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James_S_Saint
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And this is why very shortly there shall be no humanity at all. Life abhors what hides from it. Life wins. Humanity’s lust for mystery doesn’t and takes humanity with it.
don't you think people are 10 times more rude now than ever in (recent) history???
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Mel_Stones
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On the way to truth or realizing the truth. But to Heaven works to because the truth will led you to heaven.
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Ceil-1
Guest
I simply hate it when young people call me “hon”. I don’t mind from an older person, but, a waiter or a desk clerk? There is no sense of subordination even in terms of age.
My son was walking between two yards when the neighbor at one house yelled at him to get off the lawn. It wasn’t even his lawn, but, he was concerned he would cross over to it. This man is a hateful person, and for no apparent reason. This was hard on my son, who is a tender-hearted individual.
People enjoy being hateful and condescending, and it’s the clean of heart who suffer. Unlike people like myself who flings it right back at them, and worse. I don’t know which state of affairs is worse.
My son was walking between two yards when the neighbor at one house yelled at him to get off the lawn. It wasn’t even his lawn, but, he was concerned he would cross over to it. This man is a hateful person, and for no apparent reason. This was hard on my son, who is a tender-hearted individual.
People enjoy being hateful and condescending, and it’s the clean of heart who suffer. Unlike people like myself who flings it right back at them, and worse. I don’t know which state of affairs is worse.
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emma411
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Yay! I’m not alone.
don’t mean to laugh but i can certainly relate… damned if you do… d- if you don’t…
i guess its all about Satan…
yes, let’s blame him… he hates everybody…
Niceness, it must be a deadly disease now. The cure? To be mean, yes that’s it. Ahhh, what to do distracted? What to do. 
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distracted
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***Thank You!! ***
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distracted
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i choose being mean…Yay! I’m not alone.
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distracted
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maybe in that case you could have combined being nice with being… well… flinging it back, as you say…
to the hateful person You could yell something like, “Would Jesus act lilke taht?”
make him feel guilty…
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JimG
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Therese of Lisieux had difficulty coping with the rather consistent hateful behavior of one older nun toward her when she was a young novice. She took the opposite tack and treated the older nun very solicitously, as if she were the most important person in the convent, as if she were the one that Therese most respected and loved.
So, did it change the older nun’s demeanor?
Not a bit. But she did ask Therese one day which of her qualities Therese most admired!
That was a hard one to answer.
So, did it change the older nun’s demeanor?
Not a bit. But she did ask Therese one day which of her qualities Therese most admired!
That was a hard one to answer.
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Gottle_of_Geer
Guest
Yes, a small town in North Yorkshire, I know most people in the nearby streets by name and the town’s still small enough that you’ve a fair idea of who a child belongs to so if they’re in trouble you know who to take them to and if they’re misbehaving they know news of it will get home before they do
Many families have lived here for generations ( my family have spent the last 400 odd years living 60 miles away but within 5 minutes of moving here neighbours were knocking on the door to say hello ) Don’t let the few rude people spoil life for you, they’re not worth it
A fellow-victim of Toe-nail Bliar & his mate Gordy the Unelected, then. My sympathies to you
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johnhenry
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Yes, I agree that rudeness, arrogance, ill will, and ethnic chauvinism are much worse. In my former office I was “mowed down” after thirty years of trying to be considerate to employees and clients. The whole atmosphere began to change in the early 1990’s. By the time I retired in late 2004 I was diagnosed with Major Depression. I have read that England has deteriorated to an even greater degree since the rise of New Labor govt, during which time the attack upon Christianity has really escalated. In both nations society is breaking down, partly due to the enormous numbers of broken homes over several generations, the rise of pornography, and the granting of a free reign of mass media to pour forth violence and images of unrestrained sensuality, much of which is directed to pre-teen and teen populations. Our cultures are now conditioned to focus upon self-gratification at the expense of others, and to use verbal and even physical violence against others if people get in the way. A culture of the Imperial Self. In ways I cannot describe, our society may benefit-- ever so slowly— from the recovery of beauty, reverance, and a sense of the sacred in our Liturgy, and thereby foster belief in the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist. Society now boasts in its irreverance toward just about everything and everyone, except for categories protected by PC. How very counter-cultural for the Church should she make every effort to inculcate profound reverence for Sacred things, especially for the Sacrifice of the Mass. How many of the vulnerable and wounded dear souls, suffering in the wasteland of secular America, would then be drawn to the solace of Holy Church? Ron
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ErikaA
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The discourse has gotten so ugly and vile. I find myself quite often a contributor to the caustic tone. Can we change the self destructive course we’re on? Is it too late? The reality is there is a fatal flaw in our nation and society. We have given in to moral subjectivism and with that, all else falls.
We do not love each other. Our politicians are the worst. Do they set the tone or reflect it? Perhaps both. But if we want to change the civility in our public discourse, we must change our politicians and ourselves. Vote out all incumbents, get off the internet, turn off the TV and play cards with your neighbors. We won’t do that mind you. We’re all much too weak. Anger is our drug.
