Docs only treat symptoms, not causes

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Thyroid test? Not a chance. All they did to diagnose hypoglycemia for me was the oral glucose tolerance test, which I’ve since found on WebMD that it’s not a reliable test. I had to beg to see a dietitian so I could have a clue as to what to do differently with my diet, and even then, I had to pay out of pocket for the dietitian–insurance wouldn’t cover it. And wabrams, you get to eat fruit? I can only do that if I eat something else with it (i.e., apple and peanut butter). Fruit juice is completely out of the question.

So to get back on topic, in my case, they barely attempted to treat my symptoms, much less look for a cause.
 
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djrakowski:
This reminds me, in a way, of something our pediatrician once said, and I’m still troubled by his mentality. Last winter, we took all three of our children (at the time, age 4.5, 3.5 and 2) with high fevers and other less pleasant symptoms (I’ll spare you the gory details). The conclusion was that they all had a virus, possibly flu. Then, he said, “But I feel that I must give you something, so here’s a prescription.” It was an antibiotic for a virus!

I think they’ve been bombarded with messages from the pharmaceutical companies, and often resort to medication as a first response, rather than a last resort. For that reason they’ll either mock the natural/nutritional/holistic approaches, or tell you that you’re putting yourself in danger. Those who’ve healed themselves of serious, supposedly lifelong illnesses with natural methods (like my wife) beg to differ, of course.
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Actually, in most cases, they’ve been bombarded with so much insistence from every patient they’ve seen who has read this or that on the internet (ever wonder why they don’t teach medical school using only internet-available references?), and who vehemently demand, as their God-given RIGHT, antibiotics for everything from the common cold (also viral) to hemorrhoids to hangnails that they’ve developed a knee-jerk reaction to instinctively prescribe to keep folks from leaving their office kicking and screaming.

Actually, your approach is correct, medically. Antibiotics shouldn’t be given for viral infections. Many will just wear themselves out if left alone. Others are treatable with certain antivirals. And giving antibiotics when they are not needed only increases the number of multiple-drug resistant bacteria. Most docs are trying hard to cut way down on their prescribing of antibiotics.

While it’s not good for a doc to succumb to the popular pressure to give antibiotics on demand, it’s a self-preservation tactic that many of 'em have developed over many years of dealing with patients who demand the right to be self-medicating. As far as undue influence is concerned, the biggest danger - by far - that I see today is the terrific amount of prescription drug ads on TV, each of which is aimed at making the patient think he or she is enough of an expert to tell their doc that they need that drug. BOy - t alk about a disaster waiting to happen!

Of course I can’t second-guess the doc, and don’t know what drug he gave or for sure why. But sometimes there are concomitant bacterial and viral infections, with one set of symptoms caused by one and another set of symptoms caused by the other. Also, there are also illnesses that can be caused by either, the symptoms of which are the same or very similar, and the antibiotics may then be given in case it is the bacterial etiology of the symptoms rather than viral.
 
Puzzleanne,

You illustrate exactly my point! The more research I do on the internet suggests all those tests should be run to determine the problem. However, the doctor ran one test, then declared himself done; just treat the symptom with the pill. Why is that the automatic respnose, and not, “well that turned up negative, lets try this test next?” I think most people would be willing to undergo several tests or trips to the lab to find the real problem. I fully understand the “give me a pill or else” menatlity some patients have, but not all people are like that, so doc’s should try to figure out what type they are dealing with first, then go forward. Like I said, if I did that with a machine, I’d get fired. And I make a lot less than a doctor!😃
 
drug companies own the doctors. the doctors prescribe medicine (new USAtoday study finds 40% of adults are on a prescription drug right now!!) because the drug companies control the insurance companies who control the doctors getting paid.

always follow the money.

“no dairy, no meat, fresh clean water, no toxins in food (buy organic), no chemicals, lots of fruits, whole grains, vegetables. no animal products except honey, drink black and green tea, take vitamin supplements. exercise regularly, get proper rest, have a few beers or glasses of wine a week, eat in moderation. avoid trans fatty acids (hydrogentated fats), smile, pray, laugh and love.”
-the chrismysters recipie for a long and happy life​

 
TAS,

All right another Engineer!http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon14.gif

From a fellow engineer, I understand. I once was put on Red Cross’s deffered donor’s list meaning I could no longer give blood because I had elevated ALT levels. (something to do with the liver) So I got checked out at my doctor and they checked the levels again and they were slightly high. They did nothing else but check my levels again a couple months later and when they were low they ceased to look into the problem. I still don’t know why they were high.

Now I design circuits and write software. Like you said, if a bug should pop up once, there was a cause for that happening and I find out exactly why it happened because it means something is broke and not operating the way it should be, which could lead to other problems.

