Dreading the holidays with parents

[exoflare]

It sounds like all you can really do is look for a job that pays you enough so you can get your own insurance, and until then just continue to keep up appearances as much as you have to. Then when that day finally comes you won’t have to care what your parents think about you or what they give you.

I’m sorry you’re going through this, though. I know what it’s like, believe me.

 

[maryjk]

Oh how so many of us wish our (even difficult to get along with) parents were still alive just to spend the holidays, or any days with. Count your blessings, and just rejoice in having her!

Oh I wish my parents were here. I miss them terribly.

But they were wonderful, happy, loving people. Not at all like the OP’s mother.

On the other hand, my mother-in-law is all about appearances and totally self-centered. In fact, she sounds a lot like DarkLight’s mom. The only way to deal with her is to call her on every, and I mean every, comment or action that crosses normal boundaries. She decided that since we weren’t willing to put up with her craziness, she wouldn’t speak to us anymore. It works for her, and it works for us.

But we weren’t beholden to her for anything.

 

[leonie]

amazon.com/Boundaries-When-Take-Control-Your/dp/0310247454

I think that if you are concerned about your visit affecting your mental health, you should talk to your doc about it and how to handle your mom.

Personally, if I didn’t feel strong enough to handle it, I would probably find a way to delay it until I felt strong enough.

Don’t forget to pray for her. Also, remember that moms can be a little quirky with kids they worry about. I have a wonderful son who has some anxiety issues who just started college that I find myself intruding too much in his life. It’s hard to let go when you worry.

God bless.

 

[VivienneJ]

Oh how so many of us wish our (even difficult to get along with) parents were still alive just to spend the holidays, or any days with. Count your blessings, and just rejoice in having her!

And those of us who had parents such as DarkLight has and who do not come from “Hallmark Card” families just feel so guilty when we read comments like this and have to acknowledge that we do not have any regrets that our ‘difficult to get along with’ parents are no longer around.

 

[Flame4]

Oh how so many of us wish our (even difficult to get along with) parents were still alive just to spend the holidays, or any days with. Count your blessings, and just rejoice in having her!

Perhaps you had a good relationship with your parents. It is unfair and unhelpful to assume that if something worked for you, it ought to work for everyone. DarkLight is, on top of the issues she is having with her mother, also dealing with health issues. That is a struggle in and of itself. It is important to have empathy and think about the situation and feelings of another person before offering advice.

DarkLight I have some idea about what is going on because I had a friend who had similar issues. In fact her mother sounds exactly like yours. We were still minors at the time so my friend had even more forced contact with her mother. Anyways she was suffering from anixety and depression but her mother thought she was being “silly”. She wanted to fix my friend’s personality as well. She basically said my friend had to be more confident (as your mother said) and to make more friends. As if that is going to help someone who is depressed! I saw how much my friend needed support from the person she should have recieved it from the most, but wasn’t getting it.

To be honest I am more worried about your health. I think it is most important to take care of yourself and focus on getting better. I would also recommend talking to your therapist about your mother. The best thing you can do is to not take what your mom says to heart. You have enough to carry. Do you have to go visit her over the holidays? Is there anyways you can just say you won’t be able to make it? If it will negatively effect your health, then it may be needed.

I will pray for you! God bless and take care:console:

 

[DarkLight]

To be honest…part of the problem is that I’m still trying desperately to shake some of her values. Her words hit hard because they hit the values that I was trained with and can’t shake off. Especially when it comes to working - taking time off from work and living off of loans and charity, especially as a young adult? Lazy. Entitled. Overgrown children that expect the government to take care of them, rather than working for themselves.

I feel worthless even when she’s not around, leaving a good job like this…

 

[Flame4]

Darklight you recognize that those views are distorted. Otherwise you wouldn’t feel the need to shake them off.
Its not being lazy to take time off work when you are sick. 1) it is unhealthy for you and 2) you aren’t doing society any favours either. You won’t be able to perform to best of your ability at work while you are sick. If you had serious cold would you go to work? I hope not, not only for your sake but for the sake of your colleagues as well. I hope I don’t sound rude, but I’m approaching your question this way because you may be more likely to come to terms with the need to take time off if you see it as a problem that will affect people beyond you too.
With mental health its easy to see it as not being important because it isn’t visible. But mental health problems can be a great struggle. It is not being lazy to recognize the need to take care of your body and that includes your mind.

