Don't Support Devilish Music(Rock Music)!!!

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I believe one thing about the classical music of non-western countries is that they reflect the culture of those places. Thus, when a foreigner hears them, its quite easy to associate it with that particular country regardless of how the local people would interpret it.

With that said, unless Portrait wants to go as far as to condemn these other cultures as demonic (which is pretty much just one more step outside racism), the fact that foreign music is capable of rendering a somewhat different range of emotions and thoughts (via association) only proves further the subjective/arbitrary nature of music.
 
NewsTheMan said:
Ah. We get to the root of it all. You just don’t like rock.

I agree with Returning Home. It is sad to see someone so deluded. Who truly thinks that a form of music conveys drug usage and Satanic occult and rebellion etc etc etc. It is not intrinsically about that and it NEVER can be. Just as any medium can be intrinsically evil. Are sound waves evil? A reductionist approach dismantles your argument. For the whole is not greater than its parts. In fact, many different things dismantle your argument. Subjectivity is the name of the game. I can call a lot of varieties of music rock. Lump it all together!

Here’s a mindboggler for you! What about Yngwie Malmsteem - Neo-Classicalist? i.e. he plays Classical music using modern instruments. All of a sudden… your precious Classical music is now being played and it sounds like rock. Then what? Is it classical? Is it rock? Aaaah!
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Dear NewsTheMan,

Cordial greetings and again thankyou for your response.

You are quite correct in stating that I do not not like rock music and the reason for that is that it emanates from an Augean stable of unimaginable filth and depravity and so naturally I give it a wide berth as I do not wish to befoul my soul. This has nothing to do with being overly prissy or a fuddy-duddy, but it has everything to do with keeping myself pure and “unstained from the world”.

Rebellion has most definitely been one of the key themes of rock since its inception. Since rock is basicly for youth, rock performers have siezed on and shamefully exploited the natural rebelliousness of teenagers with much success. Why the whole industry panders to juvenile emotions as everybody knows fully well. Moreover, rock has consistently attacked parents, society, religion and even God Himself, in fact anything that would be an impediement to its deplorable hedonistic and irresposible lifestyle.

Alas, drugs have always been an integral part of the rock scene and the fact that the US Government could not find a ‘clean’ group to entertain the troops in Vietnam, demonstrates this beyond any reasonable doubt. The rock scene is drenched in drugs and always will be. Drugs are a vital ingredient for the majority of rock artists

There is no mileage whatsoever in the “reductionist argument” inasmuch as the ‘parts’ themselves are also likewise defiled, for rock music is rock music and it cannot escape its morally offensive associations, no matter how hard it might sometimes try. That it can escape them and be sanitised is just naive wishful thinking.

My dear friend, one could also retort by saying that your own arguments betray a biased and distorted viewpoint since you yourself are desperate to uphold your own polemical opinion come what may, and many would add, indefensible opinion. On the contrary, my arguments are actually corroborated by the history of rock, evidence from the performers themselves and even non-Christians, in fact just about everybody save an insignificant number of trendy Christians, chiefly the young, though not exclusively, who still wish to cling on to a “few of my favourite things” and adopt an easy going, ‘Catholicism Lite’ type of religion.

Finally, as for your brain-teaser, which is not really a puzzler at all, it seems that you are refering to music that is made up of incongrous elements, but certainly not rock music as we know it. Let us stay with what your average man on the London Undergound or the NY Subway understands by the rock music genre; let us not complicate matters for polemical purposes as it only tends to needlessly cloud our topic.

Warmest good wishes,

Portrait
 
Lost_Wanderer said:
I believe one thing about the classical music of non-western countries is that they reflect the culture of those places. Thus, when a foreigner hears them, its quite easy to associate it with that particular country regardless of how the local people would interpret it.

