DVD: The Secret

[mrsbigdog]

I have been comtemplating (and praying about) the relation between my Catholic beliefs and the movie The Secret for several weeks. I am having a hard time seeing any problem with The Secret. Perhaps I need to watch it again. I guess that I might see problems with how the secret is presented but not with the theory.

Genesis 1:27-28

"God created man in his image, in the divine image he created him; male and female he created them.

God blessed them, saying “Be fertile and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it. Have dominion over the fish of the sea, the birds of the air, and all the living things that move on the earth.”"

God created all things, including energy/matter and God has control over all things, including energy/matter. If I am created in the divine image, is it not possible that I, too, possess a control over energy/matter? Could this not be the manner in which God is ordering us to “subdue” the earth?

Each time I attend Mass I experience a miracle in which the matter of bread and wine become the body and blood of Christ. This is a miracle of God but it is done through the hands of a man (the priest). Jesus instructed “Do this in memory of Me” thereby giving the power to man.

Our physical actions cause reactions in the material world. Can not also the energy of minds cause reactions in the energy of the world?

I guess my concern was basically that people would come away from the movie believing that they are a god rather than that they are in the image of God.

I’ve rambled and I’m not certain that this makes sense but I hope my point has come out.

Hastrman, I guess I don’t understand your point. To me the movie was a discussion about physical world “things” and never did refer to or discuss the spirit or soul (they exist but are not physical things and so not part of the movie). I didn’t find a denial of the non-physical in the movie, I just thought it was dealing only with the physical. I don’t think the movie promoted materialism, it also discussed gratitude and relationships.

I am uneducated beyond basic college religion, philosophy and science. Can you help me out by explaining your background that qualifies your statements?

I’m not questioning your ability to defend your position, I just want to understand the backround you have the helps you make your statements. You seem very authoriative and since I’m a research type of person I like to know the backround of things.

 

[benjoy07]

Thanks for your post, mrsbigdog. I believe your understanding is now the same as my own. However, the movie does mention that energy was **never **created and can **never **be destroyed and **always **existed. And again, last week on Oprah, who featured this movie, the guest speakers reiterated that idea that energy was never created and can never be destroyed, etc. And I assume from a purely scientific perspective, that might be a true statement. But from my current understanding and what seems to be your own understanding, God created energy. So that simple belief, to me, makes the Secret acceptable in regards to their theory vs. my faith. Overall, I think the Secret is a good thing. It emphasizes nothing but positive things that are in line with my faith. I was hesitant, however, when they referred to energy as the source of all things, which I guess now, in retrospect, is an accurate statement, if you consider things are physical things.

 

[Ruthmary]

My advice is to study this very carefully. Someone asked Steve Ray about this book on Friday’s Catholic Answers show and he said that it sounds like New Age. Especially if it’s being pushed by Oprah, I’d be very wary of it, because she’s very New Agey. If you listen very carefully to her, you find that her philosophy is not Christian.

Sounds like this secret promises all kinds of material goods in this life, and if you study Jesus, you find that he doesn’t promise us good things in this world, but only in the next.

Please be careful.

 

[hlmem]

My advice is to study this very carefully. Someone asked Steve Ray about this book on Friday’s Catholic Answers show and he said that it sounds like New Age. Especially if it’s being pushed by Oprah, I’d be very wary of it, because she’s very New Agey. If you listen very carefully to her, you find that her philosophy is not Christian.

Sounds like this secret promises all kinds of material goods in this life, and if you study Jesus, you find that he doesn’t promise us good things in this world, but only in the next.

Please be careful.

A lot of people I know have seen the DVD and love it.

Its basically a positive thinking dvd.

It just talks about you need to think of what you want from life. Go for your goals, and it will happen.

 

[Ruthmary]

A lot of people I know have seen the DVD and love it.

Its basically a positive thinking dvd.

It just talks about you need to think of what you want from life. Go for your goals, and it will happen.

The point is that all these sorts of ideas, which have been around since time immemorial, contain only part of Christian teaching, and can be dangerous to those who aren’t real clear on all that Jesus taught. As Catholics we have a wonderful treasury of theology and philosophy that gives us the whole of what God wants us to know about Him. Augustine, Thomas, Chesterton, Teresa of Avila, Theresa the Little Flower, Pope John Paul II, and many other popes besides . . . there’s no end of reading, and don’t forget the Bible, upon which all other good writing is based. Anything you read must be tested against the Bible to see if it is true. Would “The Secret” stand up to that test?

