DVD: The Secret

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mmm1 said:
A woman on Oprah’s message board made a whistle appear in her bathroom,
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I’m wondering why a whistle?? I know if I wanted something to appear in my bathroom it wouldn’t be a whistle. Maybe a self cleaning toilet, but not a whistle.
 
dmiller125 said:
Fair enough. The material is naturally seculure, but by reading the authors comments when mailed and watching it several times, I would not call this the work of the devil. I believe Jesus is the Universe and He founded the “Law of Attraction”.
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I think the main thing is though that it is contrary to Catholic teaching. So whether or not you want to say it’s the work of the devil isn’t really the point. It is against what our Church says and therefore we should all think long and hard about it:

vatican.net/archive/catechism/p3s2c1a1.htm
2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one’s service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another’s credulity.

and

2123 "Many . . . of our contemporaries either do not at all perceive, or explicitly reject, this intimate and vital bond of man to God. Atheism must therefore be regarded as one of the most serious problems of our time."58

2124 The name “atheism” covers many very different phenomena. One common form is the practical materialism which restricts its needs and aspirations to space and time. Atheistic humanism falsely considers man to be "an end to himself, and the sole maker, with supreme control, of his own history."59 Another form of contemporary atheism looks for the liberation of man through economic and social liberation. "It holds that religion, of its very nature, thwarts such emancipation by raising man’s hopes in a future life, thus both deceiving him and discouraging him from working for a better form of life on earth."60

2125 Since it rejects or denies the existence of God, atheism is a sin against the virtue of religion.61 The imputability of this offense can be significantly diminished in virtue of the intentions and the circumstances. "Believers can have more than a little to do with the rise of atheism. To the extent that they are careless about their instruction in the faith, or present its teaching falsely, or even fail in their religious, moral, or social life, they must be said to conceal rather than to reveal the true nature of God and of religion."62

2126 Atheism is often based on a false conception of human autonomy, exaggerated to the point of refusing any dependence on God.63 Yet, "to acknowledge God is in no way to oppose the dignity of man, since such dignity is grounded and brought to perfection in God. . . . "64 “For the Church knows full well that her message is in harmony with the most secret desires of the human heart.”
 
Hi, fnz2thrght, I’m with you on the self-cleaning toilet thing. I read this on the message boards last week, so it’s hard to remember the details exactly, but a woman was relating how the secret had helped her. She had been thinking her positive thoughts, & had been deciding that either running or walking for exercise would be good for her. She was concerned for her safety, though, & I guess had started visualizing that it would be safer to carry a whistle with her when by herself. Days later, she walked into the bathroom, & there was a whistle. She had absolutely no other way to account for its presence & was chalking it up to the secret.

I’m sure you guys have heard other things that people credit to this, like cures, & $ & condos selling immediately. People are receiving things from supernatural sources that they know nothing about. If you told me 5-10 years ago that I would believe in demons & witchcraft I would have laughed. People who deal with the occult & exorcisms are not laughing.
 
I wasn’t trying to be glib really, I think its as evil as you do. But when you look at what these people are saying it just seems so silly that they’d all be so gullible.

Someone asked me why this is any different from praying. I told them that for one very good reason - I pray that God’s will be done, not mine. And yet, I still get everything I need. Maybe not what I originally thought I wanted but i get what I need. Every time.
 
dmiller125 said:
I should be more specific. When there are ignorant and judgemental challenges about the works of others, that is not the work of God.

Give me one specific instance on how Oprah or The Secret is doing the work of Satan?
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Do you believe that New Age principles can lead people away from Jesus Christ?
 
This is just the latest spin on gnosticism.

See stackblog.wordpress.com/2007/02/21/oprahs-secret-new-old-good-bad/

Professor Stackhouse (although not Catholic) is a great apologist and quite well respected in Christian circles. His is a thorough and balanced perspective. I work in Catholic apologetics and find his review of this book/DVD to be in keeping with the teachings of the Church.

If you’re looking to Oprah for spiritual guidance, clearly you’ll get it …in all the forms she offers over the years. You’re also clearly looking in the wrong place.

This parade of supporters is just the latest on the bandwagon of “successful experts”. Next week it’ll be some other junk to throw in the void that can only be filled with with Christ.
 
Good article. I do see where he’s going with it. I think what he’s getting at (correct me if I’m misunderstanding) is that the Secret is so popular because we’re not using Christianity to fulfill what people are lacking in their lives? That if we used what we know of God’s love for us, then no one would actually need some one like Oprah to guide them. ??
The last point I want to make, though, is not critical of The Secret. It is critical of us Christians. By God’s grace to us, we know better, we know Christ and his gospel of new life, and yet often we have failed to speak to the spiritual realities so skillfully addressed by proponents of The Secret.
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Is that what he’s saying?
 
