EU--Don't insult Religion

[beckers]

Okay I know that this is a quote taken from an article about the uprising in Europe but I didn’t want to hijack someone else’s thread since this is a different rant …

news.ft.com/cms/s/b2481314-942c-11da-82ea-0000779e2340.html

Check out what the European President and Kofi Annan said:

Ursula Plassnik, foreign minister of Austria, which holds the rotating EU presidency, said she understood the offence Muslims felt, adding that EU leaders needed to “clearly condemn” acts that insult religion.

Kofi Annan, the United Nations secretary-general, said he believed “freedom of the press should always be exercised in a way that fully respects the religious beliefs and tenets of all religions”.

---

So let me get this straight—the EU goes out of it’s way not to include religion in it’s documents and basically wants GOD thrown out of the picture BUT YET now states that people need to not insult religion. I am sorry but I don’t buy it. It’s seems to me to be a contradiction…I feel like it’s the same thing over and over again…It’s okay to insult Christians but not others. Maybe it’s because we don’t get as violent…

GOD Bless,
Beckers

 

[Guar_Fan]

I am not sure about your point. Yes, the EU strives to be secular. But the EU President stated a need (which they haven’t done) to condemn acts which insult religion.

She doesn’t say that it applies only to Islam, but to religion, without qualification. Surely this is a good idea? After all, it is possible to be secular and insulting and its possible to be be secular and non-insulting.

I liked Jack Straw’s observation:

Jack Straw, UK foreign secretary, said on Friday that “freedom of speech” did not carry “any obligation to insult or to be gratuitously inflammatory”.

 

[Ani_Ibi]

Guar Fan:

She doesn’t say that it applies only to Islam, but to religion, without qualification. Surely this is a good idea? After all, it is possible to be secular and insulting and its possible to be be secular and non-insulting.

I feel that it is a hypocritical position.

In practice, it is the Christian churches, particularly Catholicism, which is expected to take the brunt of the rude and inaccurate attacks and then not complain.

Judaism is different because people have developed a sensitivity toward attacks on Judaism.

Islam is different because the Danish imam – not content to present the original and solitary cartoon to the meeting of the imams in the Middle East – brought a whole booklet of forged cartoons to create a stink and foment violence rather than dealing with the original publisher in a responsible peaceful manner.

Catholics are treated in a differential manner because of the prohibited ground of their religion. The criteria for discrimination are met.

Catholicism is the last acceptable prejudice.

In Canada Judy Rebick published a cartoon of the Pope dressed as a Nazi saluting to the Virgin Mary who was depicted as Hitler. The CBC – who are currently weeping and wailing over the unfairness to Islam – barely mentioned the Rebick cartoon and then only to make sardonic comments. The Minister in charged denied funding Rebick when, in fact, the money trail was clear.

cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2005/05/27/catholic-pope050527.html

 

[bones_IV]

Ani Ibi:

I feel that it is a hypocritical position.

In practice, it is the Christian churches, particularly Catholicism, which is expected to take the brunt of the rude and inaccurate attacks and then not complain.

Judaism is different because people have developed a sensitivity toward attacks on Judaism.

Islam is different because the Danish imam – not content to present the original and solitary cartoon to the meeting of the imams in the Middle East – brought a whole booklet of forged cartoons to create a stink and foment violence rather than dealing with the original publisher in a responsible peaceful manner.

Catholics are treated in a differential manner because of the prohibited ground of their religion. The criteria for discrimination are met.

Catholicism is the last acceptable prejudice.

In Canada Judy Rebick published a cartoon of the Pope dressed as a Nazi saluting to the Virgin Mary who was depicted as Hitler. The CBC – who are currently weeping and wailing over the unfairness to Islam – barely mentioned the Rebick cartoon and then only to make sardonic comments. The Minister in charged denied funding Rebick when, in fact, the money trail was clear.

cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2005/05/27/catholic-pope050527.html

Redick as far as I’m concerned should be in jail. She should be ashamed of herself. People do these sins and feel no shame in doing this.

 

[Matt25]

The EU does not have a President.

Incidentally Ursula Plassnik issued another statement recently-

macon.com/mld/macon/news/politics/13783028.htm

Austria’s European Union presidency said Friday it joined Americans in mourning the death of Coretta Scott King, saying her loss had quieted a “strong and relentless” voice for the downtrodden. In a statement issued by Austrian Foreign Minister Ursula Plassnik, the EU presidency expressed its sympathy and condolences at the passing of the 78-year-old widow of the Rev. Martin Luther King Jr., who died earlier this week in Rosarito, Mexico, where she was seeking treatment for advanced ovarian cancer.

“With her passing away, the United States has lost a strong and relentless voice for human rights, personal freedom and human dignity,” Plassnik said.“Like her late husband, Dr. Martin Luther King, Ms. Coretta King was internationally respected for her unfailing commitment to these high goals. Her loss is felt by all of us,” she said.

What terrible enemies of freedom these darn European Union politicians are.

 

[bapcathluth]

Ani Ibi:

Catholicism is the last acceptable prejudice.

