Eating meat on Friday a mortal sin?

[jemfinch]

Yes eating Meat on Fridays was a Mortal sin and you had to tell it in Confesion.

I wish people would be more specific in their statements.

It’s violating the precept of the Church that’s mortal sin. The precepts of the Church change, and one of the ways in which they’ve changed is the prescribed days of abstinence. Eating meat on Fridays during Lent today is just as much a violation of the precept of the Church as eating meat on any Friday was before the USCCB changed the precepts regarding Friday abstinence.

I wouldn’t be such a stickler, but saying “It used to be the case that eating meat on Fridays was mortal sin” (apart from being additionally imprecise by saying “mortal sin” instead of “grave matter”) really trivializes the actual issue: that someone who knows the precept of the Church and willfully chooses to violate it has sinned mortally not because they happened to consume meat, but because they have rejected the authority of the Church established by Christ on earth.

It was one of the laws of the Church and I think it was changed at the Second Vatican Council.

Other people have quoted the changes here, and they aren’t from Vatican II

Jeremy

 

[thistle]

I’ve already linked to a page that seems very clearly to emphasize that penance on Fridays outside of Lent is voluntary. Instead of just restating your claims without substantiation and adding to the confusion, perhaps you can argue against the claims made to the contrary.

EDIT: Pardon, that was in a different thread.

Jeremy

I would have thought CCC 1438 and Can. 1249-1253 were clear enough. However, if you want additional substantiation, according to the Church’s law, “**the substantial observance **of Fridays as days of penance, whether by abstinence or in other ways, is a grave obligation”(Paenitemini, Norm II, 2).

 

[bobzills]

I would have thought CCC 1438 and Can. 1249-1253 were clear enough. However, if you want additional substantiation, according to the Church’s law, “**the substantial observance **of Fridays as days of penance, whether by abstinence or in other ways, is a grave obligation”(Paenitemini, Norm II, 2).

So if you eat a hot dog on Friday and you don’t do a penance or work of charity, is that a mortal sin?

 

[Inman]

I’m a new convert.

I wasn’t aware that I was required, other than in Lent, to do anything in particular on Fridays.

Would you all think attending a daily mass on Friday would be suffcient penance? Or is the celebration of the eucharist not appropriate as a penance?

 

[LilyM]

I’m a new convert.

I wasn’t aware that I was required, other than in Lent, to do anything in particular on Fridays.

Would you all think attending a daily mass on Friday would be suffcient penance? Or is the celebration of the eucharist not appropriate as a penance?

Attending daily Mass on Fridays is a brilliant idea - it’s the supreme form of prayer and the supreme sacrificial offering. Certainly every bit as good as, probably better than, a Rosary.

We tend to see the word ‘penance’ and automatically think it means depriving ourselves of something. And in a sense it does.

But don’t forget that acts of charity (giving to the poor or homeless or what have you) and extra prayer or scripture reading or whatever are also appropriate ways of fulfilling the Friday obligation.

In these cases we ‘give up’ the time or money it takes to do them which could otherwise be spent on ourselves.

 

[Apryl]

I wish people would be more specific in their statements.

Help me out here: what was it that you were correcting with your post?

 

[Apryl]

So if you eat a hot dog on Friday and you don’t do a penance or work of charity, is that a mortal sin?

Yes.

One must observe Friday as a day of Penance.

If you don’t do a penance, you have violated a precept of the church.

You know that it’s a precept of the church, but you don’t observe it? That’s the mortal sin.

It’s ‘a bad thing’ to not do what you aren’t supposed to do. It’s a MORTAL SIN to KNOW what you are supposed to do (or not do) and go against that.

Is it really that big of a deal to refrain from meat, or do some penitential act, ONE day out of the week? Christ DID die on the Cross for you, didn’t he?

(Sorry to be preachy, but man… this is a lot of discussion on something that’s so minute!)

 

[bobzills]

Yes.

One must observe Friday as a day of Penance.

If you don’t do a penance, you have violated a precept of the church.

