Do you think that the Novus Ordo will ever be abolished?

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BobP123 said:
…The NO is not just about the liturgy. It’s a new mindset to what constitutes Catholicism. It’s a relaxation of many of the rules prior to Vatican II and how do you go back to making it tougher to be a Catholic? After a couple of generation gaps, the TLM now takes an effort and asks people to go outside their comfort levels. Why should anyone go way out of their way at an inconvenient hour and learn a new language **just to get to ridiculed for it by their own pastor and friends? **Tough, but I’ll give a lot of credit to those that try it for the greater glory of God.
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Most of the carping I see here and in person is being done by traditionally-minded Catholics not “NO” (sic) Catholics.
 
Daprato said:
Most of the carping I see here and in person is being done by traditionally-minded Catholics not “NO” (sic) Catholics.
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This post is a perfect example of how trads are always getting slammed by non trads who just can’t stay away from the TC forum.

Believe me, the “carping” exists on the other forums. That’s why I don’t visit them.
 
BobP123 said:
The NO is not just about the liturgy. It’s a new mindset to what constitutes Catholicism. It’s a relaxation of many of the rules prior to Vatican II and how do you go back to making it tougher to be a Catholic? After a couple of generation gaps, the TLM now takes an effort and asks people to go outside their comfort levels. Why should anyone go way out of their way at an inconvenient hour and learn a new language just to get to ridiculed for it by their own pastor and friends? Tough, but I’ll give a lot of credit to those that try it for the greater glory of God.
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Very true, Bob! 👍
 
BobP123 said:
however many of those Catholics (most of whom don’t attend Mass of any kind) don’t think it’s grave enough to be mortal.
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That is not for the laity to decide. The magisterium has stated that chemical/barrier birth control is a mortal sin. NFP can be used, but only under specific and limited circumstances.
It is the Catholic belief that the magisterium is guided by the Holy Spirit and cannot make a mistake in moral theological teaching. If we are not obedient to the magisterium then why be Catholic. Why not just one of the 10,000 protestant faith communities to suits US best.
 
paramedicgirl said:
I’m of the opinion that the Holy Spirit is the driving force behind the youth’s interest and attraction to the Tridentine Mass. It is not a fad. …
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Careful, you will scare the heck out of those who prefer a more user friendly Mass. 😃

Seriously though, it’s amazing how the NO folks come here and point fingers at the Traditionalists. "How dare they question, and refuse to embrace, the Pauline Mass ? "

The fact is, some Catholics, both laity and Clergy, see the Catholic Faith as a beautiful Faith. The TLM defines this Faith and leaves no doubt as to where the Church stands on doctrine. Do those who dread it’s return even give a thought to why it was embraced for so long ?

The ommisions and changes in wording of some of the prayers leave the NO vulnerable. Add the abuses that have crept in via the ambiguous text of the VII SC, and we are left with a Mass that never settles into a universal form. Go to five Masses at five different parishes in any large city and see the difference in each.

Is the Consecration valid in each ? Of course. But is that the only redeeming quality we should consider ? Hardly.

Again, the Catholic faith is a beautiful Faith. Sadly, it is a rare occasion to find an NO that represents it.

I have not said anything new here. It’s all been said before. But it bears repeating, because there are so many who just don’t get it.
Traditionalists are not going to die off. And neither is the TLM.
It’s making a comeback and will continue as the word is spread that it is not required to obtain an indult.

on topic…
Will the NO be abolished ? I don’t think so. I do believe that, in time, Rome will take a hard look at it and reform it.
 
Daprato said:
Most of the carping I see here and in person is being done by traditionally-minded Catholics not “NO” (sic) Catholics.
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I see it that way too. But then I put all the trad bashers who have no point to make on ignore. And that list is getting longer and longer.

You may try the same for NO bashers and we’ll all get along fine.
 
I thought that it was against the rules of Catholic Answers for people to call each other “trads” and “non-trads.” I thought this kind of name-calling was forbidden.

:confused:

This thread, IMO, has turned into an “us vs. them” thing.