What happens if you think good thoughts and you don’t get what you want? Does this book tell you what to do if you suffer the fate of Job and end up with personal disasters? Does it tell you to give it all up to God and trust Him?

Listen to Friday’s open forum with Steve Ray at about 12 minutes into it where he is asked about “The Secret”. Do you agree with what he has to say?

 

[hlmem]

The point is that all these sorts of ideas, which have been around since time immemorial, contain only part of Christian teaching, and can be dangerous to those who aren’t real clear on all that Jesus taught. As Catholics we have a wonderful treasury of theology and philosophy that gives us the whole of what God wants us to know about Him. Augustine, Thomas, Chesterton, Teresa of Avila, Theresa the Little Flower, Pope John Paul II, and many other popes besides . . . there’s no end of reading, and don’t forget the Bible, upon which all other good writing is based. Anything you read must be tested against the Bible to see if it is true. Would “The Secret” stand up to that test?

What happens if you think good thoughts and you don’t get what you want? Does this book tell you what to do if you suffer the fate of Job and end up with personal disasters? Does it tell you to give it all up to God and trust Him?

Listen to Friday’s open forum with Steve Ray at about 12 minutes into it where he is asked about “The Secret”. Do you agree with what he has to say?

Dude, it’s about staying positive and going after your goals.

Job thought positive, he trusted in God. He knew all would be ok because he believed in God. That is positive thinking.

God wants all of us to think positively. Jesus taught about forgiving enemies and loving others.

Well the only way to do that is not to dwell in hate and anger but to look toward the good.

That is positive thinking.

You sound like we shouldn’t think anything and just trust God. Well I don’t think God wants us to walk in the middle of the highway and just trust him.

God wants us to be smart, and to think good things, and to go for them.

God wants us to be happy. Positive thoughts are one huge reason many people arnt happy. This dvd just teaches people to think positively and be more assertive.

 

[hlmem]

Listen to Friday’s open forum with Steve Ray at about 12 minutes into it where he is asked about “The Secret”. Do you agree with what he has to say?

And by the way I did go and listen to this that you referenced.

But I can not comment on Steve Ray’s opinion (who has not read the book). His opinion is based off a caller who herself admits she just thumbed threw the book.

She was the first person to say new age, and it sounds like Steve Ray formed an opinion from her saying “new age” (and a bad summery of a book she didn’t read) and that her friend is protestant.

 

[benjoy07]

I think both hlmem and Ruthmary have good points. I agree with both of you, if that’s possible. Ruthmary, I understand you to be concerned that one might take the Secret as an end all, be all philosophy, but I am not asserting that, or, at least I don’t mean to. Again, my original question has been resolved. But just to comment on the current discussion, I feel the Secret is what Ruthmary said, only a part of Christian teaching. I don’t plan on leaving my faith because of this dvd. By the way, I found some good references that are similar to what the Secret mention. One verse even mentions “secret,” which I found amusing at the very least.
Mark 11.22-25 (especially 11.24)
Philippians 4.10-13 (esp 4.12)
ref: New American Bible

 

[thechrismyster]

The only way to settle this is by scientific experimentation…

i want everyone reading this thread to positively think “I WANT THE CHRISMYSTER TO HAVE $1,000,000 CASH IN THE BANK BY MARCH 1st, 2007”.

there… put that thought out there and i’ll let you know how it goes!!

 

[benjoy07]

Good one, chrismyster. Don’t think it hurts to try. But replace your name with mine . Better yet, both of ours

 

[hlmem]

The only way to settle this is by scientific experimentation…

i want everyone reading this thread to positively think “I WANT THE CHRISMYSTER TO HAVE $1,000,000 CASH IN THE BANK BY MARCH 1st, 2007”.

there… put that thought out there and i’ll let you know how it goes!!

Well technically… Your goal has been completed. I am sure everyone reading this wanted that too happen… You asked for us to WANT it, not for it to actually happen…

See the secret works!

Thank you for proving it!

 

[Keikiolu]

Hello. I don’t think this is my first post, but it might be. I am a lifelong Catholic and a newly appointed Lector. My faith and understanding has definitely grown with age. And I’m glad it has. But the main reason for this post is to ask for (name removed by moderator)ut or expertise. I have recently watched a DVD called, The Secret. Has anyone else? It seems to be more motivational in purpose, but does, in-a-way, challenge the Catholic faith and religion in general. I’ll write as if my audience has seen the movie/DVD: in the movie,

it states that all things came from energy,

All things came from God. (Of course.)

Does the movie equate this “energy” with God?

and that all things come from energy,

Once again, is this “energy” being equated with God?

and that energy always existed and was never created.