Think about it like this: if a friend was suffering from these problems and felt the need to take time off work because of her health would you consider it lazy? Lazy is not doing work when we are capable of doing it. Its not lazy for us to miss mass if we are fairly sick. It isn’t lazy for an old lady to have someone else carry her shopping bags for her if they are too heavy. Why? Because isn’t lazy to ask for help when you need it. In fact it is humble. Why else are we encouraged to take care of the poor and sick? If they are all lazy we should just tell them to get off their backsides! We know this isn’t the case. There are plenty of people who genuinely need the support of the larger community. You realize you are one of these people. Nothing lazy in that. Yes you are a young adult and young people are usually viewed as healthy and fit. Unfortunately even young people get sick.

Lazy is not doing your work because you want to “relax” or sleep in or watch tv or go shopping or just because you don’t want to. Lazy is depending on someone for something which you are capable of doing yourself. I could go on but I assume you are getting the idea

I hope you believe what I’m saying. I know its difficult to break out of certain thought patterns. Speak to your therapist about this.

God bless!

 

[DarkLight]

Just FYI - I don’t have a therapist to speak to about any of this. I’ve tried for months to find someone suitable but every place I’ve called has said they’re too busy, or they don’t offer long-term treatment, or they don’t do PTSD. All I have is the college health center, but they just shove a bunch of postmodern idiocy at me and get mad when I don’t buy into it.

 

[maryjk]

To be honest…part of the problem is that I’m still trying desperately to shake some of her values. Her words hit hard because they hit the values that I was trained with and can’t shake off. Especially when it comes to working - taking time off from work and living off of loans and charity, especially as a young adult? Lazy. Entitled. Overgrown children that expect the government to take care of them, rather than working for themselves.

I feel worthless even when she’s not around, leaving a good job like this…

Maybe you should question yourself about what you are doing.

You are not just “taking some time off.” You are quitting your job. AND taking out a loan to cover your expenses while you are unemployed. AND using their insurance, that they seem to be paying for.

What are your chances of finding another job when you are ready to return to work? Will you be able to find one with health insurance?

You also mentioned school. Are you taking off an entire semester? Will you be able to go back to school?

Is this something you need to do, rather then something you want to do?

Could your parents be concerned about you being able to stand on your own, after they are gone? A parent spends most of their time, working themselves out of a job. We raise children so that they don’t need us. Maybe your parents think you will always need their help and they are worried about what will happen to you.

 

[DarkLight]

Maybe you should question yourself about what you are doing.

You are not just “taking some time off.” You are quitting your job. AND taking out a loan to cover your expenses while you are unemployed. AND using their insurance, that they seem to be paying for.

What are your chances of finding another job when you are ready to return to work? Will you be able to find one with health insurance?

You also mentioned school. Are you taking off an entire semester? Will you be able to go back to school?

Is this something you need to do, rather then something you want to do?

Could your parents be concerned about you being able to stand on your own, after they are gone? A parent spends most of their time, working themselves out of a job. We raise children so that they don’t need us. Maybe your parents think you will always need their help and they are worried about what will happen to you.

It’s not something I want to do. I have some setup to hopefully get back to my job. No, it’s not as secure as I would like, or even most people would be comfortable with. But the fact of the matter is, I’m out of good secure options. I’m under threat of losing my job anyway because I’ve had to take so much time off that I can’t fulfill the basic requirements anymore. I haven’t finished either of my classes from summer and it’s looking like I can’t finish mine for this semester. I need to do something. What I’m doing right now isn’t working. My current job is through the university and requires me to be a full-time student to hold it.

I know they’re concerned about me being able to stand on my own. I’m concerned about being able to stand on my own. The trouble is that they’re expressing their concern by trying to get me to “work harder” and blaming me for failing, rather than acknowledging the situation I’m actually in. I’m facing someone who, rather than help me get the treatment I need, is opting to stubbornly say “you’re not sick.”

I have PTSD from abuse as an older teen (first 2 years of college). It’s never been treated properly. My mother knows but doesn’t want to acknowledge that it was a big issue, or that it’s something that I can’t just get over. I’m getting flashbacks at work and during school; I’m not sleeping because of nightmares. Even without them half the time my stress level from the past is so high that I can’t focus on my own work.