You know that it’s a precept of the church, but you don’t observe it? That’s the mortal sin.

It’s ‘a bad thing’ to not do what you aren’t supposed to do. It’s a MORTAL SIN to KNOW what you are supposed to do (or not do) and go against that.

Is it really that big of a deal to refrain from meat, or do some penitential act, ONE day out of the week? Christ DID die on the Cross for you, didn’t he?

(Sorry to be preachy, but man… this is a lot of discussion on something that’s so minute!)

No it’s not a big deal. It is just that I was told differently, that the penance is voluntary. Now you say that the penance is mandatory and if it is a mortal sin, then the person could go to hell if he omitted the penance. So it is a big difference: in one case someone says it is voluntary, in another case someone says it is mandatory.

 

[Apryl]

I’m a new convert.

I wasn’t aware that I was required, other than in Lent, to do anything in particular on Fridays.

Would you all think attending a daily mass on Friday would be suffcient penance? Or is the celebration of the eucharist not appropriate as a penance?

I would never have considered going to mass a ‘penance’ - Thankfully, I was never given going to mass as a punishment from mmy family.

However, if it’s a struggle for you - I really want to make it to a movie, but I can’t because I’m going to mass, or if you are doing it because you want to make sure that your children are attending every day, and … well, sometimes, preparing children for mass is a penitential act - I’m sure you could say that.

Also, don’t forget: if you were not aware that it was a requirement, it’s not a Mortal Sin. It’s a ‘not so good thing’, but you were in no way held culpable, as you didn’t know.

I would suggest that you pray, and try to discern, if, for you, attending mass is really some penitent act.

Just like, I grew up not eating meat on Fridays, but sometimes, that meant a Lobster dinner, or shrimp fried rice (whoo wee!). Sorry, that ain’t penitent! It was just menu planning:blush:

Don’t make this some huge albatross. It’s an act to remind you of the sacrifice that Christ made for us. The ULTIMATE sacrifice. And it’s a special way of Thanking God.

If you think you are doing a sufficient job in going to mass, and you have seriously thought about it, prayed, and discerned, I don’t know that any one can tell you ‘that’s not enough’.

Again, if you don’t think it’s a sacrifice, then you would be less than honest to try to tell yourself, or any one else, that it is.

I hope that makes sense to someone other than to me.

 

[Apryl]

No it’s not a big deal. It is just that I was told differently, that the penance is voluntary. Now you say that the penance is mandatory and if it is a mortal sin, then the person could go to hell if he omitted the penance. So it is a big difference: in one case someone says it is voluntary, in another case someone says it is mandatory.

The penance is still mandatory (that has never changed)

The ONLY way to show the penance used to be the abstention from meat. Now, one may abstain from meat, or one MAY do something else. This is what has changed.

You didn’t know. Without knowledge, awareness, you can’t be guilty of a mortal sin.

Now, you know.

“Go and sin no more”

 

[bobzills]

The penance is still mandatory (that has never changed)

The ONLY way to show the penance used to be the abstention from meat. Now, one may abstain from meat, or one MAY do something else. This is what has changed.

You didn’t know. Without knowledge, awareness, you can’t be guilty of a mortal sin.

Now, you know.

“Go and sin no more”

Sorry, but in this area, we are told that the penance is voluntary and it is not a sin if you don;t do the penance.

 

[TMC]

It’s ‘a bad thing’ to not do what you aren’t supposed to do. It’s a MORTAL SIN to KNOW what you are supposed to do (or not do) and go against that.

It is not always a MORTAL SIN to know what you are supposed to do and do otherwise. This would transform virtually all sins into mortal sins. This is why the mortal/venial distinction is so problematic. Sin doesn’t work that way. All sin damages our relationship with God. All sins damage the relationship in different ways and different degrees. Sin cannot really be sorted out into two piles, but the Church attempts to do so so because we as sinners insist on creating categories, and insist on some guidance on when we are “really” in trouble.

