Effectiveness of reparative therapy

[rlg94086]

Actually, many people who believe in the mainstreaming of the “gay lifestyle” are afraid that the cause of SSA may be found to be biological. If it is genetic, it could potentially be changed with gene therapy. If it is hormonal or chemical, it could be reversed or managed with drugs. Don’t think for a second that proof of a biological cause would change anything with regards to the desire of people to correct SSA.

If proven to be a genetic cause, SSA would also be treated like a physical birth defect or Down’s Syndrome. Some parents would abort their child after screening them for the “defect.”

As far as pathia’s experience, I am glad that it was not attached to Courage or the Catholic Church. The “techniques” they used and the suicide comment are certainly against Church teaching.

And this counselor who told you it is better to commit suicide than to live with SSA is talking nonsense. I would never listen to anything like that. I would say some very uncharitable words in return to someone like that. Your story of the extra chromosomes is exactly my point. What are people afraid of in finding that SSA is biological. Does it make less of a sin to act out homosexually? No. But it would at least tell us not to put us through the misery you were subjected to. Keep telling your story and don’t ever consider suicide as an option.

 

[goofyjim]

Actually, many people who believe in the mainstreaming of the “gay lifestyle” are afraid that the cause of SSA may be found to be biological. If it is genetic, it could potentially be changed with gene therapy. If it is hormonal or chemical, it could be reversed or managed with drugs. Don’t think for a second that proof of a biological cause would change anything with regards to the desire of people to correct SSA.

If proven to be a genetic cause, SSA would also be treated like a physical birth defect or Down’s Syndrome. Some parents would abort their child after screening them for the “defect.”

As far as pathia’s experience, I am glad that it was not attached to Courage or the Catholic Church. The “techniques” they used and the suicide comment are certainly against Church teaching.

If it isn’t sinful there is no need to change it. And the Church has stressed time and time again that the attraction alone is not sinful. If some have the desire to change noone is stopping them. But leave the rest of us alone. I wonder if science gets involved in changing something so trivial what the resulting genetic mutations would be like. Is everyone afraid of those with SSA? Are you afraid to be in a locker room with those who have just the attraction? It is an irrational fear.

 

[rlg94086]

If it isn’t sinful there is no need to change it. And the Church has stressed time and time again that the attraction alone is not sinful. If some have the desire to change noone is stopping them. But leave the rest of us alone. I wonder if science gets involved in changing something so trivial what the resulting genetic mutations would be like. Is everyone afraid of those with SSA? Are you afraid to be in a locker room with those who have just the attraction? It is an irrational fear.

None of what you just wrote has anything to do with the post I made. I am just stating what will happen if SSA is found to be a biological cause. I have no fear of it, either way.

That said, if someone with SSA wishes to try reparitive therapy after researching it carefully, that is their choice. I can understand the desire some may have to overcome this burden.

 

[goofyjim]

None of what you just wrote has anything to do with the post I made. I am just stating what will happen if SSA is found to be a biological cause. I have no fear of it, either way.

That said, if someone with SSA wishes to try reparitive therapy after researching it carefully, that is their choice. I can understand the desire some may have to overcome this burden.

And everyone keeps calling it a burden. It is no burden.

 

[rlg94086]

And everyone keeps calling it a burden. It is no burden.

Perhaps for you it isn’t. Celibacy is a gift for those who have chosen it and commit themselves to God. If that is the case for you, then you are indeed blessed. The reason I call it a burden for many is…
1 Cor 7:

8 6 Now to the unmarried and to widows, I say: it is a good thing for them to remain as they are, as I do, 9 but if they cannot exercise self-control they should marry, for it is better to marry than to be on fire.

Since someone with SSA could quite possibly “be on fire,” but can’t marry or have sexual relations with someone of the same sex it can be quite a burden. I’m not sure why you don’t see that.

 

[goofyjim]

Perhaps for you it isn’t. Celibacy is a gift for those who have chosen it and commit themselves to God. If that is the case for you, then you are indeed blessed. The reason I call it a burden for many is…

Since someone with SSA could quite possibly “be on fire,” but can’t marry or have sexual relations with someone of the same sex it can be quite a burden. I’m not sure why you don’t see that.

I don’t consider it a burden because my ability to love others in a Christian capacity is not hindered in any way.

 

[rlg94086]

I don’t consider it a burden because my ability to love others in a Christian capacity is not hindered in any way.

What does the “ability to love others in a Christian capacity” have to do with the burden of sexual desire that can’t be fulfilled without sinning?

 

[Bennie_P]

I can’t speak as …

Don’t give up your day job, you have no talent to be a successful fantasy writer.

 

[Mirdath]

Don’t give up your day job, you have no talent to be a successful fantasy writer.

The ‘good old days’ of anti-gay therapy are well-recorded to have been reminiscent of A Clockwork Orange. I’m not sure exactly when they stopped using electroshock in conjunction with pornography to try to recondition victims, but she’s telling the truth.

 

[rlg94086]

The ‘good old days’ of anti-gay therapy are well-recorded to have been reminiscent of A Clockwork Orange. I’m not sure exactly when they stopped using electroshock in conjunction with pornography to try to recondition victims, but she’s telling the truth.

That’s what I was picturing…eyes held open, with some Beethoven in the background. Sick.

Do you know what the reparitive therapies are that they use today?

 

[goofyjim]

Leave my mind alone. I ain’t sick.

 

[Mirdath]

That’s what I was picturing…eyes held open, with some Beethoven in the background. Sick.

Do you know what the reparitive therapies are that they use today?

I don’t know much specifically, never having had pathia’s personal experience on the subject. It’s still highly coercive and based in the idea that God doesn’t like gay sex – if you’re getting it on in any way conservative Christianity doesn’t endorse, you’re doing it wrong. It’s nothing more than a mere human attempt to remake another person in the image of what the ‘therapist’ considers Good. Can anyone have the hubris to attempt that without putting him- or herself in the place of God?