One more question–those of you who consider yourself “traditionalists”–do you WANT those of us who disagree with you to just stay out of your section of the Board? That’s the impression I received from one of the posts above.
 
Someone mentioned all organ music, with no other instruments.

Isn’t going to happen, folks.

Our choral union (ecumenical, but mainly Lutheran), which is doing the Messiah next weekend, lost our organist this week (she broke her arm). Thankfully, we found another one, but it was a major miracle, and the hunt would be worthy of another Indiana Jones movie. Organists, even the variety that play the Wurlitzer “fun organ” with one finger, are about as rare as gold in the U.S.

Or do you have “clone factory” somewhere in the world where you’re storing all the organists?!
 
Cat said:
Someone mentioned all organ music, with no other instruments.

Isn’t going to happen, folks.

Our choral union (ecumenical, but mainly Lutheran), which is doing the Messiah next weekend, lost our organist this week (she broke her arm). Thankfully, we found another one, but it was a major miracle, and the hunt would be worthy of another Indiana Jones movie. Organists, even the variety that play the Wurlitzer “fun organ” with one finger, are about as rare as gold in the U.S.

Or do you have “clone factory” somewhere in the world where you’re storing all the organists?!
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You are underestimating the power of the Holy Spirit. If God wants organ music as the sole accompaniment to the choir, He will find a way for it to happen.
 
Cat said:
This thread, IMO, has turned into an “us vs. them” thing.
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I think that has been a common theme since this forum has been started and I knew and stated something to that effect when this forum was started.

From the beginning, there has been a group that has been, albeit erroneously, that the Church has been trying to suppress the Extraordinary Form of the Mass.

However, it seen perfectly acceptable by this same group to try to suppress the Ordinary Form of the Mass and get rid of anyone who does not believe in such (including priests and Bishops).

Maybe a thread about abolishing this sub-forum is needed. :rolleyes:
 
Cat said:
Someone mentioned all organ music, with no other instruments.
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That is the way my parish does it except for the occasional Orchestral Mass (i.e. Violins, woodwinds, and other instruments associated with classical music). This is true for both the Ordinary and Extraordinary forms of the Mass (we have both).
 
Dauphin said:
The NO won’t so much be abolished as it will gradually fade. Confronted with the true liturgy of the ages, no recent human invention can last long. Within two generations, this watered-down Mass will be gone. The good elements of the NO will linger on, though, to be integrated into the liturgy of the ages.
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I hope and I suspect that you are correct. The abuses and watered down versions of the mass were not invented by VCII but sadly they came about nonetheless.

Without Polyphony or the Gregorian Chant the Church will continue to hobble along. These still exist in some places. I hope the Romans bring back the Gregorian Chant and throw out the instruments.

CDL
 
paramedicgirl said:
You are underestimating the power of the Holy Spirit. If God wants organ music as the sole accompaniment to the choir, He will find a way for it to happen.
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If not, we are always free to attend organ recitals at concert halls and in the churches of other Christian denominations. No one can force anyone else to listen to piano or guitar music in Church if they don’t want it.
 
WanderAimlessly said:
In responding to “This thread, IMO, has turned into an “us vs. them” thing.”

I think that has been a common theme since this forum has been started and I knew and stated something to that effect when this forum was started.
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Well, I see a lot of such themes across all subfora and it looks like over 40,000 of “them” posts from one poster alone more than surpass the sum of all the “us” posts put together. 😃
From the beginning, there has been a group that has been, albeit erroneously, that the Church has been trying to suppress the Extraordinary Form of the Mass.
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Actually this has been happening since 1962.
However, it seen perfectly acceptable by this same group to try to suppress the Ordinary Form of the Mass and get rid of anyone who does not believe in such (including priests and Bishops).
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Really? How many more need the Church excommunicate before you realize it’s not acceptable to bash the NO?
Maybe a thread about abolishing this sub-forum is needed. :rolleyes:
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Maybe include other sub-fora as well where you can’t find anyone to agree with you.
 
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