96:

Thank you for the compliment. Like many others, I (personally) always do better with a model…something representative. I guess it shows a lack of imagination on my own part.

In high school I loved biology, anatomy, physiology, etc. but I despised chemistry…just numbers to me. Geometry and Algebra were also my favorites, but Trig and Calculus easily eluded my short attention span.

When I offer opinions (too many and too often) I find it easier to relate ideas through comparitive representations. Again, likely due to a lack of imagination and intellect on my part.

Again, thanks for the compliment and God bless.

Allahmaahk (God be with you…in Arabic)!

Yours in Christ,

Veritashunter

 

[BSHoop96]

***Originally posted by BSHoop96:

“I love the way you explain things.”***

Dear BSHoop96:

Thank you for the compliment. Like many others, I (personally) always do better with a model…something representative. I guess it shows a lack of imagination on my own part.

In high school I loved biology, anatomy, physiology, etc. but I despised chemistry…just numbers to me. Geometry and Algebra were also my favorites, but Trig and Calculus easily eluded my short attention span.

When I offer opinions (too many and too often) I find it easier to relate ideas through comparitive representations. Again, likely due to a lack of imagination and intellect on my part.

Again, thanks for the compliment and God bless.

Allahmaahk (God be with you…in Arabic)!

Yours in Christ,

Veritashunter

I know a lot of things that I couldn’t easily explain to someone else. Teaching (explaining) is a gift!

 

[thirdn6]

I would like to know if you think priests should be allowed to marry and still stay in the priesthood… If so, Why or why not??

NO! Because if the priest marries an adulterous woman he’d be just giving absolutions all the days of his life!

Well???

 

[cyberwolf001]

NO! Because if the priest marries an adulterous woman he’d be just giving absolutions all the days of his life!

Well???

Wouldn’t it also be bad with the laity married an adulterous woman?

 

[distracted]

**
Distracted…you did say this. I just read it in your post. Sometimes when someone brings up something you said and it’s worded slightly different .**

slightly different??

No, you are the one who does not comprehend my words…

I control my sexual urges quite well…

No, actually that’s not true… Jesus controls them for me… Jesus and Consequences…

 

[distracted]

Distracted may say this is illogical but it makes perfect sense to me!

and that’s all that matters, huh? subjective truth… ?

 

[distracted]

you think just because God knows what choices we are going to make, that some how takes our choices off of us. . look at job, he let the devil do whatever he wanted to job, but the devil could not take away jobs free will.

you just lost your argument… Why would God sic the devil on Job unless he was trying to test him… and in a recent daily Mass reading, it talks about how God tries the just… Why would He “need” to do that if He already knew what choices we were going to make?

because God knows the difference between the sheep and goats.

a goat can become a sheep any time it decides to… and vice versa…

 

[distracted]

Dear Distracted:

To say that God does not know what we will do before we do it is equivalent to saying that God is not God at all. r

says who? You? Sorry, but i don’t get my theology from human beings…

It does not take away from God that He gave us free will… He GAVE it to us… Gave… meaning He gave up His will to control us…

 

[distracted]

. Your concept of the Omnipotent seems somewhat small and limited, judging from your previous posts.

I am not going to continue this discussion with you if you are going to resort to petty insults…

just to make yourself feel better about your position??