Either Catholics or Mormons have it right...

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I was going to post this elsewhere but I am here. It is important. One said that unless the LDS can grasp just a bit of the Holy Trinity all of our conversations will never come together. We are in two different worlds sometimes speaking as if we are in the same world together.

When I was about 25 years old and driving I had to pull over and gather myself. My mind wandered back to when I was eight years old looking out of my bedroom window late at night with my elder brother and sister waiting for our mother to return. She left angry at us all leaving us alone. I was remembering how I once drove by that home in my late teens and I looked at that same window and I swear I saw myself looking out of it still waiting for our mother to return. She never did come back home, she took her life on that night back then and we never got to say goodbye. She had what she believed to be the weight of the world crashing down.

When I pulled the car over I began to cry as if it had all hit me for the first time. I remember grabbing my left hand off the steering wheel placing it on my chest while saying “its going to be ok Richy, I am here for you” I even gave my self a few pats on my shoulder. It might sound weird or crazy to you but for me it was an elder child comforting the younger child still in me. I do not believe this has happened since, but it did happen.

I know that God is so far above us but this memory does help me to have a strong sense of the Holy Trinity in my own life. I believe this memory helped me to grasp this great mystery of faith. I do see God as three in One. How is it that this revelation that I had has also been embraced by so many before me? So many during my own life? Those that walk through our Catholic doors to inquire. A Billion Christians and more?

All I know is that our God is a God that is Love. A love that enters into our joys and sorrows, even into our sin, into the trenches and brings us out because of His love for us.
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In the Godhead there is love and this love is not solitude, it is shared. Within God this sharing has always been no beginning and no end. It is the Love of the Father for the Son, it is the love of the Son for the Father, its rays like the rays of the largest Sun light up all of the Cosmos, heaven and earth and this brilliance is the Most Holy Spirit. God, Father, Son and the Holy Spirit.

Our lives were given to us because of this love. Why would God want to contain this within Himself? No it goes out into all eternity and we get to be a part of it. It is freely given to His Creation, no strings attached, nothing to pay back, nothing to prove or to be gained. It is what it is and it is ours to behold. The sins of the world show each of us that it cannot be possessed. Through Jesus we come to understand that it cannot be earned or merited, or somehow paid back. All we can do now or at the end of our lives here on earth is simply receive it. This is where life begins, this is where true peace reigns, this is our Church, this is our Mass, and this is the presence of Christ. Why has our Church been able to grasp this message of Hope and keep the light shining for all sinners searching?
Confession and Eucharist. Why wait?
 
Kathleen,

Rough Stone Rolling gives a balanced view of Joseph Smith, the man as well as the prophet. It does not “cover up” or “ignore” plural marriage nor the time frame when Joseph Smith first received the commandment about it (in 1831, when he asked in prayer about Abraham and David and why they had more than one wife).

As far as the rumor mill, anyone who trusts the rumor mill for their authoritative sources about anything, has gotten what they have asked for–rumors to base their lives on. Such a basis for living life is not for me…

Peace, and I think that about does it for me here.👍
Parker, back in the fifties here in Logan Utah a paper was sent around everywhere here. I received a copy from A man who was older and trying to take me away from my Catholic Christian Baptis. It had 50 evils of the Catholic Church. I was learning about thios faith then and I took the time to counter all 50 using scripture and direct sources from the Catholic faith…yes Tradition with a big T. Apostolic.

What I goit back was more letters spanning my time here in tbhis valley. After awhile I just let them go into the garbage. This man was possessed in a haterd of the Catholic Church. I once told Paul why other denominations will not call Momons Christian. He snapped back “I never got oin that boat! I am proud to be Mormon and not Christian”
I had in my hand 50 evil rumors about he Catholic faith. I wish I had kept it. Then again I am content that I did not. Just a couple I remember
  1. Catholics wirship the Altar, as you can see them bowing to it
  2. Catholics pray to dead Saints and they worship them
  3. The Mss was an invention of the Catholic Church
  4. They worship metals and coins with images of dead Saints
  5. They call thier Priest Father when this is forbidden
  6. I could go on as I remember a bit more than I thought.
All rumors passed around even the young children here years ago.
I am not angry, rather educated. I do have a great love for all LDS in Christ.
Paul has a special place in my heart as he was just misled.

He really thought he was attemting to save my soul.
So I know about rumors. I live in Utah

WhenI lived in Sacramento growing up LDS I also heard rumors about the LDS Church.

the difference being they were all true.
Accept that I would not find work in Utah unless I was LDS
That was false.
 
Parker,

If you are still here, in no way would Smith receive a correct answer in his heart by simply wanting to find out if he could get an OK from God to have multiple sex.

God did not answer Smith in regards to Abraham or any other Old Testament personage.

What answered back to Smith was his own seductive heart. The man was a divinizer as well, a magician. He seduced some women and married them within 48 hours…he threatened his wife with hell if she did not go along with his sexual crimes.

