Eat pork lose salvation??!!

[Rexpi]

Hey all,
My husband has a coworker who is seventh day adventist. A very convinced and outspoken one at that. They were talking about high protein diets and the such…then he followed my husband after and asked if he was Christian. My husband said yes. Then he told my husband that in Isaiah it says, those who eat pork shall not inherit the kingdom of heaven. He told my husband that God’s law does not change.
So, I am trying to succintly correct him. I know that in Christ the old law is fulfilled and that we are not obliged to the old Jewish Law ie circumcision. But, my question is this…Christ said he did not come to take one iota away from the law??
I happen to be reading Isaiah and I couldn’t find anything that says this. I do know in Leviticus there are tons of dietary laws, but from what I understand, again, that is all part of the old laws.
Can somebody please help me understand this and get this straight. I get the feeling this can become a great opportunity to evangelize the true church to this gentleman. Also, so many outside the church think Catholics do not know scripture and just get caught up in the saints and such. I would really like to share the beauty of the faith with him. God bless and thanks.

Peace

Hello Monica, I’m a SDA and would like to comment a few things in regards to what you said.

This friend of your husband was probably refering to Isaiah 66:17 in which states that pork is actually an abomination.
Now, God’s law (Ten commandments) havent changed at all. Many people say that when Jesus died, he nailed the 10 commandments on the cross… but there is a problem when people say this since the bible is clear to say that the law that was nailed was Moses law or the ceremonial laws and it actually makes sence. Let me explain a little bit more… Do you know about the Sanctuary? The one that God itself explain to Moses how to build up. Well, in this one, all the ceremonial laws were made in order for people to understand what Jesus would have to do in the future (for our salvation). You can read it in Exodus. Anyways, once you study the sanctuary, you will notice that this building had 3 parts: The courtyard, the Holy place and the Most Holy place… Inside of the Most Holy place was the Ark of the covenant which contains the 10 commandments plus a plate with manna and the rod of Aaron. The presence of God itself was in this place, in top of the Ark and showing as a light called Shekinah. Now, the ceremonial laws were found in a side pocket of the ark. Obviously the 10 commandments are much more important than the ceremonial laws were.
So, when Jesus died in the cross, he was a perfect sacrifice, no more lambs have to die, no more ceremonial laws pointing to our Saviour since He, our Saviour, was giving His perfect life for us… and thats why you can ead in the gospels that when Jesus die, the curtains that divided the Holy place from the Most Holy place in the temple were cut down, from top to bottom! Representing that no more ceremonial laws had to be kept. You can read it yourself its really impressive. Now, you said Christ said he did not come to take one iota away from the law, thats correct.
I can explain to you more about the covenant and new covenant if you please, since there are such a confusion about this topic and the bible is so clear concerning this point.
I hope you find all this in the bible, dont believe anything if it is no written, go and check it out with your bible. You can also read Hebrews chapter 8, 9 and you gonna be amazed, since you will notice there is a Sanctuary in Heaven, and the sanctuary on earth was just a shadow or a copy of the one in Heaven… but thats another topic.

Have a great day!

 

[benidict]

Hello Monica, I’m a SDA and would like to comment a few things in regards to what you said.

This friend of your husband was probably refering to Isaiah 66:17 in which states that pork is actually an abomination.
Now, God’s law (Ten commandments) havent changed at all. Many people say that when Jesus died, he nailed the 10 commandments on the cross… but there is a problem when people say this since the bible is clear to say that the law that was nailed was Moses law or the ceremonial laws and it actually makes sence. Let me explain a little bit more… Do you know about the Sanctuary? The one that God itself explain to Moses how to build up. Well, in this one, all the ceremonial laws were made in order for people to understand what Jesus would have to do in the future (for our salvation). You can read it in Exodus. Anyways, once you study the sanctuary, you will notice that this building had 3 parts: The courtyard, the Holy place and the Most Holy place… Inside of the Most Holy place was the Ark of the covenant which contains the 10 commandments plus a plate with manna and the rod of Aaron. The presence of God itself was in this place, in top of the Ark and showing as a light called Shekinah. Now, the ceremonial laws were found in a side pocket of the ark. Obviously the 10 commandments are much more important than the ceremonial laws were.
So, when Jesus died in the cross, he was a perfect sacrifice, no more lambs have to die, no more ceremonial laws pointing to our Saviour since He, our Saviour, was giving His perfect life for us… and thats why you can ead in the gospels that when Jesus die, the curtains that divided the Holy place from the Most Holy place in the temple were cut down, from top to bottom! Representing that no more ceremonial laws had to be kept. You can read it yourself its really impressive. Now, you said Christ said he did not come to take one iota away from the law, thats correct.
I can explain to you more about the covenant and new covenant if you please, since there are such a confusion about this topic and the bible is so clear concerning this point.
I hope you find all this in the bible, dont believe anything if it is no written, go and check it out with your bible. You can also read Hebrews chapter 8, 9 and you gonna be amazed, since you will notice there is a Sanctuary in Heaven, and the sanctuary on earth was just a shadow or a copy of the one in Heaven… but thats another topic.

