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kubark
Guest
I guess it depends on what you mean by “love”. It is definitley not possible to love a stone in the same way that one loves God.
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Evoken
Guest
Of course, we can’t love a stone in the same way that we love God, that would be idolatry. Neither does God loves a stone in the same way he loves a man.
But unlike our love, God’s love is causative, it gives goodness to things. He doesn’t loves things because they are good but rather makes them so by his love. This is why St. Thomas states that God’s love is the cause of all goodness in things.
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PazzoGrande
Guest
The answer apparently is yes. There is a book from a prominent exorcist named Father Jose Antonio Fortea. I was just reading it the other day.
Interview with an Exorcist
Pages 19-20, Question 15
Does God hate the demons?
No. God, being perfect, is Love itself.
(…)
… if God does not hate the demons, the exorcist cannot hate them either.
(…)
In the end, only the power of love defeats the devil.
According to him, the “Love the sin, hate the sinner” rule even applies to demons. Also, as Christians, Father Fortea says, we are not to feel negativity or hatred. The angels in the highest choirs keep themselves worthy to always be with God by rejecting those feelings; as such, to keep ourselves worthy Christians, we should always remain in love.
Surprising how demons end up making us understand and believe in God more (reading from exorcists ended up only strengthening my faith), which is one of the reasons why God lets possession happen in the first place.
If you’re interested in this stuff, you should pick up copy of The Rite: The Making of a Modern Exorcist, by Matt Baglio. Excellent book. I’ve gone through the audiobook version several times. I don’t remember it addressing your question specifically, but it’s an eye-opener for sure.
Interview with an Exorcist
Pages 19-20, Question 15
Does God hate the demons?
No. God, being perfect, is Love itself.
(…)
… if God does not hate the demons, the exorcist cannot hate them either.
(…)
In the end, only the power of love defeats the devil.
According to him, the “Love the sin, hate the sinner” rule even applies to demons. Also, as Christians, Father Fortea says, we are not to feel negativity or hatred. The angels in the highest choirs keep themselves worthy to always be with God by rejecting those feelings; as such, to keep ourselves worthy Christians, we should always remain in love.
Surprising how demons end up making us understand and believe in God more (reading from exorcists ended up only strengthening my faith), which is one of the reasons why God lets possession happen in the first place.
If you’re interested in this stuff, you should pick up copy of The Rite: The Making of a Modern Exorcist, by Matt Baglio. Excellent book. I’ve gone through the audiobook version several times. I don’t remember it addressing your question specifically, but it’s an eye-opener for sure.
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Anathama_Sit
Guest
Greetings Kubark,
Are you saying that it is not possible for God to love all existing things?
God Bless.
Anathama Sit
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Anathama_Sit
Guest
Greetings Whitecrayon,
God cannot hate anything he created. Your flow of logic is a bit flawed. He hates the evil that Satan and humans do. But he does not hate that which he has created. It is not in his nature to do so. God is Love.
God Bless.
Anathama Sit
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JerrySeibert
Guest
Very well stated. Very insightful.
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John_Russell_Jr
Guest
… my dear friend ,
… god = love , and can only love , but this divine love has more to it than meets the eye and is not the same as human love , god loves satans and all and everything , that is never the q , it is the completely wrong q , the real q is does satan or others or anything as the case may be love god , do we love god ??? , that is the only q we or any have to ask , if we don’t love god we reject love , so is it a surprise we exp hell if we reject love , love is everything , and all that is good , evil is nothing / ness and the opposite of love , god = something = love = reality , if we reject reality as is the case at present we reject all the rest , it’s a mix now but soon we’ll get reality back i certainly hope and have confidence , reality = love , delusion = evil , reality = garden of eden – which incl heaven an much more in my opine …
… may god bless and love you
,
… john …
… god = love , and can only love , but this divine love has more to it than meets the eye and is not the same as human love , god loves satans and all and everything , that is never the q , it is the completely wrong q , the real q is does satan or others or anything as the case may be love god , do we love god ??? , that is the only q we or any have to ask , if we don’t love god we reject love , so is it a surprise we exp hell if we reject love , love is everything , and all that is good , evil is nothing / ness and the opposite of love , god = something = love = reality , if we reject reality as is the case at present we reject all the rest , it’s a mix now but soon we’ll get reality back i certainly hope and have confidence , reality = love , delusion = evil , reality = garden of eden – which incl heaven an much more in my opine …
… may god bless and love you
,… john …
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Lisa44
Guest
God is not just simply “love”.
"Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on him."John 3:36
“Do not worship any other god, for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God.” Exodus 34:14
“You love righteousness and hate wickedness; therefore God, your God, has set you above your companions by anointing you with the oil of joy.” Psalm 45:7
“Let those who love the LORD hate evil, for he guards the lives of his faithful ones and delivers them from the hand of the wicked.” Psalm 97:10
“Love must be sincere. Hate what is evil; cling to what is good.” Romans 12:9
Is God telling us to love evil? Or hate evil?
Satan and demons are evil. So by reason, should we love or hate them?
"Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on him."John 3:36
“Do not worship any other god, for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God.” Exodus 34:14
“You love righteousness and hate wickedness; therefore God, your God, has set you above your companions by anointing you with the oil of joy.” Psalm 45:7
“Let those who love the LORD hate evil, for he guards the lives of his faithful ones and delivers them from the hand of the wicked.” Psalm 97:10
“Love must be sincere. Hate what is evil; cling to what is good.” Romans 12:9
Is God telling us to love evil? Or hate evil?
Satan and demons are evil. So by reason, should we love or hate them?
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PazzoGrande
Guest
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Lisa44
Guest
The only place that I know of presently in the bible that says that “God is love” is in 1 John.
If you read the first letter of John then you will see that “God is love” is in a certain context. Taken out of the letter, and out of its context, then it could be misinterpreted.
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PazzoGrande
Guest
I was referring to the part where I wrote:
“According to him, the “Love the sin, hate the sinner” rule even applies to demons. Also, as Christians, Father Fortea says, we are not to feel negativity or hatred. The angels in the highest choirs keep themselves worthy to always be with God by rejecting those feelings; as such, to keep ourselves worthy Christians, we should always remain in love.”
It addresses your question about how to feel regarding demons and evil. Hate the evil because it draws one away from God. But since even God doesn’t hate the demons, neither should we, and only love could defeat them.
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Anathama_Sit
Guest
Greetings Lisa44,
That is rather poor reasoning. It is plaing to see that God is saying hate evil, however no where does God say hate those who do evil. Hate the evil, not the ones who do evil.
Oh by the way hatred is a self-affliction. So if you want to go on hating, when no where does God say for us to hate others [spirits are included in this as well.] then go ahead and continue to afflict yourself.
God Bless.
Anathama Sit
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Anathama_Sit
Guest
Greetings Lisa44,
God is Love. Church Tradition speaks much about God being Love.
From the Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma by Dr. Ludwig Ott
The Divine Attributes are really identical among themseves and with the Divine Essence. [De Fide]
I quote a paragraph from the section that it discusses this De Fide doctrine.
Holy Scripture indicates the idenity of the Essence and the attributes of God when it says: ‘God is love’ 1st John 4:8]. St. Augustine teaches: “What God has, that He is.”
God Bless.
Anathama Sit
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Lisa44
Guest
The bible says to hate evil. You say we are not to feel hatred.
Who do I believe, the bible or Father Fortea?
Please will you quote from the bible where it says that God does not hate demons?
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Lisa44
Guest
The subject is the devil and demons. We are not discussing hating people who sin or do evil.
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Lisa44
Guest
Have you read 1 John?
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Anathama_Sit
Guest
Greetings Lisa44,
Can you quote where it says in the Bible “explicitly” that God hates the demons?
God Bless.
Anathama Sit
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Anathama_Sit
Guest
Yet you are saying that the devil and the demons are evil. Not true. Nothing is personified evil. Demons, Satan, and humans can do evil things.
You are failing to distinguish between the entity that does evil and the actions it does. You are putting an equality which does not exit. Just because I do an evil act, does not mean that I am evil. Same thing with the Devil and the demons. As I have said they are still ontologically good, in the fact that God created them. Who are we to call evil what God has created good. What we are to do is to call evil the acts done by God’s creatures.
God Bless.
Anathama Sit
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Anathama_Sit
Guest
Greetings Lisa44,
I fail to see why you have asked this question, but to answer the question yes. May I just return a question for a question.
Have you read what the Church Tradition, the Church Fathers, and other writings of saints have said about God is love?
God Bless.
Anathama Sit
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PazzoGrande
Guest
Sounds hard to believe but this is also accurate, according to exorcists. Again I quote from Jose Antonio Fortea:
“… demons remain essentially good and loved by God… Sin ultimately leads to the condemnation of those who remain unrepentant, but this does not mean God hates sinners.”
Father Fortea also quotes a demon who was possessing a girl. The mother was furious at the demon. The demon responded, “You can’t get rid of me with hate.”
Lisa, before, I would have agreed with what you say as well, but I read up on it from exorcists who have expertise at demonology and I learnt a lot.
Anathema Sit, you really know your stuff. By any chance, are you also getting this from reading Fortea or Amorth? If not, could I know what your sources are? I’d like to learn more too.
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