Do you think that the church will ever accept gay marriage?

[hellopeople]

That is a mistranslation of the Greek, I believe. The Greek, I believe, means incest and not adultery. Jesus was settling a dispute between two different groups of Jews: one believed divorce was ok in most circumstances and the other said only in the case of adultery. If Jesus was merely affirming that divorce was ok in adultery, the astonishment of the people that listened to Jesus proclaim it wouldnt be logical since Jesus would have been confirming something that was already a common position to take. His condemnation of divorce goes beyond adultery. The translation should be changed to reflect the Greek better.

Can you find me any translations that reflect this?

 

[hellopeople]

The Church has not the authority to accept homosexual ‘marriage,’ any more than it can make women into priests. Are you able to understand this?

The day it does, is the day we see the true Anti-Christ.

lol, Women priests = the anti christ

 

[hellopeople]

I suspect that the official line of the Church will not change but that it will be de-emphasised compared to the current situation.

The Church does not recognise divorce yet it does not make a great deal of public fuss about divorce or about divorced people remarrying and so forth. I suspect that the Church will eventually adopt the same sort of position with Gay Marriage. She will not recognise Gay Marriages and will not allow them in a Catholic Church but will de facto recognise that some couples will be effectively married even if they are not married de jure under Church Law.

This is as with civil divorces and remarriages, they are recognised de facto but not de jure.

$0.02

rossum

This is pretty much my opinion. The church likely won’t have gay marriages, but they won’t be actively speaking out against them.

 

[hellopeople]

So as a Buddhist, you are an expert on what the Catholic Church will do? Whether it’s your two cents or not, if your prediction comes true, we may very well be in the end times.

Do you read revelations with a flashlight in the dark?

 

[hellopeople]

You have stated over and over that you reject the 10 Commandments - the whole “thou shalt not murder” thing, I’d imagine if Jesus spoke to you in an audible voice you’d laugh it off.

Are you talking about my stance on abortion?

 

[kage_ar]

Are you talking about my stance on abortion?

Yes, I am.

 

[mark_a]

To be honest, with the way society is going, I think they will eventually accept gay marriage. The new generation is taught that everyone is equal including different races, sexes, and people of different sexualities. This is the message that is being taught to our young, and before long the church is going to lose significant numbers of people if they don’t change their views. Even now, the church gets a bad rap for being anti-homosexual. In 20 years it will be much worse. I predict that the church will keep their teachings on abortion, but will ease up on gay marriage.

When this happens we’ll know that the Muslims, Protestants, Mormons, JW’s, etc., etc. were correct about their teachings about the Catholic Church.

If the Church didn’t cave under enormous internal pressure on the contraception issue, gay marriage is a no brainer.

I believe that within the next 25 years, the church will, at the least, stop their fight against same sex marriage at a secular and government level.

Please feel free to pm me if you want to put your money where your mouth is.

 

[Palaeologos]

To be honest, with the way society is going, I think they will eventually accept gay marriage. The new generation is taught that everyone is equal including different races, sexes, and people of different sexualities. This is the message that is being taught to our young, and before long the church is going to lose significant numbers of people if they don’t change their views. Even now, the church gets a bad rap for being anti-homosexual. In 20 years it will be much worse. I predict that the church will keep their teachings on abortion, but will ease up on gay marriage. I believe that within the next 25 years, the church will, at the least, stop their fight against same sex marriage at a secular and government level.

If it does, it will no longer be the Church.

 

[camerong]

To be honest, with the way society is going, I think they will eventually accept gay marriage. The new generation is taught that everyone is equal including different races, sexes, and people of different sexualities. This is the message that is being taught to our young, and before long the church is going to lose significant numbers of people if they don’t change their views. Even now, the church gets a bad rap for being anti-homosexual. In 20 years it will be much worse. I predict that the church will keep their teachings on abortion, but will ease up on gay marriage. I believe that within the next 25 years, the church will, at the least, stop their fight against same sex marriage at a secular and government level.

People probably said the same thing about any number of issues. When contraception became widely available, I’m sure everyone said the Church would one day accept that. When abortion became legal, I’m sure at least some people said that it was an unstoppable force and that soon everyone, the Church included, would recognize a woman’s “right” to kill her offspring.

You think the Church is getting a “bad rap” for being anti-homosexual (a true statement, no doubt)? The Church got much worse of a rap and many times throughout history. To my knowledge, no Catholics have been torn apart by wild animals in Roman Colosseums over gay marriage. We have withstood that, we will withstand much more for our beliefs. Not because we are strong in our selves, but because we are infinitely strong in Christ.

 

[Seatuck]

To be honest, with the way society is going, I think they will eventually accept gay marriage. The new generation is taught that everyone is equal including different races, sexes, and people of different sexualities. This is the message that is being taught to our young, and before long the church is going to lose significant numbers of people if they don’t change their views. Even now, the church gets a bad rap for being anti-homosexual. In 20 years it will be much worse. I predict that the church will keep their teachings on abortion, but will ease up on gay marriage. I believe that within the next 25 years, the church will, at the least, stop their fight against same sex marriage at a secular and government level.

