English translation of the TALMUD?

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I hope one day to buy a english translation of the TALMUD.

One person i know was recommending me the 2 following translations as being the best and most faithfull to the Hebrew TALMUD are the Soncino and Steinsaltz TALMUDS, but when i was checking these out, they both are very expensive.

But i also saw 2 other translations, which are much cheaper to buy:
-Rodkinson,Michael L. & Isaac M.Wise (Revised & corrected).- New Edition of the Babylonian TALMUD - English translation, 16 volumes
-Jacob Neusner-The Babylonian TALMUD: A Translation and Commentary, 22 Volumes, see:
christianbook.com/babylonian-talmud-translation-and-commentary-volumes/9781598565263/pd/565263?item_code=WW&netp_id=827047&event=ESRCG&view=details

I also ask that person (whom was only recommending Soncino and Steinsaltz TALMUDS) his views about Jacob Neuser, but he said that it was poorly conceived and organized and would not recommend it, even not for the price of only $199,99.

Does anyone knows the translations of Neuser and Rodkinson ?
If so what are your views ?
Are they good and faithfull translations of the Talmud?
Any thoughts would be apreciatted.
 
Clairvaux said:
I hope one day to buy a english translation of the TALMUD.

One person i know was recommending me the 2 following translations as being the best and most faithfull to the Hebrew TALMUD are the Soncino and Steinsaltz TALMUDS, but when i was checking these out, they both are very expensive.

But i also saw 2 other translations, which are much cheaper to buy:
-Rodkinson,Michael L. & Isaac M.Wise (Revised & corrected).- New Edition of the Babylonian TALMUD - English translation, 16 volumes
-Jacob Neusner-The Babylonian TALMUD: A Translation and Commentary, 22 Volumes, see:
christianbook.com/babylonian-talmud-translation-and-commentary-volumes/9781598565263/pd/565263?item_code=WW&netp_id=827047&event=ESRCG&view=details

I also ask that person (whom was only recommending Soncino and Steinsaltz TALMUDS) his views about Jacob Neuser, but he said that it was poorly conceived and organized and would not recommend it, even not for the price of only $199,99.

Does anyone knows the translations of Neuser and Rodkinson ?
If so what are your views ?
Are they good and faithfull translations of the Talmud?
Any thoughts would be apreciatted.
Click to expand...
Sorry I can’t help you, but based on your question I’d like to ask you something. Since you have researched it a bit, do you know if there is an english translation of the Jerusalem (aka Israel) Talmud? All I see is the Babylonian Talmud but never the Jerusalem one.
 
Clairvaux said:
I hope one day to buy a english translation of the TALMUD.

One person i know was recommending me the 2 following translations as being the best and most faithfull to the Hebrew TALMUD are the Soncino and Steinsaltz TALMUDS, but when i was checking these out, they both are very expensive.

But i also saw 2 other translations, which are much cheaper to buy:
-Rodkinson,Michael L. & Isaac M.Wise (Revised & corrected).- New Edition of the Babylonian TALMUD - English translation, 16 volumes
-Jacob Neusner-The Babylonian TALMUD: A Translation and Commentary, 22 Volumes, see:
christianbook.com/babylonian-talmud-translation-and-commentary-volumes/9781598565263/pd/565263?item_code=WW&netp_id=827047&event=ESRCG&view=details

I also ask that person (whom was only recommending Soncino and Steinsaltz TALMUDS) his views about Jacob Neuser, but he said that it was poorly conceived and organized and would not recommend it, even not for the price of only $199,99.

Does anyone knows the translations of Neuser and Rodkinson ?
If so what are your views ?
Are they good and faithfull translations of the Talmud?
Any thoughts would be apreciatted.
Click to expand...
I enjoy using the Schottenstein edition (with English translation) the best. If you want something that you can use on the computer, Soncino has a digital version that’s (in my opinion) a pretty faithful translation and which would likely be your cheapest alternative.

I wouldn’t buy anything at all published by Jacob Neusner. His scholarship is generally considered rushed and sloppy.