NARTH is founded entirely upon conservative Christian ideas, and Exodus – well, the name alone speaks for that, as does the founder’s apology I posted earlier. I do not know of any other groups that preach ‘reparative therapy’ as the only answer for homosexuals.

 

[goofyjim]

That’s what I was picturing…eyes held open, with some Beethoven in the background. Sick.

Do you know what the reparitive therapies are that they use today?

Probably just a different form of brainwashing. I don’t trust reparative therapy.

 

[Bennie_P]

The ‘good old days’ of anti-gay therapy are well-recorded to have been reminiscent of A Clockwork Orange. I’m not sure exactly when they stopped using electroshock in conjunction with pornography to try to recondition victims, but she’s telling the truth.

Do you know what year A Clockwork Orange was written? May I ask what year our poster went through this? The use of ETC has not been used in the manner you suggest. You need better documentation then a science fiction novel and/cult film. I saw that movie several times the year it came out, it was a favorite among my peers at the time.

The Ludovico technique

is a fictitious drug-assisted aversion therapy from the novel and film A Clockwork Orange. It involves the patient being forced to watch violent images for long periods of time, while under the effect of drugs that cause a near death experience. The idea is that if the patient is forced to watch the horribly graphic rapes, assaults and other acts of violence while suffering from the drug effects, the patient will assimilate the sensations and then become incapacitated or very ill either attempting to perform or even just witnessing said acts of violence.

Read The Pink Swastika

 

[pathia]

Don’t give up your day job, you have no talent to be a successful fantasy writer.

Sorry if you think I’m a liar, I wish I was, I really do. My history has been discussed on these forums before, and you’re the first one that’s blatantly mocked me. I have no idea what to say anymore, could you possibly be any more offensive?

 

[pathia]

That’s what I was picturing…eyes held open, with some Beethoven in the background. Sick.

Do you know what the reparitive therapies are that they use today?

It was nothing that extreme and the shock wasn’t painful, it was just a jolt, like static electricity. It was just meant to be a sort of slap on the wrist.

I was entirely consensual, I was underage yes, but it’s not like I was tied down, or even told to watch the screen. I agreed to it, and I could have quit at any time. I was just convinced that it was for my own good to do it, so I did it.

 

[Nepenthe]

I could have quit at any time

I am so, so sorry. What can I do to make amends?

 

[pathia]

I am so, so sorry. What can I do to make amends?

I’m sorry? I don’t really follow, why would you want to make amends? Unless you were one of the therapists that did it, I can’t rightly see why anyone would apologize for it. No one here was responsible.

I’m just relating what my personal experience of the therapy was, it is my understanding that they no longer do the aversion anymore. Even when I had it done, it wasn’t standard at all, it was just I was a really hard case and one of the therapists wanted to give it a try to see if it might work.

 

[Mirdath]

Do you know what year A Clockwork Orange was written? May I ask what year our poster went through this? The use of ETC has not been used in the manner you suggest. You need better documentation then a science fiction novel and/cult film. I saw that movie several times the year it came out, it was a favorite among my peers at the time.

It was published in 1962; and if you’d care to actually comprehend what I’ve been writing, it was that the old style of ‘reparative therapy’ was highly reminiscent of the Ludovico treatment.

And you can stop recommending that book. I’ve read as much of it as I’m going to, and consider even that a good several minutes of my life wasted.

 

[Bennie_P]

It was published in 1962; and if you’d care to actually comprehend what I’ve been writing, it was that the old style of ‘reparative therapy’ was highly reminiscent of the Ludovico treatment.

And you can stop recommending that book. I’ve read as much of it as I’m going to, and consider even that a good several minutes of my life wasted.

You don’t understand you are not the only that reads the threads and post on them, the recomendation is open ended. You need to present some documentation concerning old style 'repartive therapy" for you are spreading a fallacy if not an outright homo-erotic fantasy.

---

The “Trojan Couch”:

http://www.narth.com/docs/TheTrojanCouchSatinover.pdf
How the Mental Health Associations Misrepresent Science**
Jeffrey B. Satinover, M.S., M.D1.

Part I. The APA, the DSM, and Homosexuality
**The Campaign Begins. **A lifelong hard-left political activist, the psychologist Evelyn Hooker is more than anyone else credited by believers with having demonstrated that homosexuality is normal. Even today, almost fifty years after its publication in 1957 in Projective Testing, her “The Adjustment of the Male Overt Homosexual” is the only paper referenced in detail on the main
website of the American Psychological Association in its discussion of Gay and Lesbian issues, Eight years after her landmark study, she found herself chair of a newly –established National Institute of Mental Health (NIMH) Task Force on Homosexuality, hand -picked by Judd Marmor, an influential psychiatrist at UCLA. The only other “mental health” representatives were Alfred Kinsey’s close colleagues Paul Gebhard, and John Money, the latter a psychologist from Johns Hopkins and an early (but recently discredited and fired) proponent of transsexual surgery. In 1969 the Task Force issued its report. It claimed, parroting the Kinsey reports almost word-for-word, that sexuality was a continuum from exclusive homosexuality to exclusive heterosexuality, and that some degree of *bisexuality *was the human norm. Without evidence, it stated that any homosexual suffering was caused by societal prejudice. (It avoided mentioning, however, that in Kinsey’s view, human sexual taste was almost infinitely malleable.) Thus, there was nothing problematic with homosexuality per se. Full Paperhttp://www.narth.com/docs/TheTrojanCouchSatinover.pdf

**

For those that would wish to indulge themselves please, Read The Pink Swastika and learn about the roots of the “gay rights” movement and it’s tactics.