Does Romney's support of minimum wage indicate shift in GOP?

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How would you personally like it if you had to work like a dog at the minimum wage and were never able to make ends meet?

LOVE! ❤️
Been there, done that. Made me all the more determined to get the education and experience to make me worth more to employers than the minimum wage…

The campaign for a minimum wage hike is another classic example of the propensity of those on the left being all for helping the poor and needy as long as someone else pays for it
 
Been there, done that. Made me all the more determined to get the education and experience to make me worth more to employers than the minimum wage…

The campaign for a minimum wage hike is another classic example of the propensity of those on the left being all for helping the poor and needy as long as someone else pays for it
How on earth were you able to afford an education while on minimum wage? Where did you find the time? It’s simply unrealistic for most, especially those trying to raise and support a family.

LOVE! ❤️
 
How on earth were you able to afford an education while on minimum wage? Where did you find the time? It’s simply unrealistic for most, especially those trying to raise and support a family.

LOVE! ❤️
People come at these social issues with a false dichotomy and an assumption that “the man” is somehow holding them down. The fact that x number of workers will be out of a job doesn’t seem to register when discussing the issue, even if y number of workers get a bump.

My first job was at McDonald’s. I made minimum wage to drop fish and nuggets in a basket and pull them out when the timer was up. If the guy with Down’s Syndrome was supposed to work that day, I cleaned the bathrooms and eating area instead. McDonald’s operated with a razor thin margin most of the time for the work that was done (people who criticize business need to look at actual cost sheets for products sometime), which was why prices were relatively low. Raising that wage would mean that the cost of a hamburger would go up, because the company had to make money to stay in business, that simple.

Later, I worked in a shop with skilled and semi-skilled labor. While I unsuccessfully tried to get it unionized, due to some legitimately unfair labor practices, the wage there was pretty decent. Even relatively unskilled workers could turn $12 an hour, if it was halfway busy. The big problem was trying to get people to show up on time for work (or show up at all), or actually do the job when they were there. The opportunity to move up was open to anyone with a willingness to learn, but most people wanted to just sit out the back door and smoke when nothing was going on. I started out as one of the unskilled people, but took advantage of any training the company offered, as well as learning from the skilled people there. (mind you, we were always desperate to find good help)

I realize that you’ll probably come back with “Well, that’s fine for you, but what about everyone else?” I’ll just point out that people are not only the sum of their circumstance, but also of their choices in life. If everyone was making a mad dash to learn a new skill, and people sat around with trade manuals in their hands, or studied accounting in their spare time, I’d grant you a point. Just having lived in the “real” world all my life, I don’t see it.
 
In many case the federal minimum wage has no effect as the states impose their own minimums. But the politicians certainly gain a few friends.
 
How on earth were you able to afford an education while on minimum wage? Where did you find the time? It’s simply unrealistic for most, especially those trying to raise and support a family.

LOVE! ❤️
1 I stayed with my parents into I graduated from college
2 I went to a local college so I could commute
3 I didn’t get married until I graduated.
4 I didn’t have children until I got married
 
I should also point out that we need to remember that the person who runs a mom and pop lawn care business, or restaurant, etc, is not really living in the same world as a banker who collects a million dollar bonus for a little “wheeling and dealing” that would raise eyebrows if the SEC wasn’t asleep. You could raise the minimum wage all you want, but people like that are hardly going to be affected by it, one way or the other. I simply point this out because I get the sense in these discussions that the dislike that the average person has for the banker or corrupt businessman is tied to the idea that a minimum wage hike will take money out of their pockets and put it in the pockets of unskilled labor, which is not the case.
 
1 I stayed with my parents into I graduated from college
2 I went to a local college so I could commute
3 I didn’t get married until I graduated.
4 I didn’t have children until I got married
  1. Other people ate fast food every day for lunch. I usually had a can of tuna and some crackers, or Kroger “scrap subs” (when they could still do that), etc.
  2. I also commuted to school.
  3. I didn’t sleep around, so I didn’t have to worry about paying child support.
  4. While other people smoked on their breaks, I had my nose in a textbook.
And so on.

One friend of mine lived even more cheaply than I did. His single vice in life was getting a Big Gulp every day on the way to work. He had quite a lot of money saved up by that point in his life (early 30s).

I don’t know. It doesn’t really matter how much money is thrown at something, people are going to fail or succeed pretty much corresponding to their desire to fail or succeed. Reducing the number of available jobs just makes it that much harder for people to get an actual starting path into the labor market.
 
Why should it be such a struggle to earn a wage that you can live on?

LOVE! ❤️
 
How would you personally like it if you had to work like a dog at the minimum wage and were never able to make ends meet?

LOVE! ❤️
If you look throughout history, you’ll come to realize that government intervention in the name of social justice leads to the poor suffering even more. The key is allowing the price mechanism to allocate resources and labour efficiently, resulting in a stronger economy and thus higher wages, minimum wage will become a non-issue.

As long as our leaders keep on tampering with the economy, price equilibrium will never be reached, and consumers and producers will suffer. The lower and middle classes will have less money to spend, and prices will be higher. Only the rich upper class will benefit.
 