Then you still don’t know much about the Catholic Church and what she teaches about Sacraments especially the Sacrament of Marriage despite hanging out on this board. These teachings are unchangeable. Just like women priests will never happen either. No matter what the populace says. We are not relativists. We don’t take votes and do what is popular. We would be sad to lose people but that is what may happen. We can’t change the faith to prevent it. Just keep teaching the truth and pray that the Holy Spirit touches hearts.

 

[SugarMagnolia]

I suspect that the official line of the Church will not change but that it will be de-emphasised compared to the current situation.

The Church does not recognise divorce yet it does not make a great deal of public fuss about divorce or about divorced people remarrying and so forth. I suspect that the Church will eventually adopt the same sort of position with Gay Marriage. She will not recognise Gay Marriages and will not allow them in a Catholic Church but will de facto recognise that some couples will be effectively married even if they are not married de jure under Church Law.

This is as with civil divorces and remarriages, they are recognised de facto but not de jure.

$0.02

rossum

Gay marriage is a unique issue–unlike contraception, abortion, and divorce. Contraception and abortion are private matters. People can be using them, but no one else knows, so it’s not in everyone else’s face. This is true of divorce as well. You can’t tell just by looking at a couple that one or both of them was previously divorced. Gay marriage, however, is very obvious and public. When you go to church you’re going to see the gay couple as a gay couple. So the church can be against contraception, abortion and divorce all the while knowing that lots of people ignore these prohibitions because violations are not in the public eye. But the church is going to have a hard time being against gay marriage with gay couples being openly gay in church.

 

[SugarMagnolia]

The Church is against “gay marriage” because the homosexual act goes against the natural law and against God’s word. The civil issue of gay marriage is outside of the Church in the sense that the Church does not have any legal authority. But the Church is very clear that gay marriage is a moral issue and not only a civil issue.
Your statement about the Church not being “anti-homosexual” should probably be made more clear. The Churches stand is that you hate the sin and love the sinner. Of course we are all sinners.
I do not think the Churches stance on gay marriage will change. For this to happen, the reason or purpose for marriage would have to change. Marriage is for unity AND procreation. Marriage and all Sacraments are a physical manifestation of a spiritual reality. The love of a husband and wife in marriage is a reflection of the love between the Father and the Son in the Trinity. It is through that love (that children are born and a soul is created) that brings forth the Holy Spirit. That is something that gay marriage cannot provide. This is also one of the reasons that the Church asks, in the Marriage ceremony, if both the man and woman are open to children if it is God’s will.

For this to happen, the reason or purpose for marriage would have to change. Marriage is for unity AND procreation. Marriage and all Sacraments are a physical manifestation of a spiritual reality.

If the church is going to successfully fight against gay marraige, this is going to have to change. It’s a bad argument. There are plenty of infertile people that the church allows to marry, so procreation is not necessary for marriage. A better position is to focus on the unnaturalness of the couple itself. If coitus is the requirement for marriage, rather than procreation, then homosexuals couldn’t marry but infertile heterosexuals could.

 

[AngelaB39]

No.

I really am torn on this issue as I have gay friends in committed relationships and believe they deserve the benefits of marriage as much as anyone else.

I believe that gay civil marriage nationwide in the U.S. will happen, but I just don’t see the Catholic Church tampering with the sacrament of marriage to allow gay couples to participate in it. I just don’t.

 

[Janet1983]

To be honest, with the way society is going, I think they will eventually accept gay marriage. The new generation is taught that everyone is equal including different races, sexes, and people of different sexualities. This is the message that is being taught to our young, and before long the church is going to lose significant numbers of people if they don’t change their views. Even now, the church gets a bad rap for being anti-homosexual. In 20 years it will be much worse. I predict that the church will keep their teachings on abortion, but will ease up on gay marriage. I believe that within the next 25 years, the church will, at the least, stop their fight against same sex marriage at a secular and government level.

I don’t think so.
The Catholic Church will never accept gay marriage. Period. The reasons? Well let’s see…

[BIBLEDRB]Leviticus 18:22[/BIBLEDRB]

[BIBLEDRB]Leviticus 20:13[/BIBLEDRB]

[BIBLEDRB]Romans 1:26-27[/BIBLEDRB]

[BIBLEDRB]1 Corinthians 6:9-10[/BIBLEDRB]
For clarification here the New American Bible as found on vatican.va:
“Do you not know that the unjust will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators nor idolaters nor adulterers nor boy prostitutes nor practicing homosexuals nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God.”