I don’t know anything about Rodkinson.

Note that much of the Talmud is written in Aramaic.
 
James924 said:
Sorry I can’t help you, but based on your question I’d like to ask you something. Since you have researched it a bit, do you know if there is an english translation of the Jerusalem (aka Israel) Talmud? All I see is the Babylonian Talmud but never the Jerusalem one.
Click to expand...
I should really know this answer to the following question…and I don’t, which is bad of me.

What’s the difference between the Jerusalem Talmud and the Babylonian Talmud? (Content wise, at least).
 
The_Scott said:
I should really know this answer to the following question…and I don’t, which is bad of me.

What’s the difference between the Jerusalem Talmud and the Babylonian Talmud? (Content wise, at least).
Click to expand...
The following is what i THINK to be the case. If anyone finds it to be erroneous please do correct me. They were both intended to be the writing down of previously existing oral Jewish tradition in order to preserve extra-scriptural Jewish customs and history. They were both written around the same time, give or take a century perhaps, but were done in different locations. The Babylonian one, “Talmud bavli” I think, was done out in present day Iraq by the many Jews who migrated there after the destruction of the temple. The Jerusalem talmud is the same basic project, same basic goal, but done by the Jews who stayed in the Palestine area. To my knowledge they are quite similar in content.
 
The_Scott said:
I should really know this answer to the following question…and I don’t, which is bad of me.

What’s the difference between the Jerusalem Talmud and the Babylonian Talmud? (Content wise, at least).
Click to expand...
In English scholarship, what you’ve referred to as the “Jerusalem Talmud” is usually called the “Palestinian Talmud” (just in case you run into that term as well). But in Jewish circles it’s called the “Yerushalmi” so Jerusalem Talmud isn’t wrong, it’s just a little geographically inaccurate.

Jews would consider the Babylonian Talmud (the “Bavli”) as THE Talmud. There are many differences between the two versions–including the dialect of Aramaic used in each as well as content. The Babylonian Talmud is far more complete in terms of actually “making sense” in many places, which has probably contributed to its authoritative standing among Jews and why it has many more authoritative commentators. I’m honestly not sure whether there are English translations of the Palestinian Talmud that are worth buying–maybe others can weigh in on that.
 
Your ambition is admirable, but why spend time on such a document? What are you hoping to learn? As was stated, it is all oral tradition that was first put down in A.D. 400, so pretty much anything goes.
 
The Steinsaltz is, I believe, fairly conservative, the Soncino less so, and a beautifully produced set, if memory serves.

Unfortunately, Soncino advise that three volumes of their Talmud are out of print at the moment(!), so the Steinsaltz may be your only option.

soncino.com/product_info.php/cPath/22/products_id/108

steinsaltz.org/learning.php?pg=Talmud_-_Books&articleId=1424

Try to ensure that the volumes are Smyth sewn and that no glue is involved in any part of the binding. If you’re going to invest in something as substantial as this, make sure that you’re getting something that will last.
 
Clairvaux said:
I hope one day to buy a english translation of the TALMUD.

One person i know was recommending me the 2 following translations as being the best and most faithfull to the Hebrew TALMUD are the Soncino and Steinsaltz TALMUDS, but when i was checking these out, they both are very expensive.
Click to expand...
Steinsaltz is very good. I enjoyed reading it, and even learned a bit of Aramaic from reading it. Of course you can always use a Jewish Website and know its accurate. chabad.org/multimedia/media_cdo/aid/1101356/jewish/Talmud-for-Beginners.htm
Now I do not know how they teach at Chabad.org but I have listioned and learned a lot from that website while I practiced Judaism. You can always check the Daily Study on Chabad.org which offers Mishnah Torah and Chasidic texts, in case you are interested in Jewish spirituality. Our older spiritual brothers have much knowledge. Though with a Jewish point of view of course. So it does always flow 100% with Christianity.