With that said, unless Portrait wants to go as far as to condemn these other cultures as demonic (which is pretty much just one more step outside racism), the fact that foreign music is capable of rendering a somewhat different range of emotions and thoughts (via association) only proves further the subjective/arbitrary nature of music.
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Agreed…different people feel and experience music in different ways.

I don 't believe rock music is evil. It is, after all, just music. It is a collection of notes that makes chords. And a collection of chords that make progressions. And layers of textures, that make harmonies.

So…a perfect fifth, maybe even with a seventh and/or ninth…is okay in classical music…but when played in rock music, it’s evil…because it’s in rock? It’s still the same sound. Bach was notorious for developing and experimenting with chords, and a lot of rock is based on chord progressions from classical music, including accidentals, augmented and diminished chords, which creates the main affect of rock…this was used heavily in Baroque, Classical and Romantic classical music…so, they can’t be evil, because otherwise classical music would be too.

So…it’s not the notes and chords then, because seeing the above we’d have to agree that if a particular chord is evil in one genre, it must also be evil in another…and I don’t think anyone would say that Bach for example was evil (well, unless you were made to do Bach chorales).

So…must be the beat then. But…well…a beat is just a beat. A pulse. 4/4 or 3/4 etc. All of which are well and truly explored within classical music, alongside every tempo imaginable, so…can’t be the beat.

So…is it the instruments then?

Ah yes…the iconic sound of rock. The electric guitar. But that’s just a guitar with amplification…like a voice that’s amplified with a microphone, and that’s used in speaking as well as singing so it can’t be that. Maybe it’s the actual guitar then? Hm…but no, because then you’d have to condemn the lute, and seeing as it is basically the evolution of a violin and a harp, you’d have to condemn them too, because it’s just the same…a box with some strings stretched across.

So…the drums then? Ah, it must be the drums that makes rock evil…but then…you’d have to also declare all classical music with cymbals and timpani/kettle drums in the percussion section evil, and seeing as that includes most of the Classical and Romantic movement, I don’t think we can do that either.

So…must be the lyrics. But…it’s already been said on this thread, just a few posts ago, that the evil is communicated in the music without words…so…can’t be that either.

So…must be the musicians then…but…it’s also been said previously in the thread that even if the musician is a normal kind of guy, the evil is in the music even if it is only for show. So…can’t be that either.

Well…there we are.

Guess that’s that.
 
Portrait said:
On the contrary, my arguments are actually corroborated by the history of rock, evidence from the performers themselves and even non-Christians, in fact just about everybody save an insignificant number of trendy Christians, chiefly the young, though not exclusively, who still wish to cling on to a “few of my favourite things” and adopt an easy going, ‘Catholicism Lite’ type of religion.
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All you’ve done is make the glaring fallacy of correlation implying causation.
Portrait said:
Let us stay with what your average man on the London Undergound or the NY Subway understands by the rock music genre; let us not complicate matters for polemical purposes as it only tends to needlessly cloud our topic.
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Cloud the topic? More like take you out of your sweet, biased comfort zone that rock is somehow exclusive to the west. You know, I remember showing you examples of foreign rock ages ago yet you never addressed it. You’ve been deliberately dodging the issue and thus, I can only conclude that it’s because it really does present an affront to your theory that rock is inherently evil.
 
Don’t forget the large number of composers and writers who took drugs in history, but drugs that were legal and accepted when they lived and are only considered illegal now.
 
Lost_Wanderer said:
All you’ve done is make the glaring fallacy of correlation implying causation.

Cloud the topic? More like take you out of your sweet, biased comfort zone that rock is somehow exclusive to the west. You know, I remember showing you examples of foreign rock ages ago yet you never addressed it. You’ve been deliberately dodging the issue and thus, I can only conclude that it’s because it really does present an affront to your theory that rock is inherently evil.
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Bravo! I have been struggling to find the words for the horrible fallacy being committed. Correlation does not imply causation indeed!
 
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Thank you to all those who have participated in this discussion. This thread is now closed.
 
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