We do not love each other. Our politicians are the worst. Do they set the tone or reflect it? Perhaps both. But if we want to change the civility in our public discourse, we must change our politicians and ourselves. Vote out all incumbents, get off the internet, turn off the TV and play cards with your neighbors. We won’t do that mind you. We’re all much too weak. Anger is our drug.
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James_S_Saint
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If someone doesn’t “wake up”, it is all going to get much, much worse in even far more serious ways.
It is a dark train with no compassion. The presumed answer isn’t the answer. The desired answer isn’t the answer. Humility leads to the answer.
It is a dark train with no compassion. The presumed answer isn’t the answer. The desired answer isn’t the answer. Humility leads to the answer.
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johnhenry
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Mr. Saint, I think you have a profound insight into history, into intellectual history in particular. Ideas have consequences. I simply do not understand your condemnation of Glory or Glorification of God, or of formal worship in which we offer thanksgiving and praise to our creator and redeemer. How we pray (and worship) eventually determines what we believe-- lex orandi, lex credendi. Over the past 40 years there has been a significant loss, among Catholics, in the belief in the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist, accompanied by a decrease in reverence by those assisting at mass. I am not arguing for a universal imposition of the old latin mass. But I think that our Holy Father is concerned about these trends. I do believe that a restoration of reverence, beauty in religious art and music, and the proper celebration of the Church’s liturgy, would go a long way toward reversing the negative trends noted above. We have an ugly, and sometimes, violent secular culture. Pop culture is a vast wasteland, which promotes selfishness, irreverence, and sexual gratification through any and all means. Rudeness and anger are by-products of this culture. The Catholic Church, in her sacred worship, may stand as a bulwark, standing over and against this angry society, which will otherwise destroy the beautiful, the true, kindness, and sacrificial love. This is now the new Dark Age. But many will be conquered by Divine Love. For us, we must love those who appear to hate the Church and who hate us. We must not become bitter and resentful, though we grieve for the loss of common courtesy in the public square. There are so many wounded, broken people all around us. They need our love because our Lord loves them.
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James_S_Saint
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By what means do you love? What does it really mean to love?
If you find a bird on the ground with a broken wing, do you glorify the virtues and mysteries of the Holy Trinity to her?
Perhaps you would explain the physics of aerodynamics and the necessity for her to hold her wing properly?
Maybe sit beside her, wave an olive branch over her and pray?
Of course, you might in your rush presume she is just lazy or stupid, too stupid to live anyway and pass her by. Certainly you have more important things to do.
So when you meet a doubter, an atheist, even a bedeviler, by what means do you truly love?
Do you pronounce the wonders and glory of the most sacred and proud Church and God?
Do you explain how God and the Trinity are mysterious and cannot ever be understood?
Perhaps you stand by them and silently pray?
Or perhaps, as you have a life of your own to lead, you simply ignore the confused, stupid, and discontent?
When you espouse glory and mystery, you hide Truth in lust and darkness. For the mystery to be maintained, the Truth must not be seen. For glory to be maintained, the lust for such brilliance must be maintained.
Although such brings in those who already long for such, it also casts shadow into those who seek Truth.
Which is more needed by the unbeliever in an age of Science, analysis, and scrutiny?
Why is it that the Church after long years of glorification and mystery cannot see the need for simple truth? Why is it that after such a long time, it appears to not understand those mysteries itself?
How can it give to the disbeliever what he needs if it doesn’t even see what he needs? He needs simple explanations that it seems the Church cannot provide fore if it gives them, where will the mystery be? If everyone knows how to do the greatness then where would the glory be?
You glorify God by glorifying TRUTH itself, not the Church, magic, mysteries, and miracles.
The doubter does not need more glorifying reason to doubt. He doesn’t need explanations of the aerodynamics of spiritual flight. He doesn’t need silent prayer lacking in question of his real needs.
He needs what he cannot do for himself. He needs clarity and certainty.
If you cannot give these things, then all you give him only adds to his broken wing, pain, and despair. And you cannot love.
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James_S_Saint
Guest
an example to the point from another thread;
Athiest:
When the Church glorifies, it only glorifies to those already in belief. She glorifies to herself.
Would you marry the woman who, regardless of the need, glorified to herself, proclaiming that she shes only real truth infallibly?
I am far, far more attracted to the woman who says, “I could be wrong, but I believe this is true because…” and then I find that her explanation is even better than my own. Embarrassingly, this has happened. Its disconcerting, but extremely attractive.
Science did it that way (after it learned the hard way).
One is humble to the possibility of error without actually having reason to believe she is in error. The other presumes that none could be so grand as she and is the very make of pride and ego. All from the need to glorify.
One has something to offer. The other has no need for me, she admires herself enough without me.
Athiest:
Had the former reply seen the true need of this Atheist?
