Don't build walls, Pope Francis says

[Son_of_Niall]

Looks like it. The Spiritus MundI has given the Spiritus Sanctus the boot here, and the Church-hating, red pill-popping brigade are here to stay. An enemy has done this.

Very sad.

 

[WingsOfEagles]

I am so tired of hearing the excuses that what the Pope said was “mistranslated” from Italian into English or was “inaccurately reported” by the news media.

So we are supposed to ignore what the Pope said months ago prior to the US election when he said clearly that Trump was not a Christian for wanting to build walls, rather than bridges, and for not wanting to throw open wide the borders of the US to refugees and immigrants.

No other pope as far back as I can remember has had this type of mis-translation problem and inaccurate reporting problem as the “difficulties” Pope Francis is having.

Yeah, I think it’s pretty obvious there was an ulterior motive in this statement from Pope Francis. It’s too coincidental, especially knowing how he feels about Trump.

 

[Mary_Gail_36]

Let the Pope lead by example then. Tear down the walls to the Vatican See and dismiss the Swiss Guard. Show us here in America how it is done Pope Francis; tear down that wall.

As for the Pope’s quote, I would suggest that there is a huge difference between laws, justice and accountability vs. vengeance, revenge and retribution. Actions have consequences.

As far as I am concerned, the Pope is squandering his moral authority by his forays into political rhetoric and agendas. There is little remaining now and soon there will be none.

The Vatican is in Italy. You can just cross into the Vatican from Rome without a passport.

So the wall is supposed to be to protect the Vatican from Romans? Or maybe it was constructed in the middle ages when many city states had walls?

The pope didn’t even mention trump.

“Te la faccio pagare” is an Italian phrase literally meaning “I will make you pay”. It usually doesn’t refer to monetary payments but to revenge.

 

[Son_of_Niall]

Yeah, I think it’s pretty obvious there was an ulterior motive in this statement from Pope Francis. It’s too coincidental, especially knowing how he feels about Trump.

You people just can’t help yourselves can you?
Choosing Trump over the Vicar of Christ.

 

[WingsOfEagles]

You people just can’t help yourselves can you?
Choosing Trump over the Vicar of Christ.

Don’t try to twist things. This is a ridiculous statement given all I stated is it was obvious there was an underlying message against Trump. I am not obligated to have the same politics as the Pope. This is not a matter of Church doctrine.

What was essentially the only other option I had in this election? Hillary Clinton. A woman who cares more about herself and her career than anyone else. A woman who would lie to get there and has admitted that she believes in having a public opinion and a private one (we can’t handle the truth afterall). A woman known to have a volatile temper when the cameras are off and has been known to say very demeaning things to her help when “no one” is watching. A woman who supports late term abortions. I could go on.

Yes, Trump is by no means perfect, but let’s not pretend that Hillary is better. She is just more politically correct in what she says to the public.

 

[3_Dog_Night]

Building the wall is not anti-Christian. It’s pro-Christian and pro-Catholic.

Also, you did not attack the Pope. I am sorry that some accounts on here have accused you of doing so, but understand it’s the same thing as waving the white flag. Take it as a a compliment.

It is refreshing to see comments that are not falling the gimmicks of the secular left.

I don’t care if I am ridiculed, mocked, attacked, or whatever. I posted a well-considered article on St. Thomas and what the Catholic response should be to refugees and to immigration. I have posted many thoughtful comments and references to many blogs, articles, news reports and the like. Most of my postings are disregarded. Crickets. Silence. I do not expect to influence or change the minds of the liberal and secular left. What I may do is get those in the middle and those who are undecided thinking critically about the topics that are of great importance to all of us as Catholics and as Americans.

I did not become Catholic to become a Socialist. I did not become Catholic to embrace George Soros’ open borders and open society. I did not become Catholic to be scammed by the UN carbon tax and wealth redistribution or to mindlessly agree to controversial and unproven theories of climate change and/or global warming. I did not become Catholic to celebrate the “joy and dignity” of homosexuals and “homosexual marriage.” I did not become Catholic to commend and praise the heresies of Martin Luther. I did not become Catholic to encourage/ approve family and friends in continuing the mortal sin of adultery.

Jesus said that in the last days there would be wolves disguised in sheep’s clothing that would seek to destroy the flock. I truly believe we are seeing Jesus’ words unfold before our eyes. I hear a snarl and a growl – a very loud and persistent snarl and growl. I do not hear the voice of the shepherd. I have no desire to be torn to shreds by the wolves that have taken up residence in the church, in our colleges, in our institutions and in our government. I have no desire to accompany the deceiver into the bowels of hell. Evil is not good and good is not evil; and it doesn’t matter who tries to convince me otherwise.

 

[Son_of_Niall]

Did somebody say something?

 

[Sarcelle]

It’s not surprising that our Pope would take that view, but this is a matter where it’s his opinion, not something that we’re required to agree with. We must remember that Pope Francis’s birth name is Jorge Mario Bergoglio and that he is from Argentina. It’s no wonder that he is going to feel it unfair and un-Christian to build a wall keeping Mexicans out of the US. He pretty consistently backs socialist policies. Unfortunately, he should probably not be using his position of power to push his political views. It is unrealistic to expect the US to just keep allowing ILLEGAL immigrants to enter our country and allow them to get a free ride off of our programs.

Is the Pope really saying that though?

Is he really saying that the US keep allowing people from all over the world to come here illegally and go on welfare while citizens and legal immigrants work themselves to death supporting these illegal immigrants?

If he really means that, then I would have a problem with it.
I think he is more nuanced than that. I think that in our zeal to protect our borders we may go about things which may send the wrong signals which may alienate the US from the global community.

