Does anyone else think Judas gets a bad rap?

[Crusaderbear]

The whole episode from the Last Supper to the death on the cross has always seemed to me to be the most perfectly executed plan in history. Judas, and all the others had no choice but to play their parts. Thus the world was saved by the birth of Christianity. I don’t think anyone gets a bad ‘rap’, they all did God’s will.

 

[HelenRose]

“The Son of man indeed goeth, as it is written of him: but woe to that man by whom the Son of man shall be betrayed: it were better for him, if that man had not been born.”

Matthew 26:24

To second guess God’s Mercy and Judgment is a mistake. When I stand before God, it is my hope and prayer that I will say, “Thy will not mine.”

When Judas betrayed Christ, Christ was heart broken. He gave Judas a chance to repent. Christ asked, “You betray me with a kiss?” Christ had all power on Heaven and Earth. The kiss was given. The Cross was secured. Judas was given the choice to repent. Did he repent? We do not know. That was between him and God. Do we repent? This choice will between each person and his or her creator. As I said before, the Church does not say that Judas is in Hell. We do not know.

I will not judge God. Judgment and Mercy belong to Him.

 

[Exsultet]

As I said before, the Church does not say that Judas is in Hell. We do not know.

I think it’s fair to say that Matthew 26:24 has never been infallibly interpreted to imply that Judas ultimately was condemned to hell.

However, the statement “better never to have been born” could imply damnation, in light of the idea that eternal punishment could be seen as being the only thing worse than never having existed. (Someone far more qualified than I am would have to actually expound that idea, which may or may not be theologically valid.)

Indeed, no less an authority that Avery Cardinal Dulles once opined that “several statements [in the New Testmant] about Judas can hardly be interpreted otherwise [than to say he was damned].”

Now, Cardinal Dulles is not the Magisterium, but it’s fair to say that his opinion is at least probably one that is acceptable for a Catholic to hold.

I think, therefore, you may be making your case a bit too strongly.

 

[Memaw]

My, My, I didn’t say you did, I just said I wouldn’t!! God Bless, Memaw

 

[Jeanne_S]

The saddest aspect of Judas’ story is the fact that he offed himself, rather than accepting God’s mercy. Had he repented, I think he could have been a great saint on par with Peter the denier and Paul the persecutor. What a waste.

As Archbishop Dolan explained,both Peter and Judas denied Christ.However,Peter trusted in God’s mercy and experienced resplendent reparation.Wheras a Judas didn’t believe he could be forgiven ,he experienced ruinous remorse,took his own life.

 

[Memaw]

The Church has not said that Judas is in Hell. We do not know. However, we had better not follow in his footsteps. I trust fully in God’s Judgement. He knows my heart, my soul, my intentions and who I am. He knows each and everyone of His children. He knows when we are making excuses for our behavior.

Looking at the worst of sinners and thinking, “Poor poor Judas. God just doesn’t play fair.” Then moving over to, “Well I am not that bad. I am okay and you are okay.” Are not the wisest of all philosophies. We WILL choose between God and Satan. The choices we make here on Earth WILL be the choice we make when we face God. Satan and his followers made their choice with full knowledge. We will make our choice with full knowledge.

God understands completely the difference between those who do or do not have full knowledge and those who are wanting excuses. His Mercy is just.

He gave Judas free will and He has given us free will. I don’t understand all the ins and outs of that belief but as a Catholic I have come to understand that I am not meant to fully understand the Mind of God and His Mysteries.

AMEN, Thank you, The Church has never said who is in Hell and probably never will. But She has given us plenty of Saints to learn from. God Bless, Memaw

 

[Irishmom2]

Yes, because God knows our decisions in advance.

But predestined makes it sound like Judas had no choice in the matter. Yes, God knows our decisions, but He was not the cause of Judas’ betrayal. That was his own free will.

 

[HelenRose]

But predestined makes it sound like Judas had no choice in the matter. Yes, God knows our decisions, but He was not the cause of Judas’ betrayal. That was his own free will.

This is in the realm of the Mystery of God. We have to trust in His Justice and Mercy. We can not understand this with our finite minds.

When I read about the sorrow of Christ when His friend betrayed Him, I can only wonder why God loves us enough to die for us. For me this is real Mystery.

We do not know the mind of God.

 

[R_H_Benson]

To second guess God’s Mercy and Judgment is a mistake. When I stand before God, it is my hope and prayer that I will say, “Thy will not mine.”

When Judas betrayed Christ, Christ was heart broken. He gave Judas a chance to repent. Christ asked, “You betray me with a kiss?” Christ had all power on Heaven and Earth. The kiss was given. The Cross was secured. Judas was given the choice to repent. Did he repent? We do not know. That was between him and God. Do we repent? This choice will between each person and his or her creator. As I said before, the Church does not say that Judas is in Hell. We do not know.

I will not judge God. Judgment and Mercy belong to Him.

The Matthew 26:24 verse is Our Lord’s words, not mine. Our Lord said it would be better for Judas that he had not been born.

 

[JB_Brother_4446]

To second guess God’s Mercy and Judgment is a mistake. When I stand before God, it is my hope and prayer that I will say, “Thy will not mine.”

When Judas betrayed Christ, Christ was heart broken. He gave Judas a chance to repent. Christ asked, “You betray me with a kiss?” Christ had all power on Heaven and Earth. The kiss was given. The Cross was secured. Judas was given the choice to repent. Did he repent? We do not know. That was between him and God. Do we repent? This choice will between each person and his or her creator. As I said before, the Church does not say that Judas is in Hell. We do not know.