BTW may I ask, what would interest you in Talmud? I mean, good thing you are still Christian. Just, I got interested in Judaism and left the church for it. But eventually came back 🙂 Anyway, the Talmud is a headache. It was my lest favorite thing to study. Its so full of nothing but laws and how to solve situations. With arguments and counter-arguments by Rabbis etc.
 
The_Scott said:
I should really know this answer to the following question…and I don’t, which is bad of me.

What’s the difference between the Jerusalem Talmud and the Babylonian Talmud? (Content wise, at least).
Click to expand...
The Babylonian Talmud is the better of the two - the differences between the two books are that the Babylonian Talmud has more opinions of the rabbis of Israel as well as of those of Babylonia, while the Jerusalem Talmud only seldom cites the Babylonian rabbis. The Babylonian version also contains the opinions of more generations because of its later date of completion. For both these reasons it is regarded as a more comprehensive collection of the opinions available. On the other hand, because of the centuries of redaction between the composition of the Jerusalem and the Babylonian Talmud, the opinions of early amoraim might be closer to their original form in the Jerusalem Talmud.

Most people favor the Babylonian Talmud - out of this

The Mishneh Torah (Hebrew: מִשְׁנֶה תּוֹרָה‎, “Repetition of the Torah”) subtitled Sefer Yad ha-Hazaka (ספר יד החזקה “Book of the Strong Hand,”) is a code of Jewish religious law (Halakha) authored by Maimonides (Rabbi Moshe ben Maimon, also known as RaMBaM or “Rambam”)

Mishneh Torah consists of fourteen books, subdivided into sections, chapters, and paragraphs. It is the only Medieval-era work that details all of Jewish observance, including those laws that are only applicable when the Holy Temple is in existence, and remains an important work in Judaism

Gemara and the Mishnah together make up the Talmud
The Mishnah - the core text; and the Gemara - analysis and commentary which “completes” the Talmud (see Structure of the Talmud)

Maimonides - Moses Maimonides became a Jewish philosopher who codified the Talmud, composed the Mishneh Torah, and the Guide for the Perplexed. In the non-Jewish world, he is known for his work in science, medicine, astronomy and philosophy. As a person, he represents the blending of traditional Torah scholarship and excellence in Torah studies with an outstanding secular or world knowledge.

Is is tough reading - and to answer the question about buying the Talmud, Artscroll - its a good price and you can search Ebay for people/or Rabbi’s who are selling their books. I’m looking for some books that are very expensive but I’m waiting for a good deal - these books are cheap by any means.
 
steve53 said:
Your ambition is admirable, but why spend time on such a document? What are you hoping to learn? As was stated, it is all oral tradition that was first put down in A.D. 400, so pretty much anything goes.
Click to expand...
There’s some good information - I pretty much look up health and medicine. …
 
EzraJacob said:
BTW may I ask, what would interest you in Talmud? I mean, good thing you are still Christian. Just, I got interested in Judaism and left the church for it. But eventually came back 🙂 Anyway, the Talmud is a headache. It was my lest favorite thing to study. Its so full of nothing but laws and how to solve situations. With arguments and counter-arguments by Rabbis etc.
Click to expand...
Which makes it pretty much the ancestor of the comment box and the internet forum. 😃
 
Clairvaux said:
I hope one day to buy a english translation of the TALMUD.

One person i know was recommending me the 2 following translations as being the best and most faithfull to the Hebrew TALMUD are the Soncino and Steinsaltz TALMUDS, but when i was checking these out, they both are very expensive.

But i also saw 2 other translations, which are much cheaper to buy:
-Rodkinson,Michael L. & Isaac M.Wise (Revised & corrected).- New Edition of the Babylonian TALMUD - English translation, 16 volumes
-Jacob Neusner-The Babylonian TALMUD: A Translation and Commentary, 22 Volumes, see:
christianbook.com/babylonian-talmud-translation-and-commentary-volumes/9781598565263/pd/565263?item_code=WW&netp_id=827047&event=ESRCG&view=details

I also ask that person (whom was only recommending Soncino and Steinsaltz TALMUDS) his views about Jacob Neuser, but he said that it was poorly conceived and organized and would not recommend it, even not for the price of only $199,99.