 

[Usige]

The Vatican is in Italy. You can just cross into the Vatican from Rome without a passport.

Yes you can pass into St Peter’s Square and enter the Basilica, but you cannot just walk into the gardens or wander Vatican City as you want. There are also security checkpoints that control access so outside of St Peter’s Square it is not a porous border.

So the wall is supposed to be to protect the Vatican from Romans? Or maybe it was constructed in the middle ages when many city states had walls?

Walls serve another important purpose beyond physical defense. They serve to control access and to delineate sovereign boundaries. The two things are linked. When crossing a sovereign boundary you should become aware that you must respect the laws, culture, and traditions of that country. Try to enter Vatican City wearing a halter top and a mini skirt and see if they are nearly as open as many pretend they are. How does the Vatican enforce those standards with millions of visitors and a small staff? Controlled access through a small number of entrances.

 

[gracepoole]

Jesus said that in the last days there would be wolves disguised in sheep’s clothing that would seek to destroy the flock. I truly believe we are seeing Jesus’ words unfold before our eyes. I hear a snarl and a growl – a very loud and persistent snarl and growl. I do not hear the voice of the shepherd. I have no desire to be torn to shreds by the wolves that have taken up residence in the church, in our colleges, in our institutions and in our government. I have no desire to accompany the deceiver into the bowels of hell. Evil is not good and good is not evil; and it doesn’t matter who tries to convince me otherwise.

Care to explain who the wolves in our church are?

 

[abucs]

Care to explain who the wolves in our church are?

I don’t know who the poster is referring to but you know as well as I do that the rules here are that you cannot directly criticise members of the clergy if that indeed is who the poster means.

You trying to bait him into breaking forum rules is disgraceful.

 

[gracepoole]

I don’t know who the poster is referring to but you know as well as I do that the rules here are that you cannot directly criticise members of the clergy if that indeed is who the poster means.

You trying to bait him into breaking forum rules is disgraceful.

No, what’s disgraceful is the obvious winking at disparagement of the Church’s hierarchy. It’s actually more than disgraceful: it’s disgusting.

 

[abucs]

No, what’s disgraceful is the obvious winking at disparagement of the Church’s hierarchy. It’s actually more than disgraceful: it’s disgusting.

3 Dog Night has every right to voice his concerns about the church he has come to love and wishes to defend.

He is not winking at anything. He is being extremely sober in his assessment at the direction of the church and obviously his heart is filled with frustration and sadness in having to post.

Quite literally there are millions of Catholics filled with frustration and sadness in the same way and are voicing concerns…

If you find that disgusting then that is your business. He is not going to be silenced either because you are disgusted at some ‘winking’ or in your attempts to be get him to criticise members of the clergy against forum rules so that you can be even more disgusted.

 

[gracepoole]

3 Dog Night has every right to voice his concerns about the church he has come to love and wishes to defend.

He is not winking at anything. He is being extremely sober in his assessment at the direction of the church and obviously his heart is filled with frustration and sadness in having to post.

Quite literally there are millions of Catholics filled with frustration and sadness in the same way and are voicing concerns…

If you find that disgusting then that is your business. He is not going to be silenced either because you are disgusted at some ‘winking’ or in your attempts to be get him to criticise members of the clergy against forum rules so that you can be even more disgusted.

What I find disgusting is cowardice, and that should be the business of any Catholic who is tired of shameless innuendoes made against Holy Mother Church on a Catholic forum. You’re aware that you can’t directly call out clergy so instead you offer feeble insinuations and back-handed calumny. Instead, perhaps you should consider why you’re not permitted to directly attack the Church’s hierarchy here and either accept it or leave.

By the way, congratulations on moving so quickly from “I don’t know who the poster is referring to” to knowing 3 Dog Night’s motives and heart.

 

[Son_of_Niall]

3 Dog Night has every right to voice his concerns about the church he has come to love and wishes to defend.

He is not winking at anything. He is being extremely sober in his assessment at the direction of the church and obviously his heart is filled with frustration and sadness in having to post.

Quite literally there are millions of Catholics filled with frustration and sadness in the same way and are voicing concerns…

If you find that disgusting then that is your business. He is not going to be silenced either because you are disgusted at some ‘winking’ or in your attempts to be get him to criticise members of the clergy against forum rules so that you can be even more disgusted.

Typical Trumpster garbage. There are not “millions of Catholics filled with frustration and sadness”. Just you and your little group of right-wing Trads.
We will stand by the Church.
Not sure what you’re standing by.

 

[WingsOfEagles]

Typical Trumpster garbage. There are not “millions of Catholics filled with frustration and sadness”. Just you and your little group of** right-wing Trads. **
We will stand by the Church.
Not sure what you’re standing by.

Labelling anyone who voted for Trump as a “right-wing Trad” is highly inaccurate.

Who should an American Catholic have voted for? Explain why Hillary Clinton would be a good defender of the faith.

 

[Son_of_Niall]

Labelling anyone who voted for Trump as a “right-wing Trad” is highly inaccurate.

Who should an American Catholic have voted for? Explain why Hillary Clinton would be a good defender of the faith.

“3 Dog Night” mentioned “wolves that have taken up residence in the church,” to which he was asked to elaborate.
He has yet to do so.

 

[RPRPsych]

“3 Dog Night” mentioned “wolves that have taken up residence in the church,” to which he was asked to elaborate.
He has yet to do so.

Wasn’t there a story about Saint Francis and a wolf? I remember it vaguely from my school days…

Also, as a “trad” myself, I take offence at being lumped together with our friend 3DN. I testify that he has a great zeal for the Law, but it is misguided.