Do you think that the average Catholic would care at all about the stuff we talk about in here?

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I think the average CAtholic in the pew (ACIP) is above all, obedient, but obedient to what they have learned from their own pastors and teachers. If they are standing instead of kneeling, holding hands, and then receiving in those same hands, singing doctrinally unsound songs (hymns have all but disappeared), and treating the Church like a basketball arena or social club, they are doing so because they have been instructed From the Pulpit at some point to do so. I think the ACIP patiently accepts and puts into practice the endless and arbitrary tweaking and changes in the Mass that have been pronounced with boring regularity in the last 40 years.

I further opine that for every ACIP who contracepts, is living in a technically invalid second marriage, or involved in some other habitual sin, there is a Catholic who has been advised in the “internal forum” that he or she is justified in so doing. IMO the person who will burn in hell for that is the pastor or teacher who gave the false counsel or teaching. I gather there is an ample supply of millstones in St. Peter’s courtroom.
 
What is an average Catholic? Is that the same as a Cafeteria Catholic, using contraception, choosing what they want to believe, not going to confession, going to mass 2 times a year (except funerals and weddings and baptisms), voting pro-choice?

The reason we discuss these things is because we understand their great worth and importance. Since we recognize the great gift of our Catholitism, we need to share it and get these average Catholics involved also. How do we do that?:confused:
 
Well, I can tell you! I was pretty durn lax and I did Google my way in here a few years ago. I had some question about something, can’t even remember what. CAF was a little nerdy for my taste at the time, but I got hooked after a few visits over a year or so period.
I stumbled across these fora back in April '07. I posted a “hello” at the Meet ‘n’ Greet, a passel of jokes in the joke forum, then disappeared for almost a year. I “rediscovered” CAF back in Feb of this year; I started to slowly wade in on the more serious discussions. Now I’ve had almost 700 posts in 3 months.
I had no idea that communion in the hand was frowned on so harshly, or that the standard Mass was considered so bad. This forum has been a real eye opener for me, not in an entirely positive way. The fervent zeal seems to cross the line into anger and intolerance frequently here.
Agreed. Enough so that I have made a few angry rejoinders to some of the “catholicker-than-thou” posts I’ve seen. I was driven to tears once over constant bashing of the NO Mass. I’ve seen posts here that have stated that it is a mortal sin to not own a gun; that men who wear a pink shirt or who cry at funerals (or for any reason) or do “women’s work” are failing in their duties as Christian men and are contributing to the horrible state of the Church and the world; etc. I’ve even seen one thread started by someone who who was scandalized by pictures of St Teresa of Lisieux acting in a play or wearing “immodest” clothing (a picture of her as a youth before she entered the convent, in garb typical of her day, i.e. extremely conservative).
[Catholics] do not seem to have knowledge of the basics. … I wonder how often they go to confession before receiving the true body and blood of Christ.
That was a mea culpa of mine before I came here. I had been an irregular attendee at Mass, received Communion while not in a state of Grace :eek: , and sufficed with a yearly General Reconciliation (a liturgical abuse, I found out later; also with the onus on the recipient to still make a good and proper confession later). Now I realize (thanks to these boards) that I don’t need to receive Eucharist every day – it’s only required once a year – and that it’s more necessary to receive frequent reconciliation than frequent Communion.
No, and I think a lot of them are much better off. They go to Mass, the receive our Lord in communion, and they are happy.

Many of the people here get so tied up in knots over trivial matters that they lose sight of what really matters. And instead of walking out of Mass happy – like those average Catholics – they walk out angry and upset.

Who is better off?
Reminds me of Paul’s letter to the Romans: ‘Indeed I would not have known what sin was except through the law. For I would not have known what coveting really was if the law had not said, “Do not covet.”’