 

[DarkLight]

The more I think about it…part also is that I feel like, at 24, I am having to be the mature one in the relationship with my mother, while dealing with someone who still treats me like a rebellious child. Maybe it’s silly, but - I would really like it for my parents to acknowledge when I make a difficult choice based on weighing the options as best I can. Isn’t that what adults are supposed to do?

It’s hard to explain if you’ve never been through it. Disability and illness like this take a toll on your own self-esteem. You go from being a good student and a hard worker to having to rely on whatever help you can get, knowing you’re too sick to earn it. Especially as a young adult…you’ve struggled so hard to be truly independent and self-supporting, to get a good job and a good education. And all of a sudden you find yourself dependent on someone else like a child, despite whatever work you put in and skills you might have.

My parents just don’t seem to want to engage with what’s actually going on. I can’t “work harder” and get through this. I’m not a child trying to get out of school and chores. I love my job and my classes. I hear the rhetoric all around me, here, at church, calling people like me lazy and entitled, because in their minds no young adult genuinely needs help, and certainly not for mental illness. I’m afraid to tell anyone at church because I don’t want to be rejected again. It would be nice to have just one place where I could go and not be a treated like a spoiled child for having a mental illness.

 

[Eleanor61]

And those of us who had parents such as DarkLight has and who do not come from “Hallmark Card” families just feel so guilty when we read comments like this and have to acknowledge that we do not have any regrets that our ‘difficult to get along with’ parents are no longer around.

I don’t feel guilty (anymore) but I really do find comments like that one offensive. I am truly relieved that my mother is gone and resentful that it took so long for me to have any peace. A cursory reading of these forums will reveal that we whose mothers tormented us for years are hardly alone.

 

[hsmomforlife]

I don’t feel guilty (anymore) but I really do find comments like that one offensive. I am truly relieved that my mother is gone and resentful that it took so long for me to have any peace. A cursory reading of these forums will reveal that we whose mothers tormented us for years are hardly alone.

As one whose mother has been gone almost 25 years, I don’t take offense at comments from people who miss their deceased loved ones…even if I don’t necessarily wish that they were still here to celebrate with, I am happy that they do! Also, I’m sure that the person who posted that comment surely meant well, from their own perspective.
However, I don’t think it’s the most sensitive/charitable/thoughtful thing to tell someone who is struggling with mental illness and dealing with holiday issues with their family that they should just be happy that they still have their family member alive. :nope:

It reminds me of a friend who lost her 5 month old son…and friends tried to ‘comfort’ her with some typical comments (you can always have more kids, everything happens for a reason, he was so little and you wilI move on, etc.) and how hurt and offended she was by all of their comments. I gently reminded her that they have absolutely no experience in losing a baby and just the thought of it is probably so horrible for them that they don’t know what else to say…so try not to take it so personally and remember that they were at least trying to be comforting.

Sometimes people are fortunate enough to not have endured the same type of pain, and their attempts at being comforting are the best that they know how to do.

 

[DarkLight]

As one whose mother has been gone almost 25 years, I don’t take offense at comments from people who miss their deceased loved ones…even if I don’t necessarily wish that they were still here to celebrate with, I am happy that they do! Also, I’m sure that the person who posted that comment surely meant well, from their own perspective.
However, I don’t think it’s the most sensitive/charitable/thoughtful thing to tell someone who is struggling with mental illness and dealing with holiday issues with their family that they should just be happy that they still have their family member alive. :nope:

It reminds me of a friend who lost her 5 month old son…and friends tried to ‘comfort’ her with some typical comments (you can always have more kids, everything happens for a reason, he was so little and you wilI move on, etc.) and how hurt and offended she was by all of their comments. I gently reminded her that they have absolutely no experience in losing a baby and just the thought of it is probably so horrible for them that they don’t know what else to say…so try not to take it so personally and remember that they were at least trying to be comforting.

Sometimes people are fortunate enough to not have endured the same type of pain, and their attempts at being comforting are the best that they know how to do.