In Canada Judy Rebick published a cartoon of the Pope dressed as a Nazi saluting to the Virgin Mary who was depicted as Hitler. The CBC – who are currently weeping and wailing over the unfairness to Islam – barely mentioned the Rebick cartoon and then only to make sardonic comments. The Minister in charged denied funding Rebick when, in fact, the money trail was clear.

cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2005/05/27/catholic-pope050527.html

There is now a majority of Supreme Court justices who are Catholic. A Catholic was nominated as the Democratic presidential candidate just last year. Catholics are powerful and accepted in every walk of life. I don’t think they are truly persecuted.

I am also glad that Catholics don’t choose to use violence when they don’t like the way they are portrayed in a cartoon. I read very nasty comments about teachers on this board almost every day. I am not going to blow up your houses!!

Please keep things in perspective.

 

[m134e5]

bapcathluth:

A Catholic was nominated as the Democratic presidential candidate just last year. Catholics are powerful and accepted in every walk of life. I don’t think they are truly persecuted.

Catholics who take the Faith seriously are not.

 

[Libero]

You know, I cannot help but feel that these instances have been deliverately chosen.

When the pope was giving a speech to the European Council, and Mr Ian Paisley chose to start attacking him, many of the politicans responded in a very angry manner, throwing paper at him, some trying to remove him, Mr Paisley was eventually thrown out of the conference.

So let me get this straight—the EU goes out of it’s way not to include religion in it’s documents and basically wants GOD thrown out of the picture BUT YET now states that people need to not insult religion. I am sorry but I don’t buy it. It’s seems to me to be a contradiction…I feel like it’s the same thing over and over again…It’s okay to insult Christians but not others. Maybe it’s because we don’t get as violent…

Perhaps the EU appreciate exactly how insulting such actions against Islam are, this thread has been started without us realising how disgusting attacks against Catholics could be.

We are not persecuted - things could be a whole lot worse, trying to claim we are persecuted will only set us further away from religious solidarity, and thus world peace.

I have to say though, I would be very embaressed of the faith if Catholics started protesting shouting “Death to the west” etc. I was just glad that the news chose to show that not all Muslims felt that way.

 

[Franze]

The EU is with UN full of hipocrisy.

 

[Matt25]

Franze:

The EU is with UN full of hipocrisy.

Franze you and I and our fellow Europeans are the EU. It is a servant not a master.

Ditto the UN btw

 

[Ani_Ibi]

bapcathluth:

There is now a majority of Supreme Court justices who are Catholic.

In Canada?

bapcathluth:

A Catholic was nominated as the Democratic presidential candidate just last year.

Not in Canada.

bapcathluth:

Catholics are powerful and accepted in every walk of life. I don’t think they are truly persecuted.

Well perhaps the kind of persecution endured by Catholics in Canada is – as you say – not “true” persecution. Whatever other kind of persecution it is, it can’t be good.

bapcathluth:

I am also glad that Catholics don’t choose to use violence when they don’t like the way they are portrayed in a cartoon.

I am glad too. But, I tell you, the anti-Catholics got pretty rough last Spring when the Nazi-Pope cartoon was published. The publishing of the cartoon and the lack of censure emboldened them. I’m sure the person who got hit on the head with the can full of pop didn’t think freedom of expression was occurring in a non-violent way.

bapcathluth:

I read very nasty comments about teachers on this board almost every day. I am not going to blow up your houses!!

Point taken. I have not said I support the violent actions taken by the Islamic Street in response to the cartoon. Counselling murder, vandalizing neighbourhoods, burning down embassies is disproportionate to the insult received from the cartoon and it is harmful and wrong.

bapcathluth:

Please keep things in perspective.

I think keeping things in perspective is not allowing myself to buy into a false dichotomy. For me claiming that ridiculing Islam is wrong does not automatically mean that I support the violence perpetrated in response to that cartoon. Both ridicule and violence are harmful and wrong.

 

[Franze]

Matt25:

Franze you and I and our fellow Europeans are the EU. It is a servant not a master.

Ditto the UN btw

They don´t ask me anything, I voted no to the european constitution. Greetings

 

[Zerith]

Franze:

They don´t ask me anything, I voted no to the european constitution. Greetings

The only thing I’m going to disagree about European Citizens voting no to the EU constitution, is they voted no because they dislike Europe, not for what was on that paper.

The Dutch voted no because they disliked the EU, as they had to pay the most per capita to the EU.

I would have voted no, but that’s because God was not mentioned in the Constitution - Other parts I would have agreed with, others I still would not have.

Ireland, along with Spain, Italy and a few other countries expressed a wish that God be mentioned, mostly for historical reasons, but in Ireland, the Church still has that privilaged position.

 

[Matt25]

Franze:

They don´t ask me anything, I voted no to the european constitution. Greetings

I would have voted No myself. That doesn’t mean that I therefore want to abandon the Catholic project of an ever firmer union of Europeans bound by amity and friendship. Just because the EU is flawed doesn’t mean that it can’t be improved. Running away from the challenge in order to revert to a Europe of rival, warring camps is a counsel of despair.