I will not judge God. Judgment and Mercy belong to Him.

Amen. For all we know, Pilate might be in heaven!

 

[steve_b]

I have always found it interesting that Judas had free will, but yet Jesus knew he was the one that would betray him! I guess Jesus knows ahead of time what our ‘free will’ will pick!

Since Jesus is God he knows everything “in advance”.

 

[steve_b]

I think it’s fair to say that Matthew 26:24 has never been infallibly interpreted to imply that Judas ultimately was condemned to hell.

However, the statement “better never to have been born” could imply damnation, in light of the idea that eternal punishment could be seen as being the only thing worse than never having existed. (Someone far more qualified than I am would have to actually expound that idea, which may or may not be theologically valid.)

Indeed, no less an authority that Avery Cardinal Dulles once opined that “several statements [in the New Testmant] about Judas can hardly be interpreted otherwise [than to say he was damned].”

Now, Cardinal Dulles is not the Magisterium, but it’s fair to say that his opinion is at least probably one that is acceptable for a Catholic to hold.

I think, therefore, you may be making your case a bit too strongly.

Jesus already said what happened to Judas
John 17:12

 

[djames99]

The Gospel said he was a thief. He used to take money from the treasury and was concerned that the perfumed oil given to Jesus could have brought much money. When he rlearned that Jesus Christ was to be killed, he must have known that his entire lifestyle of pilfering from the group, was soon to end. He also had no respect from many other Jews because he was associated with Jesus Christ. Suicide was his out in face of the situation. Matt. 26:

22 And they being very much troubled, began every one to say: Is it I, Lord?
23 But he answering, said: He that dippeth his hand with me in the dish, he shall betray me.
24 The Son of man indeed goeth, as it is written of him: but woe to that man by whom the Son of man shall be betrayed: it were better for him, if that man had not been born.
25 And Judas that betrayed him, answering, said: Is it I, Rabbi? He saith to him: Thou hast said it.

 

[Tarpeian]

Does anyone else think Judas gets a bad rap? I mean, he followed Christ. Christ didn’t meet his expectations, and he betrayed Him, but…

I’ll bet you Christ doesn’t meet a lot of expectations. It’s kind of the Divine Incarnate thing, and who claims to know the mind of…

Judas took his own life, but could have been apostle, and I hope he has already or will join the cloud of witnesses.

I know there are a lot of early heresies saying Judas did the right thing, I don’t think so and I’m not proposing any of that rot, but…

Peter.

'nuff said.

I think of Peter Ustinov in the admittedly OK but not great or even really good movie bearing his given name dreaming of the three denials, then a rooster wakes him in the morning out of the dream. I wonder if this is how the first Holy Father awakened every morning.

But still, it is easy to point a finger at Judas. Ooops, all the other fingers I have are pointing at me when I do that…

You reap what you sow. “Woe to that man by whom the Son of man shall be betrayed: it were better for him, if that man had not been born” (Matthew 26:24). John 17:12- “None of them is lost, but the son of perdition, that the scripture may be fulfilled.”

 

[JB_Brother_4446]

This is in the realm of the Mystery of God. We have to trust in His Justice and Mercy. We can not understand this with our finite minds.

When I read about the sorrow of Christ when His friend betrayed Him, I can only wonder why God loves us enough to die for us. For me this is real Mystery.

We do not know the mind of God.

“I have not lost anyone of those You gave Me, execept the one who was destined to be lost…” What does that phrase from the Lord himself mean?

 

[Vico]

“I have not lost anyone of those You gave Me, execept the one who was destined to be lost…” What does that phrase from the Lord himself mean?

It means that God knows from eternity what people choose.

 

[JB_Brother_4446]

It means that God knows from eternity what people choose.

Rhetorical question.

 

[HelenRose]

“I have not lost anyone of those You gave Me, execept the one who was destined to be lost…” What does that phrase from the Lord himself mean?

It means that I am not capable of knowing the mind of God. It means that I have no idea if Judas is in Hell or not. The Church is silent on that. I am certainly not going to make that call.

Back to square one. I trust in God’s Judgement and His Mercy. He knows what He is doing.

My son is a Presbyterian Minister. He believes in pre-destination. We disagree. He has strong arguing points. I believe that the Church has a stronger case to make for free will.

Feeling sorry for Judas is a waste of time. If he is in Hell it is because he did not repent and he refused to accept God’s Mercy. It is as simple as that.

 

[JB_Brother_4446]

It means that I am not capable of knowing the mind of God. It means that I have no idea if Judas is in Hell or not. The Church is silent on that. I am certainly not going to make that call.

Back to square one. I trust in God’s Judgement and His Mercy. He knows what He is doing.

My son is a Presbyterian Minister. He believes in pre-destination. We disagree. He has strong arguing points. I believe that the Church has a stronger case to make for free will.

Feeling sorry for Judas is a waste of time. If he is in Hell it is because he did not repent and he refused to accept God’s Mercy. It is as simple as that.

I was specifically refering to what Jesus meant at that time.

 

[Ignatius]

Does anyone else think Judas gets a bad rap? I mean, he followed Christ. Christ didn’t meet his expectations, and he betrayed Him, but…
…

Jesus said it would have been better if he had not been born. 'nuff said!