Have a great day!

actually, the ark of the covenant, typifies Mary, the Blessed Mother. but like you said my friend, that another topic. just had to throw that in there. sorry. but are you going to get into the the cleansing of the sanctuary teachings by ellen g. white? this should be interesting. looking forward to seeing where this goes my friend. Peace

 

[benidict]

Hello Monica, I’m a SDA and would like to comment a few things in regards to what you said.

This friend of your husband was probably refering to Isaiah 66:17 in which states that pork is actually an abomination.
Now, God’s law (Ten commandments) havent changed at all. Many people say that when Jesus died, he nailed the 10 commandments on the cross… but there is a problem when people say this since the bible is clear to say that the law that was nailed was Moses law or the ceremonial laws and it actually makes sence. Let me explain a little bit more… Do you know about the Sanctuary? The one that God itself explain to Moses how to build up. Well, in this one, all the ceremonial laws were made in order for people to understand what Jesus would have to do in the future (for our salvation). You can read it in Exodus. Anyways, once you study the sanctuary, you will notice that this building had 3 parts: The courtyard, the Holy place and the Most Holy place… Inside of the Most Holy place was the Ark of the covenant which contains the 10 commandments plus a plate with manna and the rod of Aaron. The presence of God itself was in this place, in top of the Ark and showing as a light called Shekinah. Now, the ceremonial laws were found in a side pocket of the ark. Obviously the 10 commandments are much more important than the ceremonial laws were.
So, when Jesus died in the cross, he was a perfect sacrifice, no more lambs have to die, no more ceremonial laws pointing to our Saviour since He, our Saviour, was giving His perfect life for us… and thats why you can ead in the gospels that when Jesus die, the curtains that divided the Holy place from the Most Holy place in the temple were cut down, from top to bottom! Representing that no more ceremonial laws had to be kept. You can read it yourself its really impressive. Now, you said Christ said he did not come to take one iota away from the law, thats correct.
I can explain to you more about the covenant and new covenant if you please, since there are such a confusion about this topic and the bible is so clear concerning this point.
I hope you find all this in the bible, dont believe anything if it is no written, go and check it out with your bible. You can also read Hebrews chapter 8, 9 and you gonna be amazed, since you will notice there is a Sanctuary in Heaven, and the sanctuary on earth was just a shadow or a copy of the one in Heaven… but thats another topic.

Have a great day!

i agree with you my friend. lets consult the bible. the only burden placed on the gentiles by the apostles in reguard to food, is that they do not eat meat, that had been sacrificed to idols, and animals that had been strangled, and meat with the blood still in it. and to abstain from sexual immorality. this can be found in acts 15:29. the apostles exercised their authority on this matter early on in Church history. sda beliefs do not trump what the apostles have already laid down. ill be interested in your thoughts. Peace

 

[Sam_777]

I’m a SDA

sda beliefs do not trump what the apostles have already laid down.

I always find that SDA is the closest to the Islamic law…

 

[benidict]

I always find that SDA is the closest to the Islamic law…

hi sam. that is an interesting observation. please elaborate. Peace

 

[Sam_777]

hi sam. that is an interesting observation. please elaborate. Peace

Most SDA “culture and practices” are found in Islam, such as:

“Obedience to these laws means abstinence from pork, shellfish, and other foods proscribed as “unclean”. The church discourages its members from the use of alcohol, tobacco or illegal drugs”

"The official Adventist position on abortion is that “abortions for reasons of birth control, gender selection, or convenience are not condoned by the Church.”