I would continue to press your doctor for explanations and ask if there are any other tests that would help him see a problem.
As as sidenote though, in the defense of the doctors, I don’t think doctors have the same knowledge of how the body works as we do about the things we design and the underlying physics that make them work.
 
You may be interested in the work of Dr. Thomas Hilgers, M.D. He is the founder and director of the Paul VI institute for the Study of Human Reproduction. The focus is on infertility treatment but I know that I’ve read about polycycstic ovaries.[

](http://www.popepaulvi.com/)popepaulvi.com/

www.creightonmodel.com/

His basic premis is that we have a “band-aid” approach to treatment of reproductive disorders (espically women’s). The pill does not cure your problem, it only alleviates the symptoms. It would be great if all doctors would learn this!
 
I was just going to recommend the Paul VI Institute. A friend of mine went there for treatment with extreme endometriosis after she was sick of every other doctor just prescribing her a pill. I also just posted a reply to someone else on this board, talking about how doctors are often required by pharmaceutical companies to push their products to patients. I don’t know if it would help in this situation or not, but you might talk with your doctor about using progesterone cream. It provides basically what the pill does, but without the side effects or pregnancy prevention. Also, I have had great experience going to see a certified nurse midwife (CNM) instead of an actual OB/GYN. Maybe it’s just my specific CNM, but she’s been great about getting me info on nfp when she found out that’s what we were using, getting me an alternative to the pill for endometriosis and extreme cramps, and in general she’s been much more patient-oriented and less of the “push pills at you and leave” mentality you were talking about. Also, you can search for nfp-only doctors on omsoul.org, I think. It’s Janet Smith’s organization called “One More Soul”. If that’s not the right site, just google for it. Best wishes!
 
Don’t just blame the drs here either.

If you’re not satisfied with your care, go somewhere else. I won’t go to a specialist if they won’t answer all of my questions, and take their time.
 
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aimee:
Try a dr in holistic medicine…
I think they sometimes call them drs in preventive medicine…or hey you could try a chiropracter (sp?)
I know ,I know some think they can be quacks…but you could try it …I know in some cases it works.
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I was glad to see you post this - I was afraid to! 😃

My husband is a chiropractor. He’s gotten good results with women with certain gynecological problems (irregular periods), and other chronic syndromes. It’s amazing to see the results with asthmatic kids!
 
Lizziebeth,

I have to disagree. You could spend your life time switching dr’s, and still not get anywhere. The blame for this particular complaint can be laid squarely on them. If I as a patient go in with a complaint, I am paying the doctor for his expertise in a field I know nothing about to lead me. HE/SHE should be suggesting the course and path to take, what tests to run, etc. I CAN’T KNOW WHAT I NEED, THAT IS THE DOC’S JOB. I am paying for this person to lead the way. But they routinely do not even try to figure out root causes. It is an industry wide attitude that must be changed, and that is the topic here, not specifically my condition. (Though I appreciate the help from all who have offered it.) Yes, I can try to change doctors, aside from the fact that most insurance companies don’t let you do that more than once a year. But there seem to be very few who actually step outside the pack and really treat the problems, not the symptoms. As I said before, this guy is a good sort, and would probably try to look into whatever tests is asked for, but how can the average person know what to ask for ahead of time? Isn’t that what we are paying the doctor for? He takes time to answer questions, but how do I know what to ask? I am not a doctor!
 
To the original poster: You need to change doctors. Talk to your friends and find out if they have one they like.

But also, have you tried having a frank talk with your doctor to let him/her know your concerns? S/he may have no idea that your unhappy with your treatment and can’t do anything about it if you don’t clear the air.

Good luck.
 
I am actually pretty happy with this doctor. He is somewhat sought after in this location, and he is a good guy, takes time, listens, etc. My beef is not with him. I like him as well as, if not better than any other doc I have ever had. My complaint is with the general medical mentality to simply provide a pill to fix the symptom, and not look for the real cause. I agree that I need to make another appointment to talk to him further, but I needed to get some info under my belt so I can know what to ask. This is the crux of the problem. It is up to the patients now to manage their own health care. I read about it in magazines and hear about it on the radio. Story line reads “we tried doctor after doctor, and no one did anything or found the right thing until this last guy… and now things are much better.” And I hate to play the “women” card. Being a woman in a man’s field I feel too many women rely on that arguement when it isn’t really the case. But I can also say that I have experienced an attitude of automatic dismissal for things because they came from a woman. Thankfully, it is rare, but it does happen. So, I can’t help but feel if this was a man’s problem, it would be taken more seriously. But there are plenty of other examples. My husband has been having pains in his arm. (He has a different doc.) The short version of his trips to the doctor and specialist are “do you work on a computer?” (who doesn’t these days) well it must be carpal tunnel. Wear this brace. No help. Well take these pills. For how long? Forever. Because we have no interest in finding the cause, and the obvious didn’t work, so we are done testing you.
 