Hi again, fnz2thrght. Just in case you were responding to me (I wasn’t sure), I didn’t think you were being glib at all. I appreciated the “bathroom humor” almost as much as I would appreciate a self cleaning toilet… People really are being gullible, I agree. I love Ms. Byrne’s advice to avoid heart disease & weight problems…Avoid looking at fat people & imagine yourself trim & fit. I liked your answer about the difference between the secret & prayer. When I was talking about how evil the secret is, I was mentioning that mostly for the benefit of new posters & those not convinced that there’s anything wrong with this. I can see how you probably thought I was trying to convince you, though…
 
I can see how you probably thought I was trying to convince you, though.
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gotcha 🙂 we’re all on the same page.

Now, if I avoid looking at myself in the mirror I wonder if that will help?? lol…
 
Hi, carlc. Thanks for the article. I thought it was interesting also. I have heard of Prof. Stackhouse before, but I’m not sure where.

As someone who works in Catholic apologetics, can I ask you a question? If someone is not Christian or Catholic, how do you explain to them that New Age or occult practices are dangerous? An aspect of the secret that concerns us is that people are taught to ask “The Universe” for things & thank the universe for everything. How do you prove to followers of this that asking the universe is not the same as asking God? There are such wise people on these boards that might also have great answers, but I couldn’t pass up asking someone with your expertise. Thanks!
 
Yep, definitely on the same page, & if we followed Byrne’s logic I’m sure we’d all have to avoid looking in the mirror.

I’m just going to think positively… I’m young, I have no gray roots showing & none of my clothes are currently way too tight.
I’m young, I have no gray roots…
 
dmiller125 said:
I believe Jesus is the Universe and He founded the “Law of Attraction”.
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Code:
My friend, this is pure pantheism. Jesus is not the universe and the the universe is not Jesus. We may see the universe and be in awe and think of of the greatness of God but it is not God. We do not worship God. Here is an article that explains it;

Pantheism

(From Greek pan, all; theos, god). The view according to which God and the world are one. The name pantheist was introduced by John Toland (1670-1722) in his “Socinianism truly Stated” (1705), while pantheism was first used by his opponent Fay in “Defensio Religionis” (1709). Toland published his “Pantheisticon” in 1732. The doctrine itself goes back to the early Indian philosophy; it appears during the course of history in a great variety of forms, and it enters into or draws support from so many other systems that, as Professor Flint says (“Antitheistic Theories”, 334), “there is probably no pure pantheism”. Taken in the strictest sense, i.e. as identifying God and the world, Pantheism is simply Atheism. In any of its forms it involves Monism, but the latter is not necessarily pantheistic. Emanationism may easily take on a pantheistic meaning and as pointed out in the Encyclical “Pascendi dominici gregis”, the same is true of the modern doctrine of immanence.

newadvent.org/cathen/11447b.htm

If He was the author of the law of attraction then why was He persecuted? why was he tortured and then crucifed and died a very cruel death? Was it because He was negative? Maybe someone can shed light on this…

This is an interesting article how this is all happening from the papal retreat no less…

zenit.org/english/visualizza.phtml?sid=103757
 
Wow, Shoshana, thanks again! You find the best links. I appreciated your comments on the universe & pantheism, very helpful! The article about the papal retreat was very appropriate. I would agree that the secret clearly seeks to “dilute the salvific event” & can affect or destroy one’s personal relationship with Jesus.
 
Wow that Zenit article really hits the nail on the head. Wow! I have goose bumps reading it as it exactly what I have been feeling. have I said Wow!
 
People think Oprah is so generous for all that she gives, too bad it’s all a write-off. If you are making that much money, you have to donate to keep the IRS off your back. Then she spends a quarter million (maybe more) on her B-Day party, i’m sure nobody could have used that money to live. She’s is such a hypocrite, don’t believe the hype.

The Right Hand should not see what the Left Hand is doing, right?
 
This is the original “Self Help” book.
Read this book to learn how to:

Control Your Anger
Avoid Becoming Overly Anxious
Overcome Selfishness and Jealosy
Pray Productively
And Much More!
This book is a guide to spiritual wellbeing and a deeper, more loving relationship with God.

ccel.org/ccel/desales/devout_life.html
 
Passion33 said:
People think Oprah is so generous for all that she gives, too bad it’s all a write-off. If you are making that much money, you have to donate to keep the IRS off your back. Then she spends a quarter million (maybe more) on her B-Day party, i’m sure nobody could have used that money to live. She’s is such a hypocrite, don’t believe the hype.

The Right Hand should not see what the Left Hand is doing, right?
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On one hand, you’re definitely right in that last sentence. But on the other hand, we shouldn’t judge Oprah’s motives for donating to charity and for being so vocal about it. Remember, Oprah is very influential, and many people (women especially) look up to her and want to be like her. Taking that into consideration, there could be a positive effect from Oprah being public about her charitable donations, because it could influence others who normally wouldn’t donate to charity, to do so (thinking, if Oprah’s donating money to help children in Africa, maybe I should look into doing that as well, or even donate to one of her charities). So while I agree that she does sometimes throw her money around too much (who has a cake made for a party that’s covered in 24-carat gold?) but she could very well be having a positive impact on her viewers as far as giving to charity is concerned. 🙂
 
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