Ecumenism: Baptists & Episcopalians

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EvangelCatholic said:
episcopaldigitalnetwork.com/ens/2013/05/23/baptists-and-episcopalians-celebrate-season-of-combined-worship/

Interesting article of how two quite different Christian churches can come together for worship including the Eucharist. If Baptists can accept weekly Communion than I think major progress is being made among Christians.

Any thoughts?
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While its great whenever Christians of different traditions come together, Episcopalians and many Baptists already practice open communion. That is nothing new.
 
ltwin said:
While its great whenever Christians of different traditions come together, Episcopalians and many Baptists already practice open communion. That is nothing new.
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Agree. But in this situation Baptists and Episcopalians are worshiping together. Both pastors and congregations following a liturgical tradition that means weekly Eucharist. Baptists being exposed to catholic worship. Episcopalians singing Gospel music. It is a mutual blend of different Christian expressions.
 
EvangelCatholic said:
Agree. But in this situation Baptists and Episcopalians are worshiping together. Both pastors and congregations following a liturgical tradition that means weekly Eucharist. Baptists being exposed to catholic worship. Episcopalians singing Gospel music. It is a mutual blend of different Christian expressions.
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I love it when despite differences, people of faith among the Christian family can come together to worship He Whom they believe is their mutual Lord and Savior and share in His supper at His table. Families differ yet remain family and break bread together. Granted though I speak as a non Catholic as I know Catholics do not believe the Communion shared by the Baptists and Episcopalians is the valid Eucharist.
 
ltwin said:
While its great whenever Christians of different traditions come together, Episcopalians and many Baptists already practice open communion. That is nothing new.
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True they practice open communion and turn no one away. But I’ve been told by an Episcopal priest that TEC at least officially believes in the physical real presence of Christ’s body and blood and when communicants at an Episcopal-only service respond to “The Body of Christ, the Bread of Heaven, the Blood of Christ, the Cup of Salvation”, with “Amen”, that they affirm “I believe”. Though no one is at the altar interrogating anyone when they come forward and if anyone feels so called to receive, then so be it. Baptists though I didn’t think in their Baptist-only services affirm the physical real presence. So I still think it’s a wonderful thing when people of Christian faith but of such different faith traditions can come together. That despite differences, still can come together to unite in worshiping the One most important of all, whom they believe is Christ their Lord and Savior.
 
Christian_Soul said:
True they practice open communion and turn no one away. But I’ve been told by an Episcopal priest that TEC at least officially believes in the physical real presence of Christ’s body and blood and when communicants at an Episcopal-only service respond to “The Body of Christ, the Bread of Heaven, the Blood of Christ, the Cup of Salvation”, with “Amen”, that they affirm “I believe”. Though no one is at the altar interrogating anyone when they come forward and if anyone feels so called to receive, then so be it. Baptists though I didn’t think in their Baptist-only services affirm the physical real presence.
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As far as I’m aware, the Episcopalians and other Anglicans are intentionally vague about what they mean by Real Presence. This is so they can accommodate the most Anglo-Catholic of Anglicans and the most Reformed of Anglicans.

I don’t believe in the Real bodily Presence of Christ in the Eucharist, but when I attended an Episcopal service the ushers told me that any baptized Christian could commune.
 
ltwin said:
As far as I’m aware, the Episcopalians and other Anglicans are intentionally vague about what they mean by Real Presence. This is so they can accommodate the most Anglo-Catholic of Anglicans and the most Reformed of Anglicans.

I don’t believe in the Real bodily Presence of Christ in the Eucharist, but when I attended an Episcopal service the ushers told me that any baptized Christian could commune.
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Could be. The Episcopal priest who told me what they believe is a former Roman Catholic priest. But you are correct. To my knowledge Episcopal communion is open to any Christian baptized in the Trinitarian form. And as the Episcopal priest who told me about the Real Presence said, putting that aside, no one is there interrogating and if you feel called to receive, then so be it. So yes I believe they welcome different members of the Christian family to commune together.
 
EvangelCatholic said:
episcopaldigitalnetwork.com/ens/2013/05/23/baptists-and-episcopalians-celebrate-season-of-combined-worship/

Interesting article of how two quite different Christian churches can come together for worship including the Eucharist. If Baptists can accept weekly Communion than I think major progress is being made among Christians.

Any thoughts?
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EvangelCatholic, thank you for sharing this. I liked how the one pastor said they just use different amounts of water for Baptism. And especially liked the comments about how they trusted the Holy Spirit in this endeavor and found it interesting that as Rev Kennedy said, credit mostly goes to "two progressive churches that embrace hospitality, love of neighbor, openness to diversity and mutual respect.”
 