[BIBLEDRB]1 Timothy 1:9-10[/BIBLEDRB]
For clarification here the New American Bible as found on vatican.va:
“with the understanding that law is meant not for a righteous person but for the lawless and unruly, the godless and sinful, the unholy and profane, those who kill their fathers or mothers, murderers, the unchaste, practicing homosexuals, kidnapers, liars, perjurers, and whatever else is opposed to sound teaching,”

[BIBLEDRB]Jude 1:7[/BIBLEDRB]

Well and then there is of course
[BIBLEDRB]Genesis 19[/BIBLEDRB]

 

[baylee]

I admit I have not read every post here, but the ones I have skimmed… it doesn’t appear that anyone is saying that the Church will change its* teachings* on homosexuality. It also doesn’t appear that anyone is saying that you will see gay marriage in the Catholic Church (ie. the Sacrament).

I think what many are saying is that once gay marriage becomes legal in the US (and I do think that will happen eventually), the Church will not be as vocal about it (simply because it will no longer be trying to keep it illegal). I do not see the Church actively seeking to make it illegal again as it does with abortion.

 

[Newbie2]

To be honest, with the way society is going, I think they will eventually accept gay marriage. The new generation is taught that everyone is equal including different races, sexes, and people of different sexualities. This is the message that is being taught to our young, and before long the church is going to lose significant numbers of people if they don’t change their views. Even now, the church gets a bad rap for being anti-homosexual. In 20 years it will be much worse. I predict that the church will keep their teachings on abortion, but will ease up on gay marriage. I believe that within the next 25 years, the church will, at the least, stop their fight against same sex marriage at a secular and government level.

LOL. You don’t know very much about the Roman Catholic Church, do you?

I think the gay marriage issue is a human rights issue and the majority of the children being born now will either be for gay marriage or labeled a bigot and a homophobe. I think the church will change their stance on it.

Change so as not to be called names? LOL You don’t know very much about the Roman Catholic Church, do you?

Well if you can show me where Jesus condemns gays in the gospels I would agree with you.

If you go strictly on what Jesus is reported to have said i.e. just in the Gospels, you’re ignoring much of what else in is Scripture. See Janet’s post.

The church has been wrong before. The church’s history is far from perfect. If the church is wrong does that mean that the devil prevailed?

Wrong how so?

This is pretty much my opinion. The church likely won’t have gay marriages, but they won’t be actively speaking out against them.

And pretty much everyone disagrees with you. Kudos, though, for making it clear that it’s merely your opinion.

 

[Ender]

I really am torn on this issue as I have gay friends in committed relationships and believe they deserve the benefits of marriage as much as anyone else.

Lincoln supposedly once asked: “If you called a tail a leg, would a dog have five legs?” He then answered with: “No. Calling it something else doesn’t change what it is.” (paraphrase) The same point applies to “gay marriage.” Given that a marriage is the union of one man with one woman it is no more possible for gays to marry than for a dog to have five legs. There may very well be some kind of legal incorporation specifying a unique set of rights between two (or more) people, but don’t confuse that with marriage … and don’t expect that the Church will ever recognize it as such.

Ender

 

[hellopeople]

Wrong how so?

And pretty much everyone disagrees with you. Kudos, though, for making it clear that it’s merely your opinion.

The church has made MANY wrong decisions. I could talk about recently trying to cover up the sex scandal and worrying more about the reputation of the church than molested children. Or I could talk about the inquisition or the crusades or the sale of indulgences or all sorts of things that have not been very Christ like in the Church’s history.

As for everyone disagreeing with me, that is fine. But I have feeling that the great majority of the people disagreeing me are older and do not know the type of education children are getting today. Even in my Catholic school homosexuality was a non issue. This was in the 90’s too…the world is far more tolerant of homosexuality than it was 15 years ago and it will continue to be that way. The church will put this issue on the back burner within the next 10 years, I guarantee it.

Let me just say that there were 2 lesbian couples at my Catholic grammar school: 2 teachers, and the principle and the guidance counselor. They were very well liked and one of them was one of the best teachers I ever had.

 

[hellopeople]

Lincoln supposedly once asked: “If you called a tail a leg, would a dog have five legs?” He then answered with: “No. Calling it something else doesn’t change what it is.” (paraphrase) The same point applies to “gay marriage.” Given that a marriage is the union of one man with one woman it is no more possible for gays to marry than for a dog to have five legs. There may very well be some kind of legal incorporation specifying a unique set of rights between two (or more) people, but don’t confuse that with marriage … and don’t expect that the Church will ever recognize it as such.

Ender

You are the one that is making the definition of marriage a man and a woman.

 

[Newbie2]

The church has made MANY wrong decisions. I could talk about recently trying to cover up the sex scandal and worrying more about the reputation of the church than molested children. Or I could talk about the inquisition or the crusades or the sale of indulgences or all sorts of things that have not been very Christ like in the Church’s history.

.

I think you’re confusing the “wrong decisions” or sinfulness, if you will, of individuals within the Church with decisions made by the Church herself.