“Adventists do not perform same-sex marriages and homosexual men cannot be ordained.”

“Adventists have traditionally held socially conservative attitudes regarding dress and entertainment.”

“Accordingly, many Adventists are opposed to practices such as body piercing and tattoos. More traditionally conservative Adventists refrain from the wearing of jewelry altogether, including such items as earrings and bracelets.”

“Conservative Adventists also avoid certain recreational activities which are considered to be a negative spiritual influence, including dancing, rock music and secular theatre.”

“The Adventist church officially opposes the practice of gambling.”

 

[Shin]

Most SDA “culture and practices” are found in Islam, such as:

“Obedience to these laws means abstinence from pork, shellfish, and other foods proscribed as “unclean”. The church discourages its members from the use of alcohol, tobacco or illegal drugs”

"The official Adventist position on abortion is that “abortions for reasons of birth control, gender selection, or convenience are not condoned by the Church.”

“Adventists do not perform same-sex marriages and homosexual men cannot be ordained.”

“Adventists have traditionally held socially conservative attitudes regarding dress and entertainment.”

“Accordingly, many Adventists are opposed to practices such as body piercing and tattoos. More traditionally conservative Adventists refrain from the wearing of jewelry altogether, including such items as earrings and bracelets.”

“Conservative Adventists also avoid certain recreational activities which are considered to be a negative spiritual influence, including dancing, rock music and secular theatre.”

“The Adventist church officially opposes the practice of gambling.”

Sounds like traditional Catholicism in many ways.

The courtyard, the Holy place and the Most Holy place… Inside of the Most Holy place was the Ark of the covenant which contains the 10 commandments plus a plate with manna and the rod of Aaron.

This is traditional church design for Catholics - vestibule is the courtyard I believe, the holy place, then the sanctuary where the tabernacle is which contains the Eucharist, the Lord Jesus Christ, the Word of God.

Each should lead in a straight line holier and holier to this, as a bridge to Heaven from Earth.

 

[Renko]

Seventh day adventists are a bit strange and they hate Catholics. They used to mail me magazines that cut down the Catholic church in every one.

 

[benidict]

Seventh day adventists are a bit strange and they hate Catholics. They used to mail me magazines that cut down the Catholic church in every one.

hi renko. i dont think its cause they hate us. they believe that all denominations, that follow Romes practice of sunday worship have the mark of the beast, and are of the anti-christ. the problem with this is, that the text they use, have nothing to do with the end times, and have to do with the time of antiochus epiphenous in the book of maccabees. also it should be pointed out, that sda rises or falls on the visions of e.g. white. and she has come into question in recent years, because researchers have found out, she may have suffered from complex seizure disorder. which produced her visions. my daughter has the same condition, with similar symptoms. also it must be asked if her teachings trump the apostles teachings. Peace

 

[Sam_777]

Sam_777;6566875:

Most SDA "culture and practices

" are found in Islam, such as:

“Obedience to these laws means abstinence from pork, shellfish, and other foods proscribed as “unclean”. The church discourages its members from the use of alcohol, tobacco or illegal drugs”

"The official Adventist position on abortion is that “abortions for reasons of birth control, gender selection, or convenience are not condoned by the Church.”

“Adventists do not perform same-sex marriages and homosexual men cannot be ordained.”

“Adventists have traditionally held socially conservative attitudes regarding dress and entertainment.”

“Accordingly, many Adventists are opposed to practices such as body piercing and tattoos. More traditionally conservative Adventists refrain from the wearing of jewelry altogether, including such items as earrings and bracelets.”

“Conservative Adventists also avoid certain recreational activities which are considered to be a negative spiritual influence, including dancing, rock music and secular theatre.”

“The Adventist church officially opposes the practice of gambling.”

Sounds like traditional Catholicism in many ways.

I love to hear that .