Well,… God was never created either, so if they’re equating this “energy” with God, then that might have some validity.

BUT,… you have to ask yourself why they don’t just say God, if they mean God. Is it just Political Correctness, or some other motive?

Does that challenge our faith? Or can it be argued that God is energy? Or God created energy? Basically, they say anything is possible, if one simply thinks it and believes—or has faith—it will come to pass. I try to see that this move/theory goes hand in hand with our faith. Can anyone speak on this? (I apologize if my post is incoherent. But I’d be glad to clarify if need be.)

My opinion is that this is the old “Anything that man can conceive and believe he can acheive” philosophy.

Positive thinking, in other words.

The problem with that whole philosophy, of course, is that it’s simply not true, and it offers no assistance in choosing good goals.

Those who are not oriented toward God may, for example, “attract” wealth, but they will drive themselves mad in the process, even if they DO achieve wealth.

In other words, it’s the same kind of “trying to make the universe do what YOU want it to do” technology (sorcery) that leaves out the whole issue of WHAT you should be striving for and HOW you should do that righteously.

That’s what makes it dangerous.

Think,… “Monkey’s Paw”.

Check out Fr. Pacwa’s audio series on “New Age” stuff:
ewtn.com/vondemand/audio/seriessearchprog.asp?seriesID=842969394&T1=new+age

 

[benjoy07]

Hi Keikiolu; To answer your questions, yes. The movie did equate energy with God. They basically said same thing, different labels. But again, God created everything, including energy and this universe, as far as my faith is concerned. The rest of what you posted is reiterated throughout this thread.

I kindly suggest, if you haven’t seen the movie, you should watch it so you can form your own opinion of it.

 

[Keikiolu]

Hi Keikiolu; To answer your questions, yes. The movie did equate energy with God. They basically said same thing, different labels. But again, God created everything, including energy and this universe, as far as my faith is concerned. The rest of what you posted is reiterated throughout this thread.

I kindly suggest, if you haven’t seen the movie, you should watch it so you can form your own opinion of it.

So they’re being politically correct.

Ok then…

Yeah,… I have had people suggest I see it. I’ll have to do that.

Thanks again…!

E pili mau na pomaikai ia oe.

 

[jc-servant]

I happened to watch the panel on Oprah discuss the DVD in question. It was not really controversial or even news to me. Basically, they repeated common advice including focusing on where you want to go instead of the “problem” you feel that you are in. An example was focusing on financial freedom rather than being in debt. It is the old “power of positive thinking” repackaged to make a buck in some ways.

They also said that “like attracts like” which I can somewhat agree with. I can tell you the crabby, backstabbers that I know definitely run off the nice folks and attract more folks just like themselves. I think this is an offshoot of one of my personal “rules” which is “You teach people how to treat you.” I don’t allow people to treat me badly or to treat others badly in my presence which means that those type of people tend to avoid me or to contain their behavior while around me.

A “key” part of the secret was that you cannot just think about the issue, but you must take positive action to make something happen. Gee, like that is news. They said for a woman who has a weight problem that she should not focus on counting calories and obsessing about her weight but rather focus on the real goal which is good health and then do activities that get her to that goal.

Oprah said that after she watched the DVD that she realized she had already been living her life according to the principles for a while. It seems like the woman who put it together tried to use non-offensive touchy-feely language like “energy” instead of “God” or even “higher power” which makes it seem New Agey or just confusing. I finally made sense out of what they were saying when I began substituting God and faith in the appropriate places in their explanation of the principles.

From the bare outline, I can say that my journey home to the Catholic church accomplished the same thing for me as the “secret” in changing how I approach life. I’m still working on it too. I guess I can save the money on the DVD.

 

[Phyll]