What you are manifesting is not faith, but a manner of convictions that were indoctrinated on you and if you questioned, you were in the same boat as Smith’s first wife. My impression of life in the Mormon church is one with rose colored glasses, and a world of its own–insular and emotive based. It is all about feeling good.

True spiritual discernment does not come from burning bosom passion…that is what it is…emotional consolations come more in the beginning of the faith walk…but never to discern truth from false because our passions work against the Spirit.
 
Parker,

If you are still here, in no way would Smith receive a correct answer in his heart by simply wanting to find out if he could get an OK from God to have multiple sex.

God did not answer Smith in regards to Abraham or any other Old Testament personage.

What answered back to Smith was his own seductive heart. The man was a divinizer as well, a magician. He seduced some women and married them within 48 hours…he threatened his wife with hell if she did not go along with his sexual crimes.

What you are manifesting is not faith, but a manner of convictions that were indoctrinated on you and if you questioned, you were in the same boat as Smith’s first wife. My impression of life in the Mormon church is one with rose colored glasses, and a world of its own–insular and emotive based. It is all about feeling good.

True spiritual discernment does not come from burning bosom passion…that is what it is…emotional consolations come more in the beginning of the faith walk…but never to discern truth from false because our passions work against the Spirit.
Well said, Kathleen!!! Shalom haMeshiach.

PAX DOMINI :signofcross:

Shalom Aleichem
 
Don’t Protestants also believe in an apostasy of some sort? They left the Catholic Church because they say it no longer represents true Christianity, but there is no evidence to support this claim. The writings are there, and there is scriptural basis for the Church’s teachings.
Many folks leave their current place of worship because they haven’t taken the time to find out what they teach. Check the doctrine!
Talk to your pastor or priest before you make this important descision.

God bless,
bluelake
 
In regards to experiencing all the love on an LDS site, first of all I don’t go there. I have watched their programs. Mormonism is a world of its own.

But the Catholic Church did not start out condemning other Christians.

LDS began by condemning all Christianity. Oh, there were a few real Christians here and there…for 1800 years…definition unclear…apostasy unclear…but all the proof in the golden plates, Egyptian scrolls and Smith…

Where is God? Why did Christ begin His church and allow it to fall and then create a new one with men who did not emulate the virtue and character of the original apostles…

To believe in Mormonism does draw one to a different understanding of God.

The universal faith believes in God Who Is, Who does not change, Whose teachings are consistent.

To believe in Egyptian scrolls and golden slabs are to believe in symbols and images outside the framework of Judeo Christianity. To justify polygamy and starting a new religion…one would indeed have to create new stories.
This is an unfortunate reinterpretation of Mormonism that is often used by anti-Mormons. Mormons claim that JESUS condemned all other church creeds. They state that in Smith’s visions Jesus never condmened Christians or Christian beliefs, but the creeds created by man.

We may disagree with the reality of these visions i.e. they never happened; however, it is not appropriate to be the source of half-truths and misstatements. When truth is in our grasp we have no need to demean the religions of others. Our calling is to proclaim what is true and allow the Holy Spirit to handle the rest.
 
JeanMichel, when we profess the creeds we are professing what we believe.

Mormonism attempts to rewrite Christian history, even pointing some OT Messianic prophecies to itself, not Christ.

Jesus Christ is the Restoration of all things, not a movement that arose out of 19th century America.
 
JeanMichel, when we profess the creeds we are professing what we believe.

Mormonism attempts to rewrite Christian history, even pointing some OT Messianic prophecies to itself, not Christ.

Jesus Christ is the Restoration of all things, not a movement that arose out of 19th century America.
Rebecca,

Did you ever hit the nail on the head here: "…pointing some OT Messianic prophecies to itself, not Christ.

The saints, most especially Mary, always point to Christ, as does all of scripture. Anything that in the least detracts from that reality cannot be of God. There has always been apostasy among individuals and certain groups throughout history. When LDS speak of apostasy, they should first look in the mirror. They have departed so far from truth that it is no longer recognizable as Christianity.
 
Rebecca,

Did you ever hit the nail on the head here: "…pointing some OT Messianic prophecies to itself, not Christ.

The saints, most especially Mary, always point to Christ, as does all of scripture. Anything that in the least detracts from that reality cannot be of God. There has always been apostasy among individuals and certain groups throughout history. When LDS speak of apostasy, they should first look in the mirror. They have departed so far from truth that it is no longer recognizable as Christianity.
It is one of the more exasperating area of Mormonism. When discussing scripture and a Messianic prophecy will be pointed to “the restoration”… I want to light something on fire! But instead, I pray for patience.
 
Rebecca,

Did you ever hit the nail on the head here: "…pointing some OT Messianic prophecies to itself, not Christ.
SteveVH,
Of course it is not recognizable as the mainline Christian “One Being God” doctrine that came out of the council of Nicea.