And that it expected from a devoted Christian like you Shin…

 

[Izdaari]

Read the Letters of St Paul to the Hebrews. It clears up misconceptions about the imperfection of Mosaic Law and the perfection in Jesus Christ. For we know that Jesus Christ is GOD himself made man. Therefore his law supercedes any Law given by GOD to the Jews. And dietary laws have been done away with - (Except for fast and abstinence laws of course)

Also Romans and Galatians. I’m afraid your SDA friends are part of the more extreme wing of the SDA, and would fall under the category of Judaizers. More liberal (relatively) SDA folk are more reasonable.

 

[Izdaari]

Hello Monica, I’m a SDA and would like to comment a few things in regards to what you said.

This friend of your husband was probably refering to Isaiah 66:17 in which states that pork is actually an abomination.
Now, God’s law (Ten commandments) havent changed at all. Many people say that when Jesus died, he nailed the 10 commandments on the cross… but there is a problem when people say this since the bible is clear to say that the law that was nailed was Moses law or the ceremonial laws and it actually makes sence. Let me explain a little bit more… Do you know about the Sanctuary? The one that God itself explain to Moses how to build up. Well, in this one, all the ceremonial laws were made in order for people to understand what Jesus would have to do in the future (for our salvation). You can read it in Exodus. Anyways, once you study the sanctuary, you will notice that this building had 3 parts: The courtyard, the Holy place and the Most Holy place… Inside of the Most Holy place was the Ark of the covenant which contains the 10 commandments plus a plate with manna and the rod of Aaron. The presence of God itself was in this place, in top of the Ark and showing as a light called Shekinah. Now, the ceremonial laws were found in a side pocket of the ark. Obviously the 10 commandments are much more important than the ceremonial laws were.
So, when Jesus died in the cross, he was a perfect sacrifice, no more lambs have to die, no more ceremonial laws pointing to our Saviour since He, our Saviour, was giving His perfect life for us… and thats why you can ead in the gospels that when Jesus die, the curtains that divided the Holy place from the Most Holy place in the temple were cut down, from top to bottom! Representing that no more ceremonial laws had to be kept. You can read it yourself its really impressive. Now, you said Christ said he did not come to take one iota away from the law, thats correct.
I can explain to you more about the covenant and new covenant if you please, since there are such a confusion about this topic and the bible is so clear concerning this point.
I hope you find all this in the bible, dont believe anything if it is no written, go and check it out with your bible. You can also read Hebrews chapter 8, 9 and you gonna be amazed, since you will notice there is a Sanctuary in Heaven, and the sanctuary on earth was just a shadow or a copy of the one in Heaven… but thats another topic.

Have a great day!

You make a good case for the 10 commandments still being valid, however the prohibition on eating pork is part of the ceremonial law, and not in the 10 commandments.

 

[Rexpi]

You make a good case for the 10 commandments still being valid, however the prohibition on eating pork is part of the ceremonial law, and not in the 10 commandments.

Hi there, thanks for your comment.I have to disagree with you in saying that eating pork was part of the ceremonial laws… Ceremonial laws were the ones God gave to moses in order to run the Sanctuary an its festivities. Eating pork as well as other healthy issues were giving as a moral code for God’s people. Remember that He wanted to have a different people from the rest of pagan cultures and so He gave these rules. Moreover, God didnt even want to give them meat… God’s original plan for us in found in the garden of Eden, isnt it? Genesis 1:29 , 2:16 for example… “And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed… and every tree… yielding seed.” "Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat’
The diet God gave people in the beginning was fruit, grains, and nuts. Vegetables were added a bit later (Genesis 3:18)
Another interesting thing to mention in regards unclean and clean animals is that way before Sinai they were mention. Check Genesis 7:1, 2 “And the Lord said unto Noah,… Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens… and of beasts that are not clean by two.” So, the Bible has ample evidence that there were clean and unclean animals from the very dawn of Creation. Noah lived long before any jews existed, but he knew of the clean and unclean, because he took into the ark the clean animals by 7s and the unclean by 2s. Revelation 18:2 refers to some birds as being unclean just before the second coming of Jesus.
The death of Christ had not altering effect whatever on these health laws, since the Bible says that all who break them will be destroyed when Jesus returns (Isaiah 66: 15 - 17). The Jews stomach and digestive system in no way differs from that of a Gentile. These health laws are there for all people, for all time.
I’m being vegeterian now, I wasnt before but I realise in heaven wont be death, so it wont be meat at all… so I better get use to eating healthy haha. But also I believe, by eating healthy and not just eating but sleeping well, not smoking and things like that your mind is actually clearer, and through your mind is that you comunicate and have a relationship with God.