When the Church glorifies, it only glorifies to those already in belief. She glorifies to herself.
Would you marry the woman who, regardless of the need, glorified to herself, proclaiming that she shes only real truth infallibly?
I am far, far more attracted to the woman who says, “I could be wrong, but I believe this is true because…” and then I find that her explanation is even better than my own. Embarrassingly, this has happened. Its disconcerting, but extremely attractive.
Science did it that way (after it learned the hard way).
One is humble to the possibility of error without actually having reason to believe she is in error. The other presumes that none could be so grand as she and is the very make of pride and ego. All from the need to glorify.
One has something to offer. The other has no need for me, she admires herself enough without me.
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Gottle_of_Geer
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Mel Stones;5694588:
…you get an F for spelling
so true that:
but in some apparition of the Virgin Mary (not sure whether approved or not by the Church) she is reported to have said that this period in history is the worst of all as far as sin goes…
and i alreayd “knew” that long before i heard ofthis apparition… experience!!
you really begin to see rudeness and (etc)… when you become a devout outspoken Catholic… Jesus said you will be “hated by all” because of Him and Is that ever true…!!!
the world generally speaking hates the Catholic Church and all its “foolish” members…
probably because they know it is (and we have) the truth
the truth really does hurt…
but it doesn’t go away just because we scream “OUCH!!! Stop it!!! NOOOOOOOOOOOO!! AHHHHHHHHH!”
uch:
The problem with apparitions of the BVM that condemn modern manners, is that they make the BVM sound intolerably middle-class. I suspect you’re thinking of La Salette, in 1846: an approved apparition; I don’t think the approbation includes the message BTW. One would hope that a Saint in heaven would be able to rise above the prejudices & limitations of 19th-century France - one of the thingsabout the OT Prophets is that they (who were on earth, not in glory) so often transcend the prejudices & limitations of their respective environments.
As with the messages of La Salette, so with those of Fatima: the BVM says nothing about sin & Hell an intelligent person could not have said; that probably had been said in many sermons, retreats, pious books & the like, before then. In both instances, the alleged messages do not rise above anything that could not have been said by others than the BVM - but if the BVM (of all people !!!) is the speaker, one is entitled to expect a lot more spiritiual insight than those messages display; yet there they are. Has Heaven really got nothing better to do than to condemn fashions in women’s clothing ? The least of confessors hearing his penitents or preaching to his people could do as much - “we need no prophets to tell us this”.
People have always been saying how horrible & rude & crude people are these days - it’s one of the privileges of no longer being in the first flush of youth. Cyprian in 250 thought the world was ageing. In 25,000, people will be saying how horrible modern life is, just as though the idea had never occurred until they said it. And they will be as wrong as we are & our ancestors were. People like complaining - it’s fun to criticise others; it means one can sit around & belly-ache. That doesn’t make it any better founded. STM people should quit the complaining, and be grateful for what they have, when they could so easily not have had what God has given them.STM ingratitude on the part of Christians is appalling - let’s complain about our lack of gratitude instead. Then we might even become the sort of people whom other people want to be polite to.
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johnhenry
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So now the truth about you comes out: you are one of those angry persons in our society, the kind of anger we have been discussing so far. My recommendations were directed toward believing, practicing Catholics, not toward confirmed anti-Catholics, nor even to Protestants. Although you dismiss Faith in Christ, the Mass, the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist, our Worship of God in Three Persons as so much superstition and “mystery”, we hold that they are absolute realities. We are taught to help those in need by providing food, clothing, and shelter. The Apostle James warned us that faith without works is dead. Faith is perfected in love. Tangible help to that needy person is incumbant upon us. Our faith is dead if we refuse such help. Merely passing out a tract and saying “God bless you” and walking away is not faith perfected in love. Can you accuse the late Mother Theresa and the Sisters of Charity of not truly loving the poor, outcast, and dying in India? Did they simply pass out religious tracts throughout the slums, and engage in religious controversy, while the poor are living and dying in the streets of Calcutta? I worked with the poor, aged, and disabled for thirty years. I assisted by helping them obtain benefits to which they were entiltled under the law. But the process takes forever. I often gave of my own funds so that individuals and families could buy groceries or pay their rent in the face of imminent eviction. I have seen it all. God bless you Mr. Saint.
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johnhenry
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This reply was directed to James Saint.
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James_S_Saint
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The only truth I have seen come out is in your post that typically began with presumption.
There has been no anger except that which you see through the mirror of your own heart.
And when did I “condemn” doing so? Presumed again? I have no aversion from such practices. Why did you presume I did?
Up to here, I completely agree.
This needs work to survive the oncoming challenges.
Is food and shelter what they needed at the time? Is this what you offer here and now to these people? To me?
I have done as much and much more. And without being asked to do so by the Church or even Jesus, but God himself. No rewards. No acknowledgment. Unknown to anyone.
Why are you presuming?
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liquidpele
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