Just thought I’d jump in here to let you know that I have seen the movie and listened to most of the book on tape. It sounded pretty good but there were some things that made me a little uneasy. The most troublesome was the claim that the Catholic Church had ban the secret. I was tempted to dismiss my misgivings and just focus on the positive motivational inspiration that was in this, most of which I was already familiar with such as thanksgiving, positive mental attitude, and visualization. (In other words, these are not secrets.) However, I was being asked to show this to my family including my children and, well, I decided I needed to investigate. Here is what I found. Rhonda Byrne speaks about finding the secret in a tattered manuscript that was given to her. The book is entitled “The Science of Getting Rich” by Walter D. Wattles. Wattles was kicked out of the Methodist Church in 1910 because of his heretical views of Jesus. It appears that the law of attraction does not agree with the passion and Wattles believed that if Jesus really was the man that The Church said he was, the whole world would have already been drawn to him. Because this was not the case, the Church must not be holding up a true representation of Christ. Well, that’s one serious red flag. Here is another. The second book that Rhonda Byrne cites as influential to “The Secret” is called “The Master Key System” by Charles F. Haanel. The claim by those reproducing this book on the internet is that it was banned by the Catholic Church I think in the 30’s. In the 1948 list of banned books (The last year it was published because the Church abolished this practice in 1948) neither this book, nor it’s author is listed. False advertising, wouldn’t you say. Regardless, Haanel was apparently very big in Free Masonry which is unabashedly anti-catholic and at it’s roots un-christian. The Genie of the Universe has more in common with the Free Mason’s cosmic reality than with the Holy Trinity. Having discovered this, I am inclined to say that there is a deliberate attempt to muddle the “source” of the secret. In fact, I would say that Satan has taken the truth and twisted it ever so slightly. The secret would have us believe that we are the creators of our own reality. Ask the genie of the universe and we shall receive. Turn our eyes towards ourselves and we shall have everthing we could dream of. I cannot help but thing of the Devil’s temptation of Jesus. What “energy” is the secret tapping into? If it is God, than why not call it God. They claim that Mother Theresa knew the secret (in the movie). Mother Theresa knew Jesus Christ, the same Jesus Christ “who fully reveals Man to himself.” He is not a secret. The Masonic is secret. I would recommend that everyone interested in “The Secret” research the origins of this yourself. You don’t have to dig too deeply to find some pretty smelly stuff. And you can start at the official website for the secret. Remember the power of prayer and the peace of obedience. These will bring you the beatitude of happiness. Not The Secret.
Phyll

 

[Keikiolu]

Just thought I’d {snip}…These will bring you the beatitude of happiness. Not The Secret.
Phyll

Eh, Phyll. Just a “visual comfort” comment.

WHITE SPACE.

It makes things a bit less “staining” to read.

Thankies…!!

 

[benjoy07]

Phyll, thank you for your contribution to this thread. The Secret if anything has caused me to look closer at my faith, which most controversial things do. Funny you mention it, specifically, in your post, “Remember the power of prayer and the peace of obedience. These will bring you the beatitude of happiness.” This thread and the Secret have drawn me to rediscovering exactly those things: power of prayer and faith and the Beatitudes of happiness.

 

[Lissla_Lissar]

We’ve got it at work. It looks like typical Gnostic claptrap to me, just like Conversations with God and Ask and You will Receive… Sure, God wants us to be happy, but not by fulfilling our selfish desires to be really slim/giving us ponies/making us wealthy. The idea isn’t that you’re asking God or Energy or whathaveyou for things and getting them, it’s that we, personally, can get anything we want if we want it in the right way.

I personally have wanted and prayed for lots and lots of things which God (thanks be) hasn’t given me, because they were dumb or harmful.

That’s attempted manipulation of reality for personal gain. That sounds like magical idiocy to me. There is no obedience, no consideration of morality, only unbridled desire.

It reminds me of the Health and Wealth movement, which supposed that because we are sons and daughters of God He wants us to be rich, extremely healthy, and powerful. An amazing ignoring job, really, considering all our healthy wealthy role models- Jesus, John the Baptist, St. Francis, St. Therese, the Desert Fathers…

It’s also a convenient and disgusting way of blaming anyone who is suffering in any way, because the only reason for any sort of poverty, according to those rules, is personal fault- you wouldn’t be in Darfur being murdered if you’d just wanted not to be there in the right way.

Drives me crazy.

 

[aboverubies]

Drives me crazy.

Me too. My DH and I belonged to a “health and wealth, positive thinking, the power is the the tongue” kind of Pentecostal church when our first child was born. He was born severely brain-injured. One pastor told me that this was my fault because “I must have had negative thoughts while I was pregnant” end quote. When he saw my face in reaction to this he said “Oh well, no use crying over spilt milk, now we have to concentrate on getting him healed.” If you want to mess with a person’s mind I can highly recommend this method.

Each week we would return to church with him “still” not healed. People began to talk of “hidden sin” in our life as the reason God had not healed him. Some people stopped talking to us. It was the wake up call that we needed to realise that we were mixed up in something very strange indeed and it was the beginning of our journey home to the Catholic Church. So our dearest little boy, with all his imperfections, was the one who got the ball rolling. My supposed “negative thoughts” have actually brought us untold riches.

Secret schmecret. Here’s the secret. Love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, and all your mind; and love your neighbour as you love yourself.

Excellent post Phyll, thankyou. Welcome to the forums.