Lutherans who practice ‘open communion’ invite all who are baptized and believe in the Real Presence of Christ in the sacrament. Lutherans who practice ‘close communion’ ask that those outside the denomination speak with the pastor before communing. I think the pastor merely asks if they believe in the Real Presence. But anyone who comes forward to receive the sacrament is, of-course, communed unless they are little children.
 
Christian_Soul said:
EvangelCatholic, thank you for sharing this. I liked how the one pastor said they just use different amounts of water for Baptism. And especially liked the comments about how they trusted the Holy Spirit in this endeavor and found it interesting that as Rev Kennedy said, credit mostly goes to "two progressive churches that embrace hospitality, love of neighbor, openness to diversity and mutual respect.”
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You are welcome, my friend. I am blessed to belong to a Lutheran synod that encourages commonality among all Christians. The ELCA is in full communion with Moravian, Methodists, Presbyterians, Reformed and Episcopal/ Anglican. The benefit of this inclusion is invaluable.
 
EvangelCatholic said:
Lutherans who practiced ‘open communion’ invite all who are baptized and believe in the Real Presence of Christ in the sacrament. Lutherans who practice ‘close communion’ ask that those outside the denomination speak with the pastor before communing. I think the pastor merely asks if they believe in the Real Presence. But anyone who comes forward to receive the sacrament is, of-course, communed unless they are little children.
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I wasn’t sure about ELCA specifics other than knowing they practiced some form of open communion. I do know of a MO Synod Lutheran church whose website says if a visitor believes in the Real Presence as MO Synod Lutherans do, that they are welcome to receive. But perhaps it is left to some degree to the individual pastor as I had thought MO Synod was more of a closed communion.
 
EvangelCatholic said:
You are welcome, my friend. I am blessed to belong to a Lutheran synod that encourages commonality among all Christians. The ELCA is in full communion with Moravian, Methodists, Presbyterians, Reformed and Episcopal/ Anglican. The benefit of this inclusion is invaluable.
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If I were taking membership in a Lutheran synod, I know ELCA would be my choice of synods as well my friend. I just can’t fault invaluable blessings of inclusion. It’s a reason I love such traditions as Reformed and Episcopalian and others. Continued blessings to you.
 
Christian_Soul said:
I wasn’t sure about ELCA specifics other than knowing they practiced some form of open communion. I do know of a MO Synod Lutheran church whose website says if a visitor believes in the Real Presence as MO Synod Lutherans do, that they are welcome to receive. But perhaps it is left to some degree to the individual pastor as I had thought MO Synod was more of a closed communion.
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The official position of the Missouri Synod is closed communion, although some congregrational flaunt it. The congregration that I belong does practice closed communion and states it the worship bulletin and that visitors should meet with the pastors prior to the start of the service. If someone comes up that they do not know, they will not commune them. We do this out of love, because we do not want them to receive the Body and Blood to their harm as St Paul said.
 
It is very obvious that the Baptist church being refered to hear is not and could never be Southern Baptist. The SBC is very anti-ecumenical and thinks that if you don’t believe in “gettin’ saved” you are not a Christian at all.

The Southern Baptist Convention refuses to be in the US council of Churches and the World council of churches.

Locally here in texas they do belong to ministerial councils but only if they can control due to huge majorities.

A few years ago I sang in a pan denominational choir at a community Thanksgiving service, but that was the only non Baptist part, the choir. The rest, invocation scripture reading, benediction and especially the ultra long sermon was by Baptist preachers. Even the choir director was a Baptist.

It was really a Baptist Thanksgiving service.
 
andrewstx said:
It is very obvious that the Baptist church being refered to hear is not and could never be Southern Baptist. The SBC is very anti-ecumenical and thinks that if you don’t believe in “gettin’ saved” you are not a Christian at all.

The Southern Baptist Convention refuses to be in the US council of Churches and the World council of churches.

Locally here in texas they do belong to ministerial councils but only if they can control due to huge majorities.

A few years ago I sang in a pan denominational choir at a community Thanksgiving service, but that was the only non Baptist part, the choir. The rest, invocation scripture reading, benediction and especially the ultra long sermon was by Baptist preachers. Even the choir director was a Baptist.

It was really a Baptist Thanksgiving service.
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I was thinking the same thing. That the Baptist church was not SBC. Maybe rather ABC or another. Your post though brought back fond ecumenical memories for me. I recall in my small midwestern hometown there would be community Thanksgiving services. Often they would alternate between the UMC or PCUSA because they had large capacities. But I recall once the service being held at the smaller Roman Catholic parish in town as well. There were many Baptist churches in town. None SBC though that I am aware of. One or two of them although smaller than the UMC and PCUSA sanctuaries, were larger than the Catholic parish and may have held the service in their churches a time or two as well. I don’t recall for sure.