Without going through the entire thread, leave the minimum wage were it is. Flipping burgers at MickyD’s isn’t meant to be a career job.
 
Without going through the entire thread, leave the minimum wage were it is. Flipping burgers at MickyD’s isn’t meant to be a career job.
Agreed; but for many it has evolved into that since there are not enough jobs for everyone at this stage. I say let them organize and bargain collectively for their wages and terms & conditions of employment.
 
Why should it be such a struggle to earn a wage that you can live on?

LOVE! ❤️
Life is a struggle robert. One has to work hard and save before having kids. Learn new skills etc. there are no guarantees and no free lunches. Wouldn’t it be nice if we could wave a magic wand and have everyone be happy and gainfully employed. Be making enough money. It doesn’t work that way. We are payed based on the value of our work. Flipping burgers is worth about $8- $9 / hr. Not much more. If you want to make more, learn a skill that will pay you more.

Ishii
 
Life is a struggle robert. One has to work hard and save before having kids. Learn new skills etc. there are no guarantees and no free lunches. Wouldn’t it be nice if we could wave a magic wand and have everyone be happy and gainfully employed. Be making enough money. It doesn’t work that way. We are payed based on the value of our work. Flipping burgers is worth about $8- $9 / hr. Not much more. If you want to make more, learn a skill that will pay you more.

Ishii
Having low-wage earners who can’t make ends meet should not be subjected to unnecessary stress and frustration. Should a truly modern society have neurotic citizens due to unnecessary stress and frustration?

LOVE! ❤️
 
Life is a struggle robert. One has to work hard and save before having kids. Learn new skills etc. there are no guarantees and no free lunches.
Let me try to understand this. Your notion of the working poor, those who labor 40+ hours a week and earn close to or just above minimum wage and who want better, is that they are after a free lunch?
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ishii:
Wouldn’t it be nice if we could wave a magic wand and have everyone be happy and gainfully employed. Be making enough money.
It doesn’t take a magic wand. All it takes is that the administrators of mega-corporations like McDonalds decide to stop stealing the labor of their employees and pay a living wage.
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ishii:
It doesn’t work that way.
No, certainly not under our system of state-sponsored usury.
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ishii:
We are payed based on the value of our work. Flipping burgers is worth about $8- $9 / hr. Not much more.
Who says so? The CEO of McDonalds? Who determines “the value of our work”? The invisible hand? The same people who decide that the CEO makes more in one hour than most of his employees make in one month?

Catholic teaching is that leaving it up to market forces is not sufficient.
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ishii:
If you want to make more, learn a skill that will pay you more.
Much easier said than done. And besides, that’s not relevant to the basic fact that most of these people’s labor is being stolen from them in the jobs they have.
 
So wait for that trickle down economics to take effect.

Given what the Holy Father has recently stated regarding the unjust inequality of wealth,; I have a feeling this is not the progress he would have in mind for a society.
It is not “progress” to confiscate more wealth from those who have lawfully earned it. De Tocqueville saw the potential that politicians would ultimately bribe the electorate with the money of others, and he felt that this would spell the end of America. Politicians reaching even deeper into other people’s pockets is nothing more than old-fashioned stealing.
Anyone who would vote against politicians for refusing to vote for job-killing minimum wage hikes is a fool. How much failure do voters have to see before they realize that it is this economic illiterate Obama and his minions who are most responsible for our steep decline? :confused:
 
If everybody chose LOVE, we would not even be having these debates.

LOVE! ❤️
 
“Let me try to understand this. Your notion of the working poor, those who labor 40+ hours a week and earn close to or just above minimum wage and who want better, is that they are after a free lunch?” GNJSDAD

Ishii is saying that they do NOT have an entitlement to more money from their employer. That guy has bills to pay as well! Are the employees going to help the owner who goes out of business? I know for certain, absolutely not. Once the business folds, the boss has no claim upon the money of his former employees either.
Government cannot create jobs. The larger the government, and the more onerous the taxes and regs, the fewer jobs get created. This is true whether we are talking the Soviet Union or Amerika. It’s economic reality. The only booming business in America today is government, and it is killing the rest of us. Think it through, Dad! :doh2:
 
If everybody chose LOVE, we would not even be having these debates.
LOVE! ❤️
I disagree, Robert. You can have all the love in the world, but if you have a job, and I think that I am worth $15 an hour, and you want to pay me $8, a love-fest isn’t going to resolve the matter. 😃 Rob
 
Having low-wage earners who can’t make ends meet should not be subjected to unnecessary stress and frustration. Should a truly modern society have neurotic citizens due to unnecessary stress and frustration?

LOVE! ❤️
What about the business owner or the entrepreneur? It seems you care not for them. Where is your love and compassion for them? The Church has warned against the dangers of putting capital versus labor.
 
What about the business owner or the entrepreneur? It seems you care not for them. Where is your love and compassion for them? The Church has warned against the dangers of putting capital versus labor.
They can become wage-earners if they wish.

LOVE! ❤️
 
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