The trouble is that most of us who have less than good family relationships really do put up with a lot of people being rude or insulting over it. Especially as a young adult…a lot of people’s first reactions is a sort of dismissive wave and a comment that “when you get older you’ll realize you’re just like her.” The prevailing attitude I’ve faced is if you were a better daughter she wouldn’t do this. As a child, it was always “be more obedient and everything will be fine.” As a college student it was “be nicer and visit her more often and do what she wants and it’ll be fine.” When you finally get old enough and wise enough to stand up and say enough, I don’t have to put up with this, you get treated to a chorus of “But how could you? She’s your mother! You’ll regret this when she’s gone.”

It may be well-intentioned, but intentions aren’t everything. A lot of us have gotten a lot of hurt from well-meaning people.

 

[hsmomforlife]

The trouble is that most of us who have less than good family relationships really do put up with a lot of people being rude or insulting over it. Especially as a young adult…a lot of people’s first reactions is a sort of dismissive wave and a comment that “when you get older you’ll realize you’re just like her.” The prevailing attitude I’ve faced is if you were a better daughter she wouldn’t do this. As a child, it was always “be more obedient and everything will be fine.” As a college student it was “be nicer and visit her more often and do what she wants and it’ll be fine.” When you finally get old enough and wise enough to stand up and say enough, I don’t have to put up with this, you get treated to a chorus of “But how could you? She’s your mother! You’ll regret this when she’s gone.”

It may be well-intentioned, but intentions aren’t everything. A lot of us have gotten a lot of hurt from well-meaning people.

The irony about your comment is that I am part of the '…us who have less than good family relationships really do put up with a lot of people being rude or insulting over it." ’

The ability to realize other’s intentions and respond in an appropriate manner is paramount to developing into a mature person. It allows one to develop a sense of empathy, again another sign of maturity.

I guess I wasn’t exactly clear in my point. If you put yourself in the other person’s shoes and realize that the vast majority of people who are trying to say things to comfort you or ‘help you out’/make the situation bearable/ etc. are not intentionally trying to cause you pain (and only you can allow someone’s comments to affect you in a negative way!), so give them the benefit of the doubt, be charitable and realize that they don’t have a clue as to what they are talking about, but that’s not their fault. In their own twisted/ignorant/'well meaning way, they are trying to help. Viewing things in this way removes the power from what they are saying to have a profound effect on you and hurt you.

Number of years on the face of the earth does not make one mature.

I was on the receiving end of the same type of treatment when I faced a similar situation with my sister. Finally when I said to someone…if she were a he, and he was my boyfriend or husband, and had emotionally & physically abused me like this for 15 years, would you REALLY tell me I should stay/take it/suck it up/obey my husband/and that I would MISS him when he was gone!!!

The response I got every time was, “I never thought of it that way…”

I guess my point is that holding on to the hurt and letting everyone’s comments affect you in the way that you have, will never help you resolve the issues in this relationship.

My guess is that if you get some decent counseling, it may help, but if you realize that you have to set boundaries with people and whenever someone who is not your mother starts discussing your relationship with your mother with you, you simply have to be mature and politely tell them that your relationship with your mother is between you and her and that out of respect for your mother, you don’t want to talk about her without her present. You may need to even explain to well intentioned family members that if you had an issue with them, you would discuss it with them privately, and not with other family members.
Then quickly change the subject…'So, do you have any plans for the New Year?? :angel1:
This also means that you have to not vent your frustrations with your mother with other family members/family friends anymore.
Then take a moment to truly pray for the person who has made a comment…ask God to help you understand exactly why they would say whatever they said and to understand exactly how they thought it would be helpful to you. You will be amazed and the insight that may be provided.
Anyhow, I hope that some of what I have typed will resonate with you in some way shape or form…please remember that I am simply trying to help and provide insight from my perspective, given my life experiences.
I sincerely hope that your Christmas this year is better than you expect it to be!

 

[DarkLight]

I do understand why people say it that way. But…every time people say stuff like that, I remember getting the same advice and comments as a child, and as a young adult, and how much hurt it caused. If I let it go just because it’s well-intentioned, I would consider myself complicit in keeping the next child or young person in that sort of relationship.

To call something offensive is, I think, something more than saying “I personally don’t like that sort of comment.” It’s letting someone know that what they said was objectively a hurtful thing to say, so they don’t say it again to someone in a similar situation. I think that sort of thing needs to happen more in our society - we keep a lot of harmful stereotypes and attitudes going because the people who see differently are too “polite” to correct them.