I hope I didnt bore you by writting so much , have a great day mate

 

[choy]

i know that most of the Levitical Laws also seek to distance the Jews from practices of pagans. God recognizes that their faith was weak back then and they are easily enticed to pagan beliefs and practices.

perhaps the Israelites didn’t have any pigs with them and would have to trade with pagan nations to obtain pork, that is why its banned altogether? exposure to this trade would lure them into pagan practices.

many of the things that were fobidden were not evil in itself but would cause the Israelites to mingle and mix with pagans. on another thread theres a discussion on interracial marriage and this was banned by Levitical law as well. not that interracial marriage in itself is a sin, but because back then there were no other nation that believed in God, only the Israelites. so if they married with someone from a foreign land, they are marrying a pagan, and the one marrying would either become pagan themselves, or the pagan practices of the spouse would be introduced into Israel. that is what was being avoided by God. i’m assuming eating of pork had the same significance

 

[benidict]

Hi there, thanks for your comment.I have to disagree with you in saying that eating pork was part of the ceremonial laws… Ceremonial laws were the ones God gave to moses in order to run the Sanctuary an its festivities. Eating pork as well as other healthy issues were giving as a moral code for God’s people. Remember that He wanted to have a different people from the rest of pagan cultures and so He gave these rules. Moreover, God didnt even want to give them meat… God’s original plan for us in found in the garden of Eden, isnt it? Genesis 1:29 , 2:16 for example… “And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed… and every tree… yielding seed.” "Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat’
The diet God gave people in the beginning was fruit, grains, and nuts. Vegetables were added a bit later (Genesis 3:18)
Another interesting thing to mention in regards unclean and clean animals is that way before Sinai they were mention. Check Genesis 7:1, 2 “And the Lord said unto Noah,… Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens… and of beasts that are not clean by two.” So, the Bible has ample evidence that there were clean and unclean animals from the very dawn of Creation. Noah lived long before any jews existed, but he knew of the clean and unclean, because he took into the ark the clean animals by 7s and the unclean by 2s. Revelation 18:2 refers to some birds as being unclean just before the second coming of Jesus.
The death of Christ had not altering effect whatever on these health laws, since the Bible says that all who break them will be destroyed when Jesus returns (Isaiah 66: 15 - 17). The Jews stomach and digestive system in no way differs from that of a Gentile. These health laws are there for all people, for all time.
I’m being vegeterian now, I wasnt before but I realise in heaven wont be death, so it wont be meat at all… so I better get use to eating healthy haha. But also I believe, by eating healthy and not just eating but sleeping well, not smoking and things like that your mind is actually clearer, and through your mind is that you comunicate and have a relationship with God.

I hope I didnt bore you by writting so much , have a great day mate

romans 14:2 one mans faith allows him to eat all things, but he who is weak eatheth herbs. so how can you say, that God will destroy all those that eat certain things when Jesus returns. this is in direct contridiction to Clear apostolic teaching. also i have discussed this with Jews in the past. the dietary laws were given to keep the nation of israel alive in an era, where they did not have sanitary practices, and could not transport foods that would spoil over the journey. such as shell fish. etc. does the sda allow its members to eat lobsterl,shrimp, or oysters? also swine could not be cleaned up like they are able to do today. the prohibition against eating blood in the new testament, is placed there because that is considered the life of the animal. also you cannot get around the pathogens that are found in blood, unless the meat is well cooked. Jews actually salt the meat, to get all the blood out. and the Jewish people have no problem with the “clean” meats as long as they are not mixed with dairy. such as a cheese burger and such. in orthodox Jewish house holds, they actually have 2 sinks, and 2 sets of cubbards, to separate the vessels which hold dairy products, and meat products. sorry this is long. Peace