Does anyone knows the translations of Neuser and Rodkinson ?
If so what are your views ?
Are they good and faithfull translations of the Talmud?
Any thoughts would be apreciatted.
Click to expand...
Neusner is a very well-respected scholar (he’s a personal friend of Pope Benedict, for what that’s worth). I don’t know where your friend is coming from, but my guess would be that he doesn’t like Neusner’s more critical approach to the Talmud. Neusner doesn’t accept the claim that the Talmud actually records the words of rabbis who lived centuries earlier–he believes that much of the material is much more reflective of the time when the Talmud was compiled (or the Mishnah, in the case of the Mishnah). I have not studied his edition of the Talmud in detail, but I would imagine that his critical views reflect how he translates and arranges the text. I know (from briefly glancing at them) that all his editions of the rabbinic texts try to reflect what he believes is the order of the argument in order to facilitate comprehension (he arranges the material in outline form). I don’t know if that’s what your friend objects to or not.

I would say that Neusner’s is the best translation for non-Jewish study of the Talmud, but you should be aware that traditional Jews generally don’t like it and it does reflect a somewhat idiosyncratic approach by a brilliant and controversial scholar.

Edwin

P.S. I just found this article in the NYT, which helpfully lists a number of English-language editions. It may be telling that it doesn’t mention Neusner and that the NYT had to append a note acknowledging the omission!
 
The Talmud consists of millions of words… Much of it is commentary on the Torah, and then commentary on the commentary, and so on and so on.

There are many English translations of the Talmud, and they are ALL expensive. That’s because there are dozens of books involved.

There is no 100% accurate translation, because when you translate from one language to another, it is impossible to be 100% accurate and still make sense. Some sayings in Hebrew (or any other foreign language) would make no sense in English. Some words have multiple meanings, and we don’t always know the exact meaning that the original writer wanted to utilize.

Titles alone can trip you up. A French person is not addressing a male as “My Lord”, but that is what the French means when it comes to a literal translation (Monsieur).

The same is 100% true of the Bible by the way. There is a prohibition in the Bible that states, “Suffer not a witch to live”. But, the Hebrew word that is translated as “witch” actually means “poisoner”. It makes a LOT more sense translated as “Suffer not a poisoner to live”. But, it was mistranslated back in the 17th century, and it is STILL being translated that way. (And being used to torment innocent people by Christians.)

You can find just about any opinion in the Talmud. Keep in mind that it was by using the words of the Talmud that Reform and Conservative Judiasm broke off from the Orthodox. And, it is both the Talmud and Torah, that are slowly bring those two branches back into greater conformity with the original.

The Talmud makes for wonderful reading, if you are a scholar. Many Jewish men have spent a lifetime studying those works, and STILL not gotten to the final meaning of it all.

Enjoy your reading.
 
Clairvaux said:
I hope one day to buy a english translation of the TALMUD.

One person i know was recommending me the 2 following translations as being the best and most faithfull to the Hebrew TALMUD are the Soncino and Steinsaltz TALMUDS, but when i was checking these out, they both are very expensive.

But i also saw 2 other translations, which are much cheaper to buy:
-Rodkinson,Michael L. & Isaac M.Wise (Revised & corrected).- New Edition of the Babylonian TALMUD - English translation, 16 volumes
-Jacob Neusner-The Babylonian TALMUD: A Translation and Commentary, 22 Volumes, see:
christianbook.com/babylonian-talmud-translation-and-commentary-volumes/9781598565263/pd/565263?item_code=WW&netp_id=827047&event=ESRCG&view=details

I also ask that person (whom was only recommending Soncino and Steinsaltz TALMUDS) his views about Jacob Neuser, but he said that it was poorly conceived and organized and would not recommend it, even not for the price of only $199,99.