I have to assume Rebecca J was referring to my comment or similar comments that associate Daniel’s interpretation and its prophecy about the stone “cut out of the mountain without hands,” that “smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth.” (Daniel 2:45, 35) To say that this is a dual prophecy since it ties to Daniel 2:44 which is talking about the kingdom of God on earth, and that it also ties to Daniel 7:27 which also talks about the kingdom of God on earth, and yet the way the kingdom of God on the earth is preserved and grows to fill the earth is by the testimonies of Christ within the hearts of the individual members who comprise the believing congregation, is not to be diverting Old Testament prophecy away from Christ, the Messiah, who is indeed the foundation stone of Israel and thus the foundation stone of the kingdom of God on earth.

But I would point out that I have seen Catholics refer to the plain and clear prophecy about Christ in Isaiah 22:22-23 and they have confusedly said that prophecy refers to Peter–which they need to do in order to assert that Peter was the rock referred to in Matthew 16:18 which Peter never taught and would not recognize as legitimate Christian doctrine. That assertion is a weakening and a supplanting of the doctrine of the Rock, our Redeemer, whom Peter acknowledged is the Stone of Israel, the Promised Messiah, the King of Kings, Jesus the Christ.
 
I wasn’t talking about your posts ParkerD, remember, you ignore me so I see no point in addressing anything you say.
 
It is most unfortunate when people misrepresent other faiths.

And the Mormon Church did indeed define all creeds as abominations…works in the 1840’s did indeed identify the main culprit as the Roman Church. I saw it at the LDS bookstore…and now it is being covered up.

Shame.
 
Yes, and I remember when first coming on to a Mormon thread, I was jumped all over…simply because I exposed what I read…

To deny their anti-Catholic and anti Protestant origins is another part of the deceit. I feel victimized by it…never even went into the store to use anything against their religion.

It was what I happened to stumble upon…the anti-Catholic origins of Mormonism, and i was jumped all over for inadvertently exposing it.

Now I am being labelled as anti-Mormon…
 
JeanMichel, when we profess the creeds we are professing what we believe.

Mormonism attempts to rewrite Christian history, even pointing some OT Messianic prophecies to itself, not Christ.

Jesus Christ is the Restoration of all things, not a movement that arose out of 19th century America.
Rebecca, the actions of Mormons is their personal issue and problem; however, we do not need to imitate their actions or errors. We are called to stand in Truth and act accordingly. There is no need to mis-state their story.
 
It is most unfortunate when people misrepresent other faiths.

And the Mormon Church did indeed define all creeds as abominations…works in the 1840’s did indeed identify the main culprit as the Roman Church. I saw it at the LDS bookstore…and now it is being covered up.

Shame.
Please provide the reference rather than alluding to “you saw it”. This is the same standard we demand of others. If we cannot live by the same standard we are made hypocrites.

Shame can only be experienced by those who walk in the Light of Jesus Christ, profess his name, and then ignore his counsel and teachings. We should the actions or works of those who sit outside the truth.
 
It is still in their scriptures as such.
This is getting tiresome. If you care to turn to their scriptures it states clearly that Jesus condemned the creeds of others. Why are you two fighting for lies when the truth is so much easier? This is strange indeed. This is the kind of anti-Mormon tripe found on Evangelical websites…the same ones that condemn the Catholic Church! Why imitate them?
 
This is an unfortunate reinterpretation of Mormonism that is often used by anti-Mormons. Mormons claim that JESUS condemned all other church creeds. They state that in Smith’s visions Jesus never condmened Christians or Christian beliefs, but the creeds created by man.

We may disagree with the reality of these visions i.e. they never happened; however, it is not appropriate to be the source of half-truths and misstatements. When truth is in our grasp we have no need to demean the religions of others. Our calling is to proclaim what is true and allow the Holy Spirit to handle the rest.
From JS first vision:
I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: “they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof.”
These words, which JS alleges are from Christ, most certainly condemn both Christians and Christan beliefs.
 
This is getting tiresome. If you care to turn to their scriptures it states clearly that Jesus condemned the creeds of others. Why are you two fighting for lies when the truth is so much easier? This is strange indeed. This is the kind of anti-Mormon tripe found on Evangelical websites…the same ones that condemn the Catholic Church! Why imitate them?
JeanMichel, who is fighting? This is a discussion. But you seem to want to view everyone and everything in a poor light. Maybe try giving us the benefit of the doubt?

This is not anti-Mormon tripe, it is a discussion of the truth. You can see the post above me, and perhaps explain how you are seeing that as something other than a condemnation of Christianity, in its entirety.

Again, when I profess the creeds I am saying what I believe. About God, Salvation, my very life. How is it that saying what I profess is an abomination is saying something good about what I believe?

I don’t understand how you can make belief and the person who is professing the beliefs separate. It is not something I can do.

Peace.
 
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