 

[hsmomforlife]

If I let it go just because it’s well-intentioned, I would consider myself complicit in keeping the next child or young person in that sort of relationship.

I didn’t say to necessarily let it go, but the mature way to handle it is to a) not take it personally through empathy and realizing the other person’s point of view and b) simply and politely tell them that out of respect for your mother, you will keep discussions about your relationship between the two of you…and you hope that they can understand and respect that. c) keep your issues with your mother to yourself and maybe one close friend/confidant and don’t complain to various family members about whatever is going on between you two.

There is nothing complicit in that…it’s basically telling them that they need to mind their own business…in a more polite way

To call something offensive is, I think, something more than saying “I personally don’t like that sort of comment.” It’s letting someone know that what they said was objectively a hurtful thing to say, so they don’t say it again to someone in a similar situation. I think that sort of thing needs to happen more in our society - we keep a lot of harmful stereotypes and attitudes going because the people who see differently are too “polite” to correct them.

I never said not to correct them, but I guess it all depends on the approach. Saying something like “Hmmm, interesting idea/approach. Either way, out of respect for my mom, I would really like to keep discussions about our relationship between she and I. I hope you can understand and respect my decision not to talk about my mom when she isn’t here. Not to change the subject, but do you know of a good hairdresser/tailor/shoe repair person/dogsitter in the area? Thank you! Will you please excuse me, I need to find the restroom.”
If you tell them that what they said is hurtful and not helpful to anyone in a similar situation…it will most likely fall on deaf ears.
The average person will get exactly what you are trying to say and if they don’t, it doesn’t matter what you say or how you say it…they won’t be listening anyhow

Again, I’m not trying to argue with you, just hoping that you can see that there are ways of making people ‘get it’ and refusing to engage them in conversation about the topic. If you decide that the only person you will engage in conversation about your relationship is your mom, then no matter what people say to you, it just won’t matter.

 

[DarkLight]

I didn’t say to necessarily let it go, but the mature way to handle it is to a) not take it personally through empathy and realizing the other person’s point of view and b) simply and politely tell them that out of respect for your mother, you will keep discussions about your relationship between the two of you…and you hope that they can understand and respect that. c) keep your issues with your mother to yourself and maybe one close friend/confidant and don’t complain to various family members about whatever is going on between you two.

There is nothing complicit in that…it’s basically telling them that they need to mind their own business…in a more polite way

I never said not to correct them, but I guess it all depends on the approach. Saying something like “Hmmm, interesting idea/approach. Either way, out of respect for my mom, I would really like to keep discussions about our relationship between she and I. I hope you can understand and respect my decision not to talk about my mom when she isn’t here. Not to change the subject, but do you know of a good hairdresser/tailor/shoe repair person/dogsitter in the area? Thank you! Will you please excuse me, I need to find the restroom.”
If you tell them that what they said is hurtful and not helpful to anyone in a similar situation…it will most likely fall on deaf ears.
The average person will get exactly what you are trying to say and if they don’t, it doesn’t matter what you say or how you say it…they won’t be listening anyhow

Again, I’m not trying to argue with you, just hoping that you can see that there are ways of making people ‘get it’ and refusing to engage them in conversation about the topic. If you decide that the only person you will engage in conversation about your relationship is your mom, then no matter what people say to you, it just won’t matter.

The trouble is I do need a safe place, somewhere, anywhere, to talk about dealing with her. I’m young; I’m on my own. I need somewhere that I can go and actually talk about how to handle holidays without being blamed. And most people I’ve found would rather blame and go out of their way to tell me what I’m doing wrong. I don’t talk about it anymore in real life because I almost always get told I’m a horrible daughter, even by people who have never heard the situation or spoken to her. That’s how I ended up on here.

I’ve seen a lot of good intentions in my life, and I’ve had a lot of people tell me I should be more polite and ignore it. I’ve never found it to work. If you’re sweet and polite, people brush you off, ignore your problems no matter how much you need help. The only way to have a chance is to get angry enough to shock people out of their comfort zone,

 

[hsmomforlife]

The trouble is I do need a safe place, somewhere, anywhere, to talk about dealing with her. I’m young; I’m on my own. I need somewhere that I can go and actually talk about how to handle holidays without being blamed. And most people I’ve found would rather blame and go out of their way to tell me what I’m doing wrong. I don’t talk about it anymore in real life because I almost always get told I’m a horrible daughter, even by people who have never heard the situation or spoken to her. That’s how I ended up on here.