Recognizing this, the Church has defined Mortal Sin but has always declined to provide a list of mortal sins. The definition is that sin that is so harmful and so contray to the principles of Christian life that it destroys charity and effectively acts as a refusal of Sanctifying Grace is “Mortal”. No one can say that a particular sin is or is not mortal. There are some sins that we generally presume to be mortal (like murder) but that is merely a presumption and not a conclusion. I don’t believe that disobeying the semi-voluntary Friday obligation is one of them.

 

[Inman]

I would never have considered going to mass a ‘penance’ - Thankfully, I was never given going to mass as a punishment from mmy family.

. . .

However, if it’s a struggle for you - I really want to make it to a movie, but I can’t because I’m going to mass, or if you are doing it because you want to make sure that your children are attending every day, and … well, sometimes, preparing children for mass is a penitential act - I’m sure you could say that.

Thanks for the insight and that of the other poster that responded. I really enjoy going to mass, but I don’t regularly go to daily mass so in that sense it would be extra.

The mass on Friday is at lunch time and since the guys at our office usually go for barbeque on Fridays, it would mean giving up the social time spent with collegues, along with the pulled pork.

 

[jemfinch]

Help me out here: what was it that you were correcting with your post?

You’ll have to read farther than the first sentence to find out

Jeremy

 

[mediatrixx]

I didn’t know about this. It’s not a mortal sin since I didn’t have foreknowledge, is it?

 

[Sir_Knight]

No, but you know about it NOW. So, from this point forward …

 

[lizaanne]

I hope that makes sense to someone other than to me.

Apryl - every single thing you have said here makes 100% perfect sense.

I can not understand why it is so freaking difficult to do penance ONE DAY A WEEK!!! It is unbelievable how many people try to squirm out of this. For cryin’ out loud - just give up the lousy burger or whatever on Friday, it really is not that big a deal once you get used to planning for it. Honestly - do we really have to disect this constantly and to this level?

Christ hung on a cross for us - the least we can do is make a personal sacrifice once a week to acknowledge this.

Sheesh.

~Liza

 

[TMC]

Apryl - every single thing you have said here makes 100% perfect sense.

I can not understand why it is so freaking difficult to do penance ONE DAY A WEEK!!! It is unbelievable how many people try to squirm out of this. For cryin’ out loud - just give up the lousy burger or whatever on Friday, it really is not that big a deal once you get used to planning for it. Honestly - do we really have to disect this constantly and to this level?

Christ hung on a cross for us - the least we can do is make a personal sacrifice once a week to acknowledge this.

Sheesh.

~Liza

I agree. I jumped in here mostly because I think that the term “Mortal Sin” is being misapplied. But the real point is that we should strive to always do what is right, and not weigh our actions depending on the expected punishment. I think in general people worry too much about which sins are bad, and which are super-bad. In little kid soccer we tell them “Don’t look at the score, just play hard every play.” Do your best, seek reconciliation when you inevitably fall short, don’t worry about the score.

 

[Apryl]

You’ll have to read farther than the first sentence to find out

Jeremy

I did read farther than the first sentence.

'Smatter of fact, I read it in its entirety.

I didn’t see what you were ‘correcting’. Since I read it, and didn’t see it, and don’t want to make any assumptions, I asked you for clarification.

That said, care to make the clarification now? Or did you ever have a point to begin with?

(I can go 'round and 'round with you on this for forever. But that wouldn’t be productive)

 

[thistle]

No it’s not a big deal. It is just that I was told differently, that the penance is voluntary. Now you say that the penance is mandatory and if it is a mortal sin, then the person could go to hell if he omitted the penance. So it is a big difference: in one case someone says it is voluntary, in another case someone says it is mandatory.

How many times do we have to tell you before you get it??
Here it is again:

According to the Church’s law, “the substantial observance of Fridays as days of penance, whether by abstinence or in other ways, is a grave obligation”(Paenitemini, Norm II, 2).

Penance on Fridays is NOT voluntary. It is mandatory but you are free to choose the type of penance you do. Stop arguing with us. You asked for substantiation and we have given it.
Refer the source documents we have given you to a priest and come back and tell us what he says.