Does anyone knows the translations of Neuser and Rodkinson ?
If so what are your views ?
Are they good and faithfull translations of the Talmud?
Any thoughts would be apreciatted.
Click to expand...
I’m not sure if it counts for what you’re looking for, but very inexpensivly I got a Kindle edition of the Babloyian Talmud. Hope this helps,

Edit
I can’t say it will have everything found in that 22 vol set or not
 
steve53 said:
Your ambition is admirable, but why spend time on such a document? What are you hoping to learn? As was stated, it is all oral tradition that was first put down in A.D. 400, so pretty much anything goes.
Click to expand...
Sinds i read the great book of Brant Pitre: “JESUS AND THE JEWISH ROOTS OF THE EUCHARIST” (which is the best book i ever read on the eucharist), i saw that he qoutes many times from the Talmud, to get a better understanding of the jewish background of the eucharist, but on the other side the Talmud also contains horibble and blashemy against the Lord Jesus Christ and the Virgin Mary, which are complety anti-christian, so with these facts i would like to read the sources my self from the Talmud.
 
MorningSong51 said:
The Babylonian Talmud is the better of the two - the differences between the two books are that the Babylonian Talmud has more opinions of the rabbis of Israel as well as of those of Babylonia, while the Jerusalem Talmud only seldom cites the Babylonian rabbis. The Babylonian version also contains the opinions of more generations because of its later date of completion. For both these reasons it is regarded as a more comprehensive collection of the opinions available. On the other hand, because of the centuries of redaction between the composition of the Jerusalem and the Babylonian Talmud, the opinions of early amoraim might be closer to their original form in the Jerusalem Talmud.

Most people favor the Babylonian Talmud - out of this

The Mishneh Torah (Hebrew: מִשְׁנֶה תּוֹרָה‎, “Repetition of the Torah”) subtitled Sefer Yad ha-Hazaka (ספר יד החזקה “Book of the Strong Hand,”) is a code of Jewish religious law (Halakha) authored by Maimonides (Rabbi Moshe ben Maimon, also known as RaMBaM or “Rambam”)

Mishneh Torah consists of fourteen books, subdivided into sections, chapters, and paragraphs. It is the only Medieval-era work that details all of Jewish observance, including those laws that are only applicable when the Holy Temple is in existence, and remains an important work in Judaism

Gemara and the Mishnah together make up the Talmud
The Mishnah - the core text; and the Gemara - analysis and commentary which “completes” the Talmud (see Structure of the Talmud)

Maimonides - Moses Maimonides became a Jewish philosopher who codified the Talmud, composed the Mishneh Torah, and the Guide for the Perplexed. In the non-Jewish world, he is known for his work in science, medicine, astronomy and philosophy. As a person, he represents the blending of traditional Torah scholarship and excellence in Torah studies with an outstanding secular or world knowledge.

Is is tough reading - and to answer the question about buying the Talmud, Artscroll - its a good price and you can search Ebay for people/or Rabbi’s who are selling their books. I’m looking for some books that are very expensive but I’m waiting for a good deal - these books are cheap by any means.
Click to expand...
Thanks for such a great answer, MorningSong!

Sorry for slightly hijacking your thread, Clairvaux . 😊
 
The_Scott said:
Thanks for such a great answer, MorningSong!

Sorry for slightly hijacking your thread, Clairvaux . 😊
Click to expand...
You’re welcome. There are many answers in the Talmud according to what you’re looking for, specifically. The Mishnah - the core text; and the Gemara - analysis and commentary which “completes” the Talmud (see Structure of the Talmud).

The Mishnah - are lists of arguments/interpretations/commentaries (the Mishnah is a compilation of legal opinions and debates) by subject (and by generation after generation of rabbis) but their discussions were written down in a series of books that became the Gemara, these books are for students who’s studies are in Torah. I found an interesting website that is devoted to specially to Maimonides -

Maimonides - wrote several books on medicine, you’ll find them in both the Talmud, Mishnah - Medicine in the Mishneh Torah of Maimonides and also in the book “The Guide of the Perplexed by Moses Maimonides” -

Since Maimonides codified everything it makes life a little easier - This is someone you want to read more of…

Take Care
Mary
 
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