But I always enjoyed it when Catholics, Methodists, Presbyterians, Baptists, and Reformed came together. We didn’t really have other traditions such as Orthodox, Episcopal or Lutheran churches in town. Nor any non Christian faith communities. But the Catholic priest would go to the UMC or PCUSA and in some yrs would be the one to give the main address or homily or sermon. There was also a ministerial association in town and many of the clergy of the various faiths and traditions would meet at the local diner for coffee. The Catholic priest and the liberal PCUSA pastor were known to even be best of friends. I was wondering. Do Catholic clergy today participate to such a degree in these types of ecumenical services?

Thanks for the memories. 🙂
 
hn160 said:
The official position of the Missouri Synod is closed communion, although some congregrational flaunt it. The congregration that I belong does practice closed communion and states it the worship bulletin and that visitors should meet with the pastors prior to the start of the service. If someone comes up that they do not know, they will not commune them. We do this out of love, because we do not want them to receive the Body and Blood to their harm as St Paul said.
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We need, as confessional Lutherans, to take care in such matters. From the LCMS website:
Q: Being raised in the LCMS, I was surprised today when I was visiting a LCMS church that had a pamphlet explaining their beliefs about Communion. It went on to say that if the visitor believed these things also then they could commune at that church. I thought that only LCMS members could commune at LCMS churches. Has this changed?
A: The Lutheran Church—Missouri Synod has never understood or applied the historic practice of close[d] Communion in such a way as to mean that only LCMS members are permitted to commune at LCMS altars. The official position of the Synod is that not only are members of other Lutheran churches with whom we are in altar and pulpit fellowship invited to commune with us, but also that in certain extraordinary cases of pastoral care and in emergencies members of churches not in fellowship with us may be given Communion. The Synod stated, for example, in 1986 “that pastors and congregations of The Lutheran Church—Missouri Synod continue to abide by the practice of close communion, which includes the necessity of exercising responsible pastoral care in extraordinary situations and circumstances” (1986 Res. 3-08 “To Maintain Practice of Close Communion”).
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The synod holds out the option of parish pastors and elders to exercise pastoral care, and evaluate circumstances. I was, personally, a recipient of that pastoral care. We were ELCA members when we moved to an area where the only Lutheran parish was LCMS. We spoke with the pastor prior to worship, explained our circumstance, answered his questions about our beliefs, and he invited us to commune.

That is the proper exercise of “close communion” in the LCMS, as I understand it.

Jon
 
Yay, ecumenism! 👍

Personally, I would do a joint service with any non-heretical (I.e., no “Christ is really Michael the Archangel” stuff, etc.) Christian church that wanted to. Denominational distinctives can be temporarily put aside.
 
JonNC said:
We need, as confessional Lutherans, to take care in such matters. From the LCMS website:

The synod holds out the option of parish pastors and elders to exercise pastoral care, and evaluate circumstances. I was, personally, a recipient of that pastoral care. We were ELCA members when we moved to an area where the only Lutheran parish was LCMS. We spoke with the pastor prior to worship, explained our circumstance, answered his questions about our beliefs, and he invited us to commune.

That is the proper exercise of “close communion” in the LCMS, as I understand it.

Jon
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It is unheard of anyone being denied the sacrament at a Lutheran altar in all synods. LCMS make a point of informing communicants in the bulletin [poor taste]. Lutherans inter-commune, that is not going to change. Missouri Synod included.

Isn’t that the case with Episcopalians and Anglicans? The sacrament is distributed to all who come forward.
 
EvangelCatholic said:
It is unheard of anyone being denied the sacrament at a Lutheran altar in all synods. LCMS make a point of informing communicants in the bulletin [poor taste]. Lutherans inter-commune, that is not going to change. Missouri Synod included.

Isn’t that the case with Episcopalians and Anglicans? The sacrament is distributed to all who come forward.
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I think you will find that in many LCMS parishes, Lutherans who profess their belief in the real presence, and confess our common confessions in the AC, it Apology, and the Small Catechism, will not be refused. It is not in poor taste, however, to inform guests of our beliefs in the real presence, and what it means to receive what is on the altar - Christ’s real body and real blood.

Jon
 
JonNC said:
I think you will find that in many LCMS parishes, Lutherans who profess their belief in the real presence, and confess our common confessions in the AC, it Apology, and the Small Catechism, will not be refused. **It is not in poor taste, however, to inform guests of our beliefs in the real presence, and what it means to receive what is on the altar - Christ’s real body and real blood. **
Jon
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ELCA bulletins inform that we believe in Real Presence as a welcome to all baptized who seek sanctity, shelter and eternal forgiveness of the blessed sacrament.
 
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