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TAS2000:
TAS2000,
what I mean is, you go to the dr. with a headache, and he sends you home with a perscription for vicodin, without asking, the kind/ location/ other factors in your life that could cause the headahe. If you go back to this dr a few weeks later because you’ve been throwing up, and he just says take pepto bismol, without looking into other things, then you should go see another dr,

If you spend more time filling out your HIPPA forms, than you do with your dr, when your sick, you should see a different dr.

If your dr. won’t give you referrals, or let you get a second opinion, see another dr.

But at the same time, Don’t go in to their office unprepared to ask questions about what their diagnosis is, and what the treatment plan is either. No you’re not a dr, but chances are your not a 8 year old who can;t understand, nor are you braindead in a coma.
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This is exactly the debate I did NOT want to get into when I started this thread. I believe I specifically requested that you not simply say “get another doc” unless you could offer specific things that this doctor should be doing, as I feel he is a resonable guy who will do anything another doc could do if I ask for it. We all know there are bad doctors out there, and better ones. And, no I am not a child or braindead (thanks for the compliment). However, I am also NOT a doctor. I think it is unreasonable for it to be expected for me to be able to go into a doctor’s office with a problem, and to be expected to be able to know all possible reasons and casues for the problem so that I can hold an intelligent conversation and ask pointed questions. Silly, me I thought it was the doctor’s job to know the possible causes, and suggest tests for various things. I went to the doctor with irregular periods, and he sent me down the hall for a thyroid test immediately. I guess according to your model I should have known going in that was a probable cause and been able to debate which test I should be given (as another poster earlier pointed out there are several different ones available). As a simple minded child I assumed the doctor would know which test to give me better than I would. Then we sat and discussed what the treatment might be for the thyroid, or if the test turned out ok (which we wouldn’t know for a day or two), he suggested either the going on the pill or taking a fertility drug, which we spent some time discussing the side effects of that. I don’t see how you can expect me to be able to debate other possible tests all in one visit, with me not being a medical professional, or having any educated idea going in what to look for. AFTER the test and the appointment I deffinately see doing some research on the proposed diagnosis, but I do not think I should be doing that first. I thought I was supposed to see the doctor first, not diagnose my own problem and then seek out a doctor only to carry out my own highly trained prognosis (since I can’t write myself prescriptions or perform self surgery as needed.) So can we drop this now, or would you like to insult me some more for not doing enough?

Can we can get back to the real reason I started this thread? Not specifically my problem, or my doctor. But I wondered if anyone else out there had experienced the growing trend I have noticed where doctors in general seem more interested in treating the symptom, and not in finding the root cause? Do you think it is because they feel that patients won’t stick around for test after test? Or is it insurance costs for the tests?

By the way, Pinklady, I love the internet, and have used it as a resource many times.
 
I went off the pill many years ago and didn’t menstruate for a year. I think at the time I had taken it for four years straight. It might be that it could take your body that long to recover its normal hormonal balance. Many years later, I was having problems with pain. The doctor put me on the pill for a short time (3 months), but after that I decided it wasn’t worth the hassle or the risks. I started exercising regularly and eating better and the PMS and pains greatly decreased.

Doctors are under a lot of pressure these days. Most are good at heart, but they want to help. They often don’t have the time to spend with their patients. This isn’t because they don’t want to it is because of the financial constraints. They got to see so many patients in a period of time. No, I am not a doctor or married to one. I was a nurse and worked with both good and bad doctors and the good for outweigh the bad.

What I find most helpful is to write down what I want to talk to the doctor about. I write down my symptoms. I also would ask up front if there is any thing that I could try other than the pill. If you are seeing an Ob/Gyn it might be better to see his/her nurse practioner than the MD. He is going to be more focused on his pregnant patients. This is because of the high malpractice the MD faces. Also, if I felt he/she was very busy I might even ask him if there is someone he/she would recommend that I see. I would probably couch this with the “I know you are very busy.”

And to answer your question about treating symptoms. In my opinion it has to do with costs. Your MD did order an obvious test to rule out something that could not be treated by the pill. Sometimes using the pill can be diagnostic, as I mentioned, earlier and it is cheaper than many other test. Most of the time it is a process of “let’s rule this out and see if this works” Remember medicine is not an exact science. There is still a lot of mystery to the human body. While this situation is distressing to you, it is not a medical emergency that demands immediate action by your MD so he/she can go through the process. The MD is trying to help you and hold down costs and this is the way he/she know how to do it.
 