I’ve seen a lot of good intentions in my life, and I’ve had a lot of people tell me I should be more polite and ignore it. I’ve never found it to work. If you’re sweet and polite, people brush you off, ignore your problems no matter how much you need help. The only way to have a chance is to get angry enough to shock people out of their comfort zone,

I have to say that even though I don’t know you IRL, you have shot down each and every suggestion that everyone has given you. You won’t go to counseling:

Just FYI - I don’t have a therapist to speak to about any of this. I’ve tried for months to find someone suitable but every place I’ve called has said they’re too busy, or they don’t offer long-term treatment, or they don’t do PTSD. All I have is the college health center, but they just shove a bunch of postmodern idiocy at me and get mad when I don’t buy into it.

I don’t mean this in an uncharitable way, but you don’t seem to truly want to find a solution to the problem…you seem ‘stuck’ in it and seem to be he** bent on getting someone to be on your side. I’m not a therapist, but I would have to think that the approach that you are taking is just making everything worse.
You say you aren’t talking to anyone in person anymore because, basically, they don’t take your side, regardless of the fact that they know your mom or not. In the next ‘breath’ you negate what people here reply, based on what other’s IRL say to you whenever you talk to them. :banghead:

I’m making these final comment and then I have to move on past this thread…

1. this started as issues with Christmas with your mother and turned into issues with everyone in your life who doesn’t agree with you and how you handle your issue with your mother
2. you need therapy for PTSD…a bunch of people on a message board won’t be able to help you with that one. Give up on finding ‘on line help’ and put your energy into finding a therapist who can actually spend some time getting to know all of the details of your situation and work through the two major issues that you have: abuse and mom. Maybe you could contact your local parish and see if they know of any Catholic Priests who do therapy.

If you’re sweet and polite, people brush you off, ignore your problems no matter how much you need help. The only way to have a chance is to get angry enough to shock people out of their comfort zone,

If you run around ‘angry enough to shock people out of their comfort zone’ you just act like an immature brat and then become and angry person, and I would hope that’s not who you want to become. I’m just not sure why you would give all of those other people so much power over your life and how you behave by allowing their actions to make you ‘angry all the time’

People ignore your problems no matter how much you need help because you are not seeking help in a constructive manner from people who can actually HELP YOU!

Many people have given you ideas on how to handle your original question of how to handle the holiday’s with your parents. I hope that some of what everyone has said will prove to be helpful and that Christmas will be much less stressful than you dread it being.

IMHO if you go there for Christmas, come up with some responses to expected questions that deflect things away from you and ask about the other person and how they are doing…then nod politely and slip away from the conversation when you can:

“Oh, school is school…so how’s your goiter? I didn’t see Mom made TRUFFLES! Please excuse me, I have to have one!”
“Oh I’d rather not waste time talking about my job…what’s new with Uncle Tom’s business? That’s great, please excuse me, I have to use the restroom.”
“I haven’t seen you in so long, how’s your family? I’m going to get some more ice…would you like some?”
“we have this great new dog park in my area…do they have many of those around here?”

I truly hope that you take some of the helpful comments and ideas from many people on this thread and really think about how they COULD work and how you could take the wisdom from people who have BTDT and use it to improve your situation.

Sorry for such a long post…

 

[ringil]

Unfortunately what’s on offer to me would only provide 6 visits per year for what I need. And I need to be seen at least weekly and probably more often than that.

It’s stupid - I’m really too sick to be working full-time, but apparently not sick enough to qualify for government aid. Hence why I end up leaning on my parents, because I can’t take care of myself and no one else will do anything at all.

You could contact a lawyer to apply for disability.

Just for your information they will absolutely turn you down the first time you apply for SSDI. It’s almost a policy if you aren’t blind. They will especially deny you if you are use mental illness as a qualifying condition.

Yes, the attorney would get some of the money but getting the money would be better than nothing.

I’m a social worker so I know a bit about this stuff.