The problem is the slippery slope/thin edge of the wedge: What is trivial might lead to something less trivial, and so on, until finally what is left is not a Mass at all: one can run the danger of invalidity if one starts straying too far from the rubrics. While wearing a clown nose may not invalidate the consecration, omitting or changing the words will.
There is some pretty weird stuff said on here, but most of it seems pretty balanced to me. Sometimes when I think some thread is nothing but a bunch of angry wackos, it seems somebody with a good head comes along and says something wise.
Lord knows I try. :rolleyes: 😃
The one thing I regret is that CAF seems to be increasingly assailed by political or theological idologues who come in here in attack mode with all sorts of prepared “sources” and try to persuade people that Catholics should vote pro-choice or that the Catholic Church is the devil’s own club. I shudder to think what some of the less firm Catholics I know would think of some of that. I’m not a moderator, but if I was, I think I would shut down a lot more threads than do get shut down, and for that reason.
I agree here as well. Right now there’s a thread about a group called the BNP; some call it a cult, it’s been banned in a number of diocese in the US and the Philippines, but it has it’s own apologists on the boards saying “give it a chance”, “keep an open mind”, “Padre Pio/Mother Teresa were under interdict too”, etc. Until the standing of some groups within the church is clarified, we should be extremely careful. It’s easier to ignore (IMO) error when it comes from without; but when it comes from within, it is especially dangerous.
Before I came to this website, I had no idea that there was any kind of controversy surrounding the Latin Mass, Communion in the hand, veiling, modest dress, and especially the music.
Same here. I have found that the more I explore my faith, the more conservative I become in many areas. I will now be receiving on the tongue, not because in the hand is “wrong”, but that the arguments I have read for on the tongue are, to me, “better”.

I really don’t have anyone to discuss this with. I have few friends – I am not the most gregarious person around, it takes me a long time to make acquaintances, let alone friends – and none of them are Catholic. 😦 I guess that’s why I spend so much time on the boards (too much, actually); it’s like wandering the desert and finding a juice bar.
 
No, and I think a lot of them are much better off. They go to Mass, the receive our Lord in communion, and they are happy.

Many of the people here get so tied up in knots over trivial matters that they lose sight of what really matters. And instead of walking out of Mass happy – like those average Catholics – they walk out angry and upset.

Who is better off?
I agree… knowledge can be a blessing and a burden. :o

Lack of knowledge certainly isn’t bad either. The innocence and simplicity of childhood are treasured by our Lord… and that kind of pure, simplistic love is sometimes greater.

Tough call. 🤷
 
I think the average Catholic may be ignorant of the specific issues, but they know an irreverent liturgy when they see it. They know banal music, they know abuses, they know bad preaching.

The difference is, they vote with their feet; either attending Mass less frequently, or leaving the Church.

That’s why it’s so important to go back to a reverent Mass, solid doctrine (WITH EXPLANATION), etc.

God Bless
 
The average American Catholic doesn’t even know that CAF exist, never mind know what the GIRM is.

Unfortunately, they know more about American Idol than their religion.

People can gripe about the nuns of the old days, but one thing they did and did well is, teach us about our faith.

I owe much of what I learned about the Catholic faith, to them. Sure, it was just the surface level of doctrines and traditions, but it gave me the basics on what to look for in order to go deeper in knowledge and understanding.

God bless the good sisters, who taught me!

Jim
 
That’s true about people knowing more about what goes on on TV while remaining ignorant about their Catholic faith.
 
I think the average CAtholic in the pew (ACIP) is above all, obedient, but obedient to what they have learned from their own pastors and teachers. **If they are standing instead of kneeling, holding hands, and then receiving in those same hands, singing doctrinally unsound songs **(hymns have all but disappeared), and treating the Church like a basketball arena or social club, they are doing so because they have been instructed From the Pulpit at some point to do so. I think the ACIP patiently accepts and puts into practice the endless and arbitrary tweaking and changes in the Mass that have been pronounced with boring regularity in the last 40 years.

I further opine that for every ACIP who contracepts, is living in a technically invalid second marriage, or involved in some other habitual sin, there is a Catholic who has been advised in the “internal forum” that he or she is justified in so doing. IMO the person who will burn in hell for that is the pastor or teacher who gave the false counsel or teaching. I gather there is an ample supply of millstones in St. Peter’s courtroom.
Nothing wrong with standing, holding hands or many of the songs vilified on these forums. It’s those erroneous sorta comments that cause the glazing-over of the eyes of those we are talking about.
 
As for me, and I feel many others in my generation (those who grew up in the 70’s and 80’s) weren’t really brought into the faith as well as the generations before us. I personally think that many of parents and teachers were learning how to deal with the changes brought about by Vatican II so they just didn’t know exactly what to teach us. That’s just a gut feeling. The one thing that did happen, was a mustard seed was planted in my soul. Just took a while to sprout.

I was definitely one who just attended because of my parents. As soon as I got a driver’s license, I rarely attended. I never understood the Mass and when I did attend, it was spent day dreaming or clock watching. Over the years, I’ve encountered numerous non-Catholics trying to convert me and/or tell me the Catholic Church was wrong. While I might not have been practicing, I still considered myself Catholic and didn’t like anyone disparaging the faith. From that point on, I wanted to learn more about my faith, but didn’t really know where to start.

Thanks to my GF, over the past 3 years, I’ve found so many resources and learned so much and have come back to a fully practicing Catholic. I really think that many of my generation are your cafeteria Catholics or Christmas and Easter folks, but they want to know more and just don’t know where to go.

The Catechism is a wonderful tool, but not for an average Catholic…at first. Those who don’t know much, need to be fed a little at a time. Give them time to comprehend, accept and finally adopt what they’ve been given. Then give them more. There were aspects of my life that were wrong, but I wasn’t ready to face them in the “light”. Gradually, with the more knowledge I had, the more I gave myself to the Holy Spirit and I was willing to start acknowledging some of those aspects. Soon after, I accepted them as wrong and then after that changed my lifestyle to be more in tune with the CC. I’m by no means perfect and I still have so much farther to go, but I intend on getting there.

The mustard seed analogy really works well for those wanting to join the faith or those wanted to re-join. When you plant the mustard seed, you have to water it, but you only give a little at first. Too much and it will kill it. As it starts to grow, you give it more water. When it becomes a hardy bush, it can accept much more water and in fact needs much more water than it did as a mere seed. Hopefully that makes sense. It does in my head but that is no good measure 😃
 
I don’t think there is such a thing as an “average Catholic.”:twocents:
 
Nothing wrong with standing, holding hands or many of the songs vilified on these forums. It’s those erroneous sorta comments that cause the glazing-over of the eyes of those we are talking about.
Well, the truth is that hand holding and other liturgical abuses have never been authorized for mass. And, since our faith is supposed to be about obedience, I choose to be obedient. That’s all.

Christ’s peace.
 
Good posts all. As for me, although I am a cradle Catholic with 12 years of Catholic education behind me, I am very much a work in progress. Although not always a saint (or alway trying to be one), I always stuck close to Sunday mass and most of the times, confession. A wife and 2 kids later, much more faithful and thankful to be able to interact with all of you on these forums…
 
I am a new Catholic and new to this forum.

What does GIRM mean? I did a search but didn’t find an answer.
 
Well I’m a 15yr old that knows almost nothing about the faith. I get a lot of info on here.
 
I am a new Catholic and new to this forum.

What does GIRM mean? I did a search but didn’t find an answer.
This right from the Catholic Answers site: (How the) “Mass is celebrated is the General Instruction of the Roman Missal. It contains basic directives instructing priests and other ministers in how the Mass is to be celebrated. The previous edition of the GIRM was released in 1975, but in 2000 Pope John Paul II released a new edition, which was slightly modified in 2002.”

More details can be found on that site…It’s the official way in which the Mass should be celebrated. IE, taking communion, when to kneel, stand, ect…
 
I’ve been hearing many younger Catholics complain that they feel, they were short changed in their formation, compared to older Catholics. They often blame it on Vatican II, but as I said earlier, we older Catholics who went to Catholic School, had nuns who provided us with most of our formation. Most was good, some was bordered fanaticism. It depended on the religious order who taught you.

I have a devote Catholic friend who is my age, but went to public school and CCD. When he returned to the Church about 12 years ago, he was no more knowledgeable about doctrine, or the saints, than young people today are.

Jim
 
Thanks Simon for your reply.

I am very lucky because my priest is very serious about the liturgy.

We also, even though we are a small parish, have Latin mass every Sunday.
 
Hello to all. I just register today and got interested on the different issues on this site. I want to respond on the question; “Do you think that the average Catholic would care at all about the stuff we talk about here?”

I think the question should be: Would we who have given the chance to know more about Catholicism through this forum be generous and care enough to let others know about the stuff we talk in here? If we could respond on this question positively, then those others would care enough too and this would be open to the world.

God bless to all.

Geronimo123:)
 
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