I have to say that I am finaly blessed with a wonderful team of healthcare providers. After many years of intensive medical treatment I have landed at a VA hospital spinal cord center were they all work together as one big team! I have a couple of medical issues besides my spinal cord injury, and if the care required is outside of my teams knowledge they tell me so, and then call the specialist there at the hospital that covers the discipline. I was not always this lucky in the past, I have even had doctors who would flat out ignore my questions sometimes!

My health is now much better than it has been in many years, thanks to my heathcare team, which by the way places the “patient” as a member of the team. They have told me many times that I am the one “living inside my body” and that I am the only one who can tell them what’s going on with it, then they take it from there with exams and what ever test that may be indicated. I am fully informed on the results and if treatment is called for, then I am informed on all the viable options.
Like I said before, I am blessed with my healthcare team, and I wouldn’t trade them for the bigest Power Ball jackpot.
Linda H.
 
It’s quite unfair for you to generalize that the attitude of the medical profession is “prescribe a pill, and get out of my office”. When you encounter such physicians, there are 2 issues you should keep in mind: 1) level of expertise and 2) managed care. All M.D.'s or D.O.'s go to medical school; but it doesn’t mean that they all received the same basic training. And obviously, a person who received further advanced training in his profession, presumably should be more knowledgeable in his area of specialization. Secondly, I’m not condoning it nor saying that it’s right, but managed care expects docs to see a certain number of patients per day to earn their keep, which limits the amount of time that they can spend with their patients. Also keep in mind, that many docs will take a step-wise approach to problems, and will order basic labs first then proceed with further testing if deemed necessary. Again, I’m not agreeing with this, but sometimes, the docs are limited on what they can order because what is dictated by the insurance companies.

Sure, pharmaceutical reps come to physicians office and try to convince them to prescribe their products. But ultimately, it’s each individual physician’s decision to prescribe a product. Also, keep in mind, the samples which are brought to the office by the reps are often given to poorer patients. Also, this is tangential, but what I find interesting is that there have been great efforts to limit/stop the “perks” given to physicians; however there are no mandates regarding other healthcare professionals. For ex, an acquaintance of mine is an optometrist who, along with 15+ other optometrist plus spouses, received an all expense paid trip (airfare and lodging at 5 star hotel) to try a product. Go figure.
 
TAS, I wasn’t speaking to you directly, it was more of a general you.

I’m sorry that you felt insulted. It wasn’t intended to be aimed at you, but more as a first person going to the dr scenario.

What I mean is, when I go to the dr. and I have a problem, that I’ve been suffering from for a while. I go in with questions. I don’t just sit there and say, hey, he knows everything. I’m paying for his service, and I go in prepared with questions about possible problems and solutions.

I have problems with my period too. I have a thyroid condition, and I’ve done research on the problems with both issues.

I’m on the Pill because it’s just the easiest way to deal with it. I’m not married, so I don’t particiularly care that it’s going to cause abortions, and frankly my schedule is so packed and erratic that I just don’t have time to sit down and chart anything for 10-20 minutes everyday. My thyroid condition causes a number of symptoms, and I know what they are, and when they act up I know I need to go get a different dose of meds.
 
It’s quite unfair for you to generalize that the attitude of the medical profession is “prescribe a pill, and get out of my office”.
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I believe I said that:
I know this is a sweeping generalization, but: Why is there such a huge “prescribe a pill, and get out of my office” mentality these days?
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But there wouldn’t be generalizations if there weren’t a significant number of instances that fit the generalization. Just look over in the liturgy section of the forums. We all know there are good parishes out there, but from the amount of abuse that is discussed, it sounds bad. That’s why it is a generalization.

Lizziebeth, I think we both understand that you can’t be a passive observor in your own health care these days. However, I did not know going in that the thyroid could cause this, so I had no idea. I actually expected the doctor to just say, “It’s nothing, it can take X long for the periods to get regular again.” After that visit I did a bunch of looking on the internet about thyroid and it treatments. but then the test turned out fine, so I need to start looking for the next step in the process. I did considered the Clomid, but I’m not sure I feel comfortable with all the side effects. Plus, I feel my husband should have some say in this as well, so I needed to talk to him about it. I do need to get back to the doctor for a followup, but I haven’t had time with all the pre-Christmas stuff. But as I had heard several stories in a relatively short time about doc’s treating the symptom with the pill for years from some women, then they turned out to have much more serious problems that went untreated for too long, I started this thread. It is easy to hear only the worst case stories onthe radio and web, and I was wondering if any “real” people had experienced similar